MOBIL1 0W-40 vs. CASTROL EDGE 0W-40

[BMWTurboDzl]

Originally Posted By: Ibrahim
Would any "Distributor" of Castrol products or a "BMW Dealership" be able to special order this oil?

Castrol 0W-40
Product Code: 465321-DE01
PDS: http://castrol.com/liveassets/bp_interne...onalLongtec.pdf
SDS: http://datasheets.bp.com/ussds/amersdsf.nsf/0/AFED30D0E949E408862577B000686933/$file/112365Castrol%20SLX%20Professional%20Longtec%200W-40.pdf


I tried a few years ago. The BMW dealerships in NA don't have a part number fo r it and neither do Castrol reps. Castrol probably doesn't want to offer it in the US for marketing reasons.

 

[OVERKILL]

Well, since Castrol was so (un)helpful in my quest to obtain this product, I figured I'd reward them with buying two more cases of M1 0w40

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Well, since Castrol was so (un)helpful in my quest to obtain this product, I figured I'd reward them with buying two more cases of M1 0w40

I will never understand why Castrol does not have top-notch product in 40 weight like GC!
Also, GC is great, but I think they need to update that oil. In EU they are selling 0W30 with LL-04 specification.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Well, since Castrol was so (un)helpful in my quest to obtain this product, I figured I'd reward them with buying two more cases of M1 0w40

I will never understand why Castrol does not have top-notch product in 40 weight like GC!
Also, GC is great, but I think they need to update that oil. In EU they are selling 0W30 with LL-04 specification.
No retail market for LL04 in US. EPA hasn't required low sulphur gas so BMW won't spec for LL04.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Well, the LL04 is required for BMW's diesel engines in the US, but yeah, that market in the US is tiny.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted By: BMWTurboDzl
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Well, since Castrol was so (un)helpful in my quest to obtain this product, I figured I'd reward them with buying two more cases of M1 0w40

I will never understand why Castrol does not have top-notch product in 40 weight like GC!
Also, GC is great, but I think they need to update that oil. In EU they are selling 0W30 with LL-04 specification.
No retail market for LL04 in US. EPA hasn't required low sulphur gas so BMW won't spec for LL04.

Yeah this is true, eventually EPA will probably demand low sulfur gas.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: BMWTurboDzl
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Well, since Castrol was so (un)helpful in my quest to obtain this product, I figured I'd reward them with buying two more cases of M1 0w40

I will never understand why Castrol does not have top-notch product in 40 weight like GC!
Also, GC is great, but I think they need to update that oil. In EU they are selling 0W30 with LL-04 specification.
No retail market for LL04 in US. EPA hasn't required low sulphur gas so BMW won't spec for LL04.

Yeah this is true, eventually EPA will probably demand low sulfur gas.
perhaps ...I've always felt that the Administration has married itself to EV and hybrids so they figure little to gain by mandating ULSG. That may change though.

 

[phlfly]

Why in the world just use Mobil 1 5W-30 and replaced it each 5,000- 7,000 miles. Euro spec is [censored] due none of oils survive 15,000 miles. People have problems with valve guides, valve seals, carbon builds up, gaskets leaking, oil separator fails, catalytic converts is done at 100K miles, cooling system fails and ect. Just read BMW/Audi/Benz sites.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: phlfly
Why in the world just use Mobil 1 5W-30 and replaced it each 5,000- 7,000 miles. Euro spec is [censored] due none of oils survive 15,000 miles. People have problems with valve guides, valve seals, carbon builds up, gaskets leaking, oil separator fails, catalytic converts is done at 100K miles, cooling system fails and ect. Just read BMW/Audi/Benz sites.

Actually, there have been UOAs of oils surviving just fine out to 15k miles.

Also, the "Euro spec" is about quite a lot more than OCI length. You can't always compensate for using the wrong oil by just changing it more frequently.

As has been explained to you, Mobil 1 5w-30's HTHS viscosity is too low for these cars. 3.5 is the minimum spec, and Mobil 1 5w-30 is specifically designed to be under that number. If the HTHS viscosity is too low for the engine, it doesn't matter if you change it every 15,000 miles or every 15 minutes; it won't provide adequate protection.

 

[phlfly]

But I read (on this website back one year ago)this number drops from 3.8 to 3.2 in very fast (I think something like less couple thousand miles), and stabilize at this viscosity, so it's myth.
Well, the leaking gaskets and failed oil separators on Germans cars is because only this cars are using LL01 oil.
I'm not sure what are you talking about?

 

[d00df00d]

Mobil 1 0w-40's HTHS viscosity drops from 3.8 to 3.2? Hogwash.

As for those gaskets and oil separators, how on earth do you know the failures are oil related?

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: phlfly
But I read (on this website back one year ago)this number drops from 3.8 to 3.2 in very fast (I think something like less couple thousand miles), and stabilize at this viscosity, so it's myth.
Well, the leaking gaskets and failed oil separators on Germans cars is because only this cars are using LL01 oil.
I'm not sure what are you talking about?


Who on this site paid to have the HTHS tested on used oil? It is not part of ANY UOA I've EVER seen posted here and certainly not something offered by the "regulars" that perform the ones that we use here.

The SM version of M1 0w40 is known to shear (in SOME applications.. and then thicken back up) in use, but that doesn't mean that the HTHS was suddenly reduced.

