Conspiracy Theory : I believe modern GDI engines really only support the oil companies and auto makers ...The gas mileage isn't much better than the previous engine designs and most oil changes should be with synthetic at 4K ~ 5K miles with GDI engines . As your gas milage drops, at around 30K miles you can look forward to a dealer appointment for a powerful internal engine clean job that most people can't perform themselves . The only advantage I see is a GDI engine makes more horse power in a smaller volume package . With what appears to be more disadvantages than advantages with a GDI engine - where are the benefits for the consumer ? I believe GDI engines are not only more trouble than they are worth - I'll be curious if these '11 , '12 , '13 GDI engines reach 150K ~ 200K miles - what kind of shape will they be in ? Perhaps the best GDI engines are yet to come , however I will not be funding the auto makers research by buying the current crop of GDI engines they are putting out ! ...Your thoughts ?
Oil Companies & Auto Makers Must Love GDI Engines
- Thread starter ChrisD46
- Start date
- Status
- Joined
- Feb 28, 2010
- Messages
- 1,663
I see where your going but I think there are more reasons than that as for the reasons for DI motors. 1 diesel engine's are DI and they have no issues like this or do they? But that doesn't keep people from buying a diesel.
Yes there are disadvantages but not all manufactures have them. Cadillac and the V6 for one run clean as whistle from what I've read which makes me believe it's all in the design. HYundai has no issues that I've seen.
Yes they shear oil that is for sure. That is due to the high pressure fuel delivery.
Of note synthetics are not required at least it doesn't state that in my girlfriends hyundai manual.
Blame the EPA and all the tree huggers for this technology to get less emissions ha ha.
Jeff
Yes there are disadvantages but not all manufactures have them. Cadillac and the V6 for one run clean as whistle from what I've read which makes me believe it's all in the design. HYundai has no issues that I've seen.
Yes they shear oil that is for sure. That is due to the high pressure fuel delivery.
Of note synthetics are not required at least it doesn't state that in my girlfriends hyundai manual.
Blame the EPA and all the tree huggers for this technology to get less emissions ha ha.
Jeff
Last edited:
This is precisely the reason I traded my Mini Clubman S. Decarnon the head for $6-700 every 30-40K miles? No thanks.
They don't really support the oil companies because the gas mileage is marginally higher and 4 quarts of oil at 4k instead of 7.5k isn't much compared to the amount of oil it costs to make the fuel you will burn with the port injection engine.
The only reason they went with direct injection is gas mileage, which engineers will do anything to get the CAFE numbers higher even a single percent.
The only reason they went with direct injection is gas mileage, which engineers will do anything to get the CAFE numbers higher even a single percent.
Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
They don't really support the oil companies because the gas mileage is marginally higher and 4 quarts of oil at 4k instead of 7.5k isn't much compared to the amount of oil it costs to make the fuel you will burn with the port injection engine.
The only reason they went with direct injection is gas mileage, which engineers will do anything to get the CAFE numbers higher even a single percent.
and emissions.
They don't really support the oil companies because the gas mileage is marginally higher and 4 quarts of oil at 4k instead of 7.5k isn't much compared to the amount of oil it costs to make the fuel you will burn with the port injection engine.
The only reason they went with direct injection is gas mileage, which engineers will do anything to get the CAFE numbers higher even a single percent.
and emissions.
I think an inverse oiler will cure the valve deposit issues. Other than that the tech still needs to mature and all the kinks worked out. The consumer will of course foot the bill as the tech ages.
Carbon credits are a very valuable commodity that automakers will do anything they can to acquire them. I've read of them being sold from one oem to another.
Interesting how the system works.
Carbon credits are a very valuable commodity that automakers will do anything they can to acquire them. I've read of them being sold from one oem to another.
Interesting how the system works.
GM requires its semi syn dexos 1 at ~7,500 / 1 year. I think someone has been steering you wrong.
