So I've want to buy a $60K electric Kia...

[edyvw]

I think the issue with the ID.4(we were in line to buy one) is the fact that it's really devoid of any fun. It's very nice and certainly a comfortable choice for a VW owner. It's not a bad car in any respect but they completely avoided the fun angle at all costs. This is where the Tesla, Kia, and Ford Mach-E come into play. They have great driving dynamics and they really leaned into the fun part without compromising the rest of the car. This is not what backed us out of buying an ID.4. We just got tired of waiting. The ID.4 was to replace our Ford Edge that I was getting tired of dumping money into and after 4 months wait without being contacted for the second deposit we decided to look into the Model 3. We had an estimated delivery date within a week to start planning for and the car ended up arriving a month before first projected as latest delivery date. I'm very happy with the car too.

In the end we were very happy to be away from the SUV/Crossover types of vehicles. I really missed the dynamics of properly sorted cars and an F150 and Ford Edge were depressing to drive for me. What I really want is a GTI sized electric hatchback with serious power and real range(the e-Golf's failing) and not some pseudo small crossoverish thing. I'm sure Kia at this point is probably closest to this but I really don't like them. The one VW is proposing isn't even as fast as the Golf R which seems pointless and I'm curious to see the Tesla when it comes out. If it's too squished and cutesy in that Tesla way I'm out on that too. I fear the small Model Y look which to me whether it's in pictures or in person just seems offensively devoid of any appeal to a car guy in the looks department. I'll either keep driving my current GTI or buy a new Golf R at that point. I want the RS3 but I wish they kept the hatch for the US market. 5 cylinder turbo hatch would be perfect if I'm not going electric, hence why the RS3 hatch needs to return.

Yes, you go Mach E and get welded control arms.
There is much more to vehicle than 0-60. My grandma that died 15 years ago, could get out of grave and have fun 0-60.

 

[Torrid]

Yes, you go Mach E and get welded control arms.
There is much more to vehicle than 0-60. My grandma that died 15 years ago, could get out of grave and have fun 0-60.

That's why I want the electric setup in a GTI. I want the dynamics of that chassis with electric power. I didn't say the Mach-E is better than the ID.4, I just said they did a better job of selling it as fun by having a performance model. Then again I think VW is completely on the wrong path leaning so hard into crossovers and SUVs. I know that's better for the US market on sales but it's not what enthusiasts see the VW brand as being. I am happy that they still make the Jetta and there is a GLI and even though they've discontinued the standard Golf the GTI and Golf R are still here to stay for now.

I'm really not married to electric at this point. I love the Tesla. I love the GTI and until there's a proper full electric hatchback I'll keep with my GTI or eventually go Golf R. Like I said before the easy choice would be the RS3, but after thinking about it for awhile I just want a hatch. I get that there's more to performance than 0-60. I want a good chassis and driving dynamics, but I want stupid fast in a straight line too. 0-60 isn't everything, but it sells the cars. Everyone though assumes that chassis dynamics suck on electric cars, but I can tell you from experience the extremely low center of gravity more than makes up for some of the chassis dynamics, though the Model 3 is very good on its own. It's obviously a bit heavy and the GTI is more fun to drive but it's not like the Model 3 is far behind in chassis feel because of its center of gravity. This isn't the days of the muscle car that only have quarter mile times to quote and can't get around a corner to save its life. There aren't too many bad cars these days, just poorly marketed ones. We're arguing 0-60 times and appearance mostly for a reason. It's not that we don't care about driving dynamics, most of the ones that actually get mentioned are already there.

 

[Ws6]

Sure it does, with unknown degradation profiles and surprises around every corner it seems prudent to understand the long term characteristics of what you are dropping big money on.

just a few- examples....missing from the brochures of course.....

BMW's revealed a nasty surprise with multi stop throttling you dont discover right away - they are moving to the tesla cylindrical format. They didnt get it right at an even higher price point.

The Mach e/ lightning never delivered on their charging performance envelope and their GT version limits 5 seconds of throttle

The Uber expensive and awesome Taycan requires a battery storage envelope that is unmaintainable by many

The bolt has been a gong show.....

The EV6 has none of these issues. It's been out for about 2 years, now. Hyundai/Kia has other hybrids out for much longer. All are doing well on the electric side of the house.

 

[Ws6]

Tik Tok vehicle.

What does that even mean?

 

[Ws6]

Yes, you go Mach E and get welded control arms.
There is much more to vehicle than 0-60. My grandma that died 15 years ago, could get out of grave and have fun 0-60.

I found a video of them comparing a 911, M3P, and EV6 GT. I'd have to go hunt for it, and it's in a foreign language so all the commentary wasn't useful to me, and it was crazy long (1 hour +), but the long and short is it was a short track, and the 911 was managing laps around 1:58 once the driver got dialed in, while the GT was managing 1:59's. I was very impressed! I don't know what 911 model it was, but it wasn't a lame one as they tested it at 3.85s 0-60 in same video. Also, for those wondering, the M3P was doing 2:06 or so. They ran all 3 drag race style and the M3P and GT were neck and neck to about 60-70 and then the GT left it for dead.

I'd love to finally see 'Ring times for the GT! Sooner or later we have to have those...

 

[edyvw]

What does that even mean?

Vehicle whose purpose is to produce best 0-60 video on Tik Tok.

 

[edyvw]

I found a video of them comparing a 911, M3P, and EV6 GT. I'd have to go hunt for it, and it's in a foreign language so all the commentary wasn't useful to me, and it was crazy long (1 hour +), but the long and short is it was a short track, and the 911 was managing laps around 1:58 once the driver got dialed in, while the GT was managing 1:59's. I was very impressed! I don't know what 911 model it was, but it wasn't a lame one as they tested it at 3.85s 0-60 in same video. Also, for those wondering, the M3P was doing 2:06 or so. They ran all 3 drag race style and the M3P and GT were neck and neck to about 60-70 and then the GT left it for dead.