Also, the old version of M1 0w40 had an HTHS of 3.6 (the SM version), the new version, which doesn't shear, has the HTHS of 3.8.

Also, I responded to your gasket claims in the other thread. It isn't the oil, it is poor gasket material choice.

 

[phlfly]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Mobil 1 0w-40's HTHS viscosity drops from 3.8 to 3.2? Hogwash.

As for those gaskets and oil separators, how on earth do you know the failures are oil related?


Well it's some how seen by mech, when they asked people to replace oil every 5000-7000 miles, those people who did follow it and problem went away (E46, E39)

Interesting link http://castroledge.de/motorenole/0w-40-a3/b4

Castrol LL01 is 0W-40 only apparently, even I was wrong I thought it's 0W-30 I guess they did changed again. So I will stay away from US sold Castrol. We don't even know what is inside there. Because LL04 is not good for US since we have ethanol added.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted By: phlfly
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Mobil 1 0w-40's HTHS viscosity drops from 3.8 to 3.2? Hogwash.

As for those gaskets and oil separators, how on earth do you know the failures are oil related?


Well it's some how seen by mech, when they asked people to replace oil every 5000-7000 miles, those people who did follow it and problem went away (E46, E39)

Interesting link http://castroledge.de/motorenole/0w-40-a3/b4

Castrol LL01 is 0W-40 only apparently, even I was wrong I thought it's 0W-30 I guess they did changed again. So I will stay away from US sold Castrol. We don't even know what is inside there. Because LL04 is not good for US since we have ethanol added.


You know what is in Castrol OW30. Just go to German web site and you will see

 

[phlfly]

Did you click on my link? it's German website.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted By: phlfly
Did you click on my link? it's German website.


Yeah, but I do not understand what is your point?
In EU you have many synthetic castrols. OW40, 5W40, 0W30, etc, in several variants.
You have 0W30 in LL-01 and LL-04!!!
The 0W30 LL-01 you can buy in Germany as well as in the U.S. only difference is packing!
Now how I know that? Well in August I was in Europe like I am every few months, drive two cars in family overthere (Skoda Octavia 1.9tdi and BMW 525xd) and I know that Castrol 0W30 LL-01 the same one that you can buy here, is readily available in stores!
The reason is that some European countries still have gas that has high sulfur in gas and diesels.
Now is it possible that they phase out overthere 0W30 LL-01? Yeah, but that does not mean that they will not produce LL-01 for the U.S. market.
Here is that oil for Russian market that generally have very dirty gas and diesel in many parts of the country:
http://www.castrol.com.ru/castrol/edge_sae30.php
Eventually even in the U.S. EPA will have to demand lower sulfur so we gonna get probably updated 0W30.

 

[phlfly]

My point is you are driving everyday at normal condition 25-70 mph at ~2,000 rmp, so engine oil temp (not water temp) is about 100C only, so viscosity LL01 at 100 C - 12.2 and Mobil 1 5W-30 at 100 C - 11.0. Myy opinion is very small difference that doen't make any play at all.
But in the sport racing is making a difference.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: phlfly
My point is you are driving everyday at normal condition 25-70 mph at ~2,000 rmp, so engine oil temp (not water temp) is about 100C only, so viscosity LL01 at 100 C - 12.2 and Mobil 1 5W-30 at 100 C - 11.0. Myy opinion is very small difference that doen't make any play at all.
But in the sport racing is making a difference.


Kinematic viscosity isn't the issue, it is HTHS. This is how the oil behaves in the bearings and is a far more important factor.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted By: phlfly
My point is you are driving everyday at normal condition 25-70 mph at ~2,000 rmp, so engine oil temp (not water temp) is about 100C only, so viscosity LL01 at 100 C - 12.2 and Mobil 1 5W-30 at 100 C - 11.0. Myy opinion is very small difference that doen't make any play at all.
But in the sport racing is making a difference.


Engine temp is 100c? Coolant temp is 92c, temp inside the engine is much higher, much higher!!!!
But honestly, why you came here to ask any question if you know everything?
Also, I think you should get a job with BMW or who ever, to explain them some stuff.
BMW says that IN THE U.S. YOU SHOULD USE LL-01!!!! THERE IS A F.....G REASON FOR THAT OBVIOUSLY!!!!
Also, coming from Europe, it is not like people over there drive always 120mph! They drive 50-75 mph most of the time.

 

[phlfly]

yes I agreed it's important of course but viscosity is resistance of flow, so high HTHS is produced high resistance to flow, so it's lead small volume of oil so it turns out the heat is not dissipating fast enough to the oil, so metal is getting heat spots.
Studies showed that double viscosity grade will cause as much 20C rise in oil temp. So the shear thinning can be good and bad , as I mentioned before, but I think Germans recommended high number HTHS due they are looking for 15,000 miles and still be in 3.0, so thier LL01 is more 3.5, when Mobil 1 is 3.2. But if you are not driving 15,000 miles on this oil, Mobil 1 should satisfied your engine for 5,000 miles, since LL01 will degradation as low 2.8-3.0 for 15,000 and you will drive at least 5,000 to 7,000 miles on oil that HTHS is about 3.0 anyway.

Well this very interesting read. (http://books.google.com/books?id=XjTaOqE...ity&f=false)
Somewhere there said 40 grade loses degrading more than 30 grade oil due more concentration VI improver required more to produce -40 oils. So I guess high HTHS has same tendency due same problem as -40 oils.