Originally Posted By: ChrisD46
oil changes should be with synthetic at 4K ~ 5K miles with GDI engines
The entire automotive industry still has most people convinced that they need to change their oil every 3000 miles anyway, even if they do use synthetic.
oil changes should be with synthetic at 4K ~ 5K miles with GDI engines
The entire automotive industry still has most people convinced that they need to change their oil every 3000 miles anyway, even if they do use synthetic.
Originally Posted By: KD0AXS
Originally Posted By: ChrisD46
oil changes should be with synthetic at 4K ~ 5K miles with GDI engines
The entire automotive industry still has most people convinced that they need to change their oil every 3000 miles anyway, even if they do use synthetic.
My boss and just about everybody else included. lol
edit: I'm still not convinced DI is gonna work for most in terms of lack of maintenance. Maybe it's to make people think harder about the toaster they drive.....
Originally Posted By: ChrisD46
oil changes should be with synthetic at 4K ~ 5K miles with GDI engines
The entire automotive industry still has most people convinced that they need to change their oil every 3000 miles anyway, even if they do use synthetic.
My boss and just about everybody else included. lol
edit: I'm still not convinced DI is gonna work for most in terms of lack of maintenance. Maybe it's to make people think harder about the toaster they drive.....
Last edited:
I can speak from experience since I drive a GDI vehicle. First of all in my case there is no fuel economy. It is rated 35 highway and the best I have gotten on a 100% highway trip with the cruise on is 25 MPG. Now I am sure someone is going to get upset and say it is my driving style or the local terrain but it is pretty much flat here, never have a downshift on the highway. I also have a Saturn Ion which is rated 29 highway and I regularly get close to 40 MPG with it so I would say the driving around here is pretty easy on the car. I am not sure how I feel about the GDI setup because first of all it is noisy, the oil needs to be changed more often because of the fuel in it. Luckily I am not required to use synthetic oil and dump it out every 3,750 miles. If I was to buy another car I think I would avoid the GDI at this point because I was able to get much better fuel economy out of the Ford 500 I had before this with a 3.0 v6 and CVT transmission. I had no trouble getting just under 30 MPG in mixed driving and 33-34 on a long trip. Can't complain about that in a car that was HUGE inside and drove really well. I just think it is sad that we are supposed to be moving ahead with " New Technology " when the reality of it is that we seem to be moving backwards to the problems we had with carbureted cars like my 87 Caprice, and even that car doesn't dump that much fuel into the oil. And sadly even with a v8 I am able to easily squeeze out more MPG than the new car with GDI and a 4 cylinder.
Originally Posted By: ChrisD46
Conspiracy Theory : I believe modern GDI engines really only support the oil companies and auto makers
GDI supports Obama's new CAFE regulations, which are promulgated by the EPA. The new regs began to be phased in starting 2011, with final compliance required by 2025.
http://www.motortrend.com/features/auto_news/2011/1109_obamas_epa_seeks_56_mpg_by_2025/
Automakers hate these regulations, and have applied for delays in implementation dates in order to more easily comply with the regulations. Originally the Obama administration said no, but have since backed off a little, apparently realizing that their original mandates were not technically achievable.
http://www.dailytech.com/House+Passes+35+MPG+CAFE+Standard+for+2020/article9946.htm
Expect engines to become even more complex, even more expensive, and even more difficult to repair, as regulations toughen.
Conspiracy Theory : I believe modern GDI engines really only support the oil companies and auto makers
GDI supports Obama's new CAFE regulations, which are promulgated by the EPA. The new regs began to be phased in starting 2011, with final compliance required by 2025.
http://www.motortrend.com/features/auto_news/2011/1109_obamas_epa_seeks_56_mpg_by_2025/
Automakers hate these regulations, and have applied for delays in implementation dates in order to more easily comply with the regulations. Originally the Obama administration said no, but have since backed off a little, apparently realizing that their original mandates were not technically achievable.
http://www.dailytech.com/House+Passes+35+MPG+CAFE+Standard+for+2020/article9946.htm
Expect engines to become even more complex, even more expensive, and even more difficult to repair, as regulations toughen.