I'd love to finally see 'Ring times for the GT! Sooner or later we have to have those...

Yes, same quality, capability. I know, every time I am on track, it is filled with KIA’s,…..
.
.
.
.
.
at closest dealership.

 

[Ws6]

Vehicle whose purpose is to produce best 0-60 video on Tik Tok.

I like that, but I also like the adaptive suspension and 800v architecture. The structure rigidity and so forth is a nice bonus as is the tech.

 

[Ws6]

Yes, same quality, capability. I know, every time I am on track, it is filled with KIA’s,…..
.
.
.
.
.
at closest dealership.

 

[edyvw]

i am being serious, this looks like something designed for my 6yrs old.
KIA and track can’t go into same sentence.
6 out of 10 cars on track are BMW’s. 2/10 are Porsche and then rest. Only reason why 10/10 cars are not Porsche is bcs. people cannot afford them.
You can take Porsche 911 on track and spin it as long as it has gas in tank. Take KIA out and after 25min, something will fail.

 

[Mainia]

Instead, the gearbox fries its oil(ATF SP4).

I just can't wait to the see the zombie drone masses destroying their 0-60 in 3 seconds electric cars. And their teenage children.... extra crispy!


The headline achievement is the powertrain. Other dual-motor, all-wheel-drive EV6 models serve up 320 total horsepower; the GT, presumably after downing a can of spinach, is bursting with 576 horses. A new GT mode affords access to the entire thundering herd. Normal and Sport modes limit output to 460 horsepower, and Eco cuts it to 288. The full hit of torque, which has climbed from 446 pound-feet in the all-wheel-drive GT-Line to 545, is always available.

They forgot the valet and responsible parent mode with 150hp.

Valet mode should be 30 hp.

 

[Ws6]

i am being serious, this looks like something designed for my 6yrs old.
KIA and track can’t go into same sentence.
6 out of 10 cars on track are BMW’s. 2/10 are Porsche and then rest. Only reason why 10/10 cars are not Porsche is bcs. people cannot afford them.
You can take Porsche 911 on track and spin it as long as it has gas in tank. Take KIA out and after 25min, something will fail.

Funny. The engineer responsible for the ev6 gt suspension is the former head of BMWs M division suspension development.



That said, its an SUV, so its not exactly the very best track weapon. But it does turn the times.

 

[edyvw]

Funny. The engineer responsible for the ev6 gt suspension is the former head of BMWs M division suspension development.



That said, its an SUV, so its not exactly the very best track weapon. But it does turn the times.

Hyundai paid ridiculous sum of money for 2nd guy in M division and aome other engineers. They were in charge of G70/Stinger development.
Few engineers did change a lot, bcs. starting point wasn’t that high. They made Hyundai/KIA better but…
I have no doubt EV6 is decent car. But, emphasizing track is absolutely ridiculous. A lot of cars can do good time on track. Very few cars can do same time after 30min on track. And no, it is not suspension, it is absolutely everything! Suspension, chassis, brakes, engine, etc. etc.

And, I yet to see G70 or Stinger on track.

 

[Ws6]

Hyundai paid ridiculous sum of money for 2nd guy in M division and aome other engineers. They were in charge of G70/Stinger development.
Few engineers did change a lot, bcs. starting point wasn’t that high. They made Hyundai/KIA better but…
I have no doubt EV6 is decent car. But, emphasizing track is absolutely ridiculous. A lot of cars can do good time on track. Very few cars can do same time after 30min on track. And no, it is not suspension, it is absolutely everything! Suspension, chassis, brakes, engine, etc. etc.

And, I yet to see G70 or Stinger on track.

Its a track capable...Grand Tourer...

Which just happens to have 49/51 weight distribution, boatloads of power, and an adaptive suspension and traction settings. Its not meant for hotlaping VIR all day

 

[sk_pete]

Seriously: I can't wait for e-vehicle companies to outgrow the "exclusive toy" category and offer vehicles with more normal horsepower levels

Stelantis makes few in eu, 50 kwh 130hp. Starts 30keur.

 

[TheLawnRanger]

NASCAR will be a bunch of guys racing golf carts in five years.

 

[sk_pete]

Ev become expensive golf cart already. It's about dumping many electrons as possible in short time between motor, battery, charger. (and trying not to blow up) Where is excitement in that?

 

[edyvw]

Its a track capable...Grand Tourer...

Which just happens to have 49/51 weight distribution, boatloads of power, and an adaptive suspension and traction settings. Its not meant for hotlaping VIR all day

Every car is track capable. I have seen people in Impala coming to have fun.

 

[edyvw]

Ev become expensive golf cart already. It's about dumping many electrons as possible in short time between motor, battery, charger. (and trying not to blow up) Where is excitement in that?

Electrification allowed everyone to claim 0-60 in 3.5sec. And those YouTube people only talk about that. They review Toyota Sienna and talk 0-60, bcs. that is what is all about in minivans.
People lost interest in driving, enjoying driving itself. It is all about 0-60 and “owning” your neighbor.

 

[Ws6]

Electrification allowed everyone to claim 0-60 in 3.5sec. And those YouTube people only talk about that. They review Toyota Sienna and talk 0-60, bcs. that is what is all about in minivans.
People lost interest in driving, enjoying driving itself. It is all about 0-60 and “owning” your neighbor.

Ev6 is plenty engaging. 49/51 weight dist, rear biased power, good suspension. Find me another sub $100k SUV that can keep up with a new 911 on a short track.