Salt

[JustinH]

When you move down south you trade rust for sun damaged headlights, clear coat issues, and anything rubber on the car turns to jello.

I've put more wipers on my car in Texas than any other place, not from use but from the sun killing it.

 

[Passport1]

No salt here in eastern NC. Might snow once a year at most even then no salt, just slip 'n slide on the road. When I see a vehicle with rust it almost always has northern state tags. Used to live near Chicago, couldn't wait to escape to the south. 36 years later, I'd never dream of returning there except to go to Wrigley field in the summer.

 

[doublebase]

When you move down south you trade rust for sun damaged headlights, clear coat issues, and anything rubber on the car turns to jello.

I've put more wipers on my car in Texas than any other place, not from use but from the sun killing it.

You have a point there. I was in Barbados a couple years ago and the taxi driver taking us to the airport was talking about his car. It was a Toyota camry and it had over 200,000 miles on it. He tells me that he has had the thing painted twice already and I’m like...twice!!?? Then I ask him how much for a paint job down in Barbados...and he says about $2,000. Then he tells me he usually gets 2-3 years out of a paint job because the sun just pounds it everyday.

 

[HowAboutThis]

Decades in MN. The 2000 model years and up would give about 15 years before bubbles. But at 20 pretty much falling apart. Moved to an area with little snow in the winter...biggest shock is seeing 25 year old cars look immaculate! I used to buy a new car when there were holes in the floorboard. Usually about 20 years. Now I might never need another car!

 

[simple_gifts]

Few people realize the "A" that Hester Prynne was forced to wear on her clothes in Nathaniel Hawthorne's 1850 novel, The Scarlet Letter, really stood for "All of us wished we lived in Biloxi"

 

[92saturnsl2]

I have done a lot of research on where to move to and my decision, at least of now is to remain in NY and see where the kids end up in professional life. I'm hoping they won't be too far and one of em wants to have a family in the home we have now. If so I'll take a basement room and we keep the home. I placed a NH avatar on my sig as I find Lincoln NH the retirement town for me. Tough decision between Lincoln NH and Northeast Kingdon VT (East Burke) but NH offers so much more.

I grew up in the Lyndonville area (near East Burke) and visit family there a couple times a year. Every summer when I go back there on vacation, between the gorgeous weather, quaintness, beautiful scenery and constant prodding by family to move back, it sure tempts me. But everytime I see these winter/salt pictures, my mind swings to the HELL NO side of the pendulum.

 

[jhs914]

Salt on roads in the U.S. must cause billions of dollars in damage to cars and trucks. As a Florida native I am going to ask what will probably be a stupid question to those of you who live up north, but instead of using all of that corrosive salt why not require studded tires, use more snow plows and sand? Now be kind to me because I have absolutely no experience driving in snow and ice, but this is a serious question.

 

[tbm5690]

Salt on roads in the U.S. must cause billions of dollars in damage to cars and trucks. As a Florida native I am going to ask what will probably be a stupid question to those of you who live up north, but instead of using all of that corrosive salt why not require studded tires, use more snow plows and sand? Now be kind to me because I have absolutely no experience driving in snow and ice, but this is a serious question.

That would make too much sense. Honestly, it's the general public's lack of winter driving ability...I think municipalities would get too many complaints of slick roads.

 

[simple_gifts]

Salt on roads in the U.S. must cause billions of dollars in damage to cars and trucks. As a Florida native I am going to ask what will probably be a stupid question to those of you who live up north, but instead of using all of that corrosive salt why not require studded tires, use more snow plows and sand? Now be kind to me because I have absolutely no experience driving in snow and ice, but this is a serious question.

You want a complete toolbox to keep roads clear. Studded tires for everyone and more sand just moves the damage elsewhere.

Plows don't squeegie the road clear, there is always a bit left over; you need salt to keep it from freezing; that being said, salt only works in a narrow range of temps

At What Temperature Does Rock Salt Stop Working? | Cargill

www.cargill.com

Around here they pretreat the roads with, i believe, magnesium chloride (or maybe calcium chloride) usually on overpasses prior to expected storms; it appears to be highly effective and actually more corrosive than sodium chloride

 

[Astro14]

Salt on roads in the U.S. must cause billions of dollars in damage to cars and trucks. As a Florida native I am going to ask what will probably be a stupid question to those of you who live up north, but instead of using all of that corrosive salt why not require studded tires, use more snow plows and sand? Now be kind to me because I have absolutely no experience driving in snow and ice, but this is a serious question.

The other consideration: salt cost is borne by governments. Tire costs are borne by individuals. There are people for whom a set of tires is a financial hardship.

In many countries, winter tires are mandated by law. In those countries, driving is a privilege. Here, the argument is one of burdensome cost to the individual, when we have people who consider driving a right.

I would prefer winter tires be mandated. You wouldn’t believe how many crashes I used to see in Vermont that were the fault of inadequate tires. All season tires on an $80,000 SUV + Overconfident driver = another $100 for the tow truck driver in Vermont...

 

[doublebase]

You want a complete toolbox to keep roads clear. Studded tires for everyone and more sand just moves the damage elsewhere.