Originally Posted By: 71Chevyguy
I can speak from experience since I drive a GDI vehicle. First of all in my case there is no fuel economy.
It's like the switch from 10W-30 all the way down to 0W-20: You as a consumer will notice no change at all in fuel economy, and you're not meant to notice anything.
GDI, 0W-20, and other seemingly-useless artifacts are intended to raise automaker CAFE scores in the EPA's mileage drive-cycle and nothing else. CAFE-applicable gains are not noticeable to the consumer in daily driving.
You as a consumer are a meaningless cipher in the war between the feds and the automakers.
I can speak from experience since I drive a GDI vehicle. First of all in my case there is no fuel economy.
It's like the switch from 10W-30 all the way down to 0W-20: You as a consumer will notice no change at all in fuel economy, and you're not meant to notice anything.
GDI, 0W-20, and other seemingly-useless artifacts are intended to raise automaker CAFE scores in the EPA's mileage drive-cycle and nothing else. CAFE-applicable gains are not noticeable to the consumer in daily driving.
You as a consumer are a meaningless cipher in the war between the feds and the automakers.
*shrugs* I don't see it with mine. I'm on my way to 10k OCIs and at almost 30k on the clock, my MPGs are still well over EPA estimates with no degradation that I can measure.
These GDI engines require a little more attention, but that is about it as far as I can tell.
These GDI engines require a little more attention, but that is about it as far as I can tell.
Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
The only reason they went with direct injection is gas mileage, which engineers will do anything to get the CAFE numbers higher even a single percent.
Yet the simple idea of making lighter cars to increase mpg somehow has escaped them.
The only reason they went with direct injection is gas mileage, which engineers will do anything to get the CAFE numbers higher even a single percent.
Yet the simple idea of making lighter cars to increase mpg somehow has escaped them.
Originally Posted By: badtlc
*shrugs* I don't see it with mine. I'm on my way to 10k OCIs and at almost 30k on the clock, my MPGs are still well over EPA estimates with no degradation that I can measure.
These GDI engines require a little more attention, but that is about it as far as I can tell.
I average @27 mpg overall in my 2.3 liter GDI turbo Mazdaspeed 3; I really can't complain considering that the motor pumps out @287 bhp(I installed a Mazdaspeed CAI). My UOAs indicate that a 10,000 mile OCI is possible using M1 5W-30. I am a bit conservative so I stick with a 7,500 mile OCI, which has served me well for over 127,000 miles.
*shrugs* I don't see it with mine. I'm on my way to 10k OCIs and at almost 30k on the clock, my MPGs are still well over EPA estimates with no degradation that I can measure.
These GDI engines require a little more attention, but that is about it as far as I can tell.
I average @27 mpg overall in my 2.3 liter GDI turbo Mazdaspeed 3; I really can't complain considering that the motor pumps out @287 bhp(I installed a Mazdaspeed CAI). My UOAs indicate that a 10,000 mile OCI is possible using M1 5W-30. I am a bit conservative so I stick with a 7,500 mile OCI, which has served me well for over 127,000 miles.
Speaking of DI engines and soot; here is an article that indicates that DI alone may be an issue with particulate emmisions. We may end up with "Hybrid" port and DI systems, perhaps like what Toyota, and possibly others are doing now.
http://wardsauto.com/vehicles-amp-technology/chrysler-v-6-shines-both-cars-and-trucks
http://wardsauto.com/vehicles-amp-technology/chrysler-v-6-shines-both-cars-and-trucks
It is a technology I hope to avoid for a few more years, its just not there yet IMO. When threads like this stop popping up on a regular basis maybe then I'd consider buying it. At that time I'll probably have no other choices if I want to buy a new vehicle.
- Status
Similar threads
