Yes but you constantly refer to the .05% in fuel savings.
5w30 in a car spec for 0w16
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4WD
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Yes, it’s a conspiracy … just drove the Jeep and it does everything the same as my GM …
You have claimed less flow at both low and high RPM’s … In fact the ECM looks at a data set and decides what it needs and adjusts rapidly …
As for reasons … have already stated some besides MPG …
4WD
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Well, to your point folks come on here often to say my old truck got 15 mpg … but this one, wow … it more than adds up … it compounds ~
Constantly? ... think it was mentioned twice to get the point across that it's not much based on the reduction of the hydraulic pumping losses. The focus is variable volume oil pumps, nothing else associated with ICE efficiency. What's your point?
Fact remains that I haven't "mis-quoted" anything as you claimed about why variable volume oil pumps were invented, regardless of what you think the "other benifits" are. Post up one article that says their main goal isn't to reduce parasitic HP loss and increase fuel economy by a small fraction by cutting back oil flow. That's exactly what I've said, yet people want to twist things up and go off focus for whatever reason, lol. Just don't want to agree? ... or you don't believe that's why they were invented? If the latter, then exactly why do you think they were invented if it wasn't to save fuel? Haven't seen any links that say otherwise.
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Surely you remember the stuff going around on the increased PSI PF63E and all that … the memos made reference to “high flow lubrication requirements” … Why did they need that increase for 0W20 engines that run hotter than ever …
For these oil deprived motors ? Sure didn’t matter on all the old gens I owned and serviced …
Sorry you want to drag everything thing back to your single point of view … but these are complicated GDI engines with VVT … AFM … and ECM controlled pressure and oil cooling features … They produce volume/pressure on demand … less when not needed … and a surge of volume/pressure when needed …
have around 350k total on vehicles with these … no lube system issues … none used oil …
I‘m done here …
The GM TSB (not "memo") was because of the location of the oil pressure sensor and the possible surge of oil volume at a cold start-up that could happen (and cause the oil filter to bypass crud with thick cold oil, even with 0W-20) before the variable pump output volume could become controlled. I think you're misunderstanding the big picture on that one. Doesn't mean the engine needs more oil flow because the engine is "starved" or needs/has more oil flow because it uses 0W-20 oil. A regular old PD pump could do a fine job too, but at the cost of maybe a hair of lost fuel economy but with less complexity.
You have flow specs of the old pump vs new pump designs vs engine RPM to verify there was a big increase in flow with the new pump? And comparitive oil temperatures between the engines also showing more flow was needed when using 0W-20?
Yes, I have a single point of view/focus, and your claim that I've "mis-spoken" about why variable oil pumps exist is false. Every write-up about them says what I've said why they exist, so you might as well just call me a liar because that's how it came across when I read that comment, even though every article written (including SAE articles) say the main reason VVOPs exist is to save fuel. That's the focus, and the variable volume oil pump wasn't invented for any other reasons, regardless of how you might think it pertains to your specific engine. The bottom line is they are to help save a miniscule amount of fuel. Good that they work, but like I said more complicated than they're worth IMO, and could care less if anyone agrees or not.
Probably best at this point since you can't show any proof that VVOPs weren't invented to save fuel and instead for some other reasons. Agree to disagree as it's just going in circles now.
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Just to get some context here, is this the TSB?
Those are 3.0 and 3.6 liter V6 engines. The TSB I was talking about was for V8 engines where the oil filter bypass valve setting increased for the ressons I stated above.
The VVOP is so innovative that it's not even mentioned among the many things that are used to gain fuel economy.
US Department of Energy paper (PDF).
https://www.energy.gov/sites/default/files/2015/11/f27/QTR2015-8C-Internal-Combustion-Engines.pdf
Fuel-Saving Innovations: Features That Work and Some That Still Need Tweaking
Consumer Reports shares details on engine upgrades; transmission advances; and weight reduction, tire tweaks, and other fuel-saving innovations.
www.consumerreports.org
New Ways Carmakers Are Getting You More MPG - Consumer Reports
Consumer Reports highlights the fuel-saving tech that might be in your next car—and the potential trade-offs in your driving experience.
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The VVOP is so innovative that it's not even mentioned among the many things that are used to gain fuel economy.
US Department of Energy paper (PDF).
https://www.energy.gov/sites/default/files/2015/11/f27/QTR2015-8C-Internal-Combustion-Engines.pdf
Fuel-Saving Innovations: Features That Work and Some That Still Need Tweaking
Consumer Reports shares details on engine upgrades; transmission advances; and weight reduction, tire tweaks, and other fuel-saving innovations.www.consumerreports.org
New Ways Carmakers Are Getting You More MPG - Consumer Reports
Consumer Reports highlights the fuel-saving tech that might be in your next car—and the potential trade-offs in your driving experience.www.consumerreports.org
Well, that’s the government for ya.
Yeah, I'm sure they know nothing about ICE fuel efficiency technology.
My Lexus UX 250h has great balance. The AWD. The eCVT. The little electric motor at the rear axle.
Everything under sophisticated computer control.
A peppy 34 mpg with a lead foot on 87 octane, to, recently, 47 mpg with mild hypermiling on 91 octane. With F-Sport, it is truly a magic carpet ride.
They did - there was a TSB for that. Honda also did something similar.
Still regular until it moves to the Mazda-derived Dynamic Force engines. Probably with the 5th gen model but with CARB/OTC states as well as China going all in with xEVs, that’s to be seen.
Thank you.
After all of this reading, I think it is safe enough for 5w30 in the summer . after Toyota care is all done I will use the few jugs of 5w30 Pennzoil platinum, and mobile 5w30 EP, for the summer, and then I'll just stick with a 0w30 or 0w20 for 5k change intervals for the rest of the year.
I don't want any oil burning issues like other owners have had.
FWIW, the reason why Toyotas of the last decade or two tend to burn oil might be more design related than oil related. The oil burning the Camry/Corolla/Prius and some of their V6 models is documented on the ‘net. It’s a combination of not enough oil return holes in the pistons and low-tension rings - more so the former getting clogged. Toyota engines tend to run a little hot and hard on oil. Even with OCD, a Prius in the family started to drink oil. A piston soak greatly improved but didn’t completely eradicate the problem.
I ran a Lexus V8 for almost 300K on nothing more than 5W-30, which was considered “thin” in the late 1980s-early 1990s. Of course that car was designed during peak Toyota.
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