Plows don't squeegie the road clear, there is always a bit left over; you need salt to keep it from freezing; that being said, salt only works in a narrow range of temps

At What Temperature Does Rock Salt Stop Working? | Cargill

www.cargill.com

Around here they pretreat the roads with, i believe, magnesium chloride (or maybe calcium chloride) usually on overpasses prior to expected storms; it appears to be highly effective and actually more corrosive than sodium chloride

That pretreatment does work good at eliminating those first couple inches of snow and keeping the highways/roads, kind of clear for a bit until the plows get out there.

 

[threeputtpar]

Fact tidbit of the day: The brine they use to pretreat the roads is the pickling juice waste from making pickles and/or sauerkraut. Big revenue stream for the company. I live in the area of the largest sauerkraut plant in the US, I believe. At lease that's what the family that owns it claims.

It's a unique smell when you drive past the plants, and I'm German. Even when they harvest the cabbage it can be smelled from miles away. The seagulls love it when they are actively harvesting.

 

[IcarusLSC]

They pretreat the roads around here with a salt brine then when it snows they add even more liquid stuff and hard stuff You can't win, you can taste the salt in the air some days!

 

[Kurtatron]

My answer to this problem: the winter beater. Keep the nice car off-road for the salt season. My 30 year old winter hibernater is absolutely spotless.

 

[Skippy722]

Salt on roads in the U.S. must cause billions of dollars in damage to cars and trucks. As a Florida native I am going to ask what will probably be a stupid question to those of you who live up north, but instead of using all of that corrosive salt why not require studded tires, use more snow plows and sand? Now be kind to me because I have absolutely no experience driving in snow and ice, but this is a serious question.

People consider driving a right, not a privilege. You then get the “but some people can’t afford it!” argument which honestly kind of terrifying, but also true.... add in some people have nowhere to store an extra set of tires like at an apartment or whatever and you end up with people running around on cheap worn out all seasons at worst.

In all honesty though, except for super rural areas, state/county/local governments are generally pretty good about getting roads plowed and salted/sanded... but people will still complain if there is but a single snowflake laying on the road. They’re dry to just wet 99% of the time. What we really need is far more rigorous drivers Ed programs with continuing education. Most people have no clue how to control a slide other than “stand on the brakes and pray.”

 

[svtrit]

I do not understand why people choose to live in that environment plus the states destroy you're cars by the time they are paid off. Here are 2 shots I just took. My 02 jeep and 87 f250

I spent 5 years in CA. Great environment for cars, but there is more to life than the longevity of my cars. Better quality of life in the Midwest is why I am now here.

 

[eljefino]

Salt on roads in the U.S. must cause billions of dollars in damage to cars and trucks. As a Florida native I am going to ask what will probably be a stupid question to those of you who live up north, but instead of using all of that corrosive salt why not require studded tires, use more snow plows and sand? Now be kind to me because I have absolutely no experience driving in snow and ice, but this is a serious question.

Cities don't like sand because it washes into the storm drains and clogs them up. So they us so much salt it's effective as grit before its melting power kicks in.

The country roads around here have all sorts of hills, poor crowns for drainage, melting snowbanks, frost heaves, potholes etc that all trap water and can cause localized black ice spots. Plus you get actual black ice, defined as condensation from exhaust pipes of idling cars at intersections. Imagine driving along at 40, feeling confident because it's been great for a few miles, then getting to an intersection and sliding right through.

Winter does more than freeze the surface, frost goes several feet into the ground and this affects incorrectly built roads. Only interstates really have the correct layers of aggregate to get below the frost line so they stay smooth and correctly crowned.

And, honestly, the money damage isn't that bad. An ordinary non-exciting car may last 15 years until it rusts out or 20 years until it wears out or becomes unfashionable/ unsafe/ obsolete. If I went down to NC and bought one of their 15 year old cars for $2500, I could get the last five years out of it up here for $500/year. Ten storms a winter, that's $50 a storm. If someone found me cursing all that ice on my commute and said they could make it disappear for $50, I'd go for it.

 

[SeaJay]

Apparently some rust appearing on a vehicle bothers some more than others. Modern cars will last a good 15 years or so in a rusty environment before they give up the ghost, even if they are no longer look like pristine garage queens of that vintage during the last years of their life.

 

[E365]

I live in Northern Minnesota and the idea of zero road salt sounds completely bonkers to me. Terrible idea. Every intersection, freeway and main road would turn into a skating rinks with all the compaction.

Even tiny residential streets get salt starting about 30’ before every cross street. Gives you just enough bare pavement for your tires to hook up if you start sliding.

There’s also a 12% grade road through town with about 750’ vertical. If that became pure ice, studded tires are still going to only help the most cautious of drivers (with AWD). Many people will (and do) still crash.

As for rust. So what - it’s just a car.

 

[JC1]

You have a point there. I was in Barbados a couple years ago and the taxi driver taking us to the airport was talking about his car. It was a Toyota camry and it had over 200,000 miles on it. He tells me that he has had the thing painted twice already and I’m like...twice!!?? Then I ask him how much for a paint job down in Barbados...and he says about $2,000. Then he tells me he usually gets 2-3 years out of a paint job because the sun just pounds it everyday.

He probably never waxed or protected the paint, just let's the sun destroy it. I wonder if a vehicle wrap would last longer in conditions that extreme.

I just used the hot water today and rinsed off the van. I at least like to get the salt and sand and dirt out of the rear wheel wells. Most people will go to a touchless car W
wash but those areas are almost impossible to get a 100 pct cleaned by a machine.