Both of them run F1 , Moto GP ,Rally , NHRA , etc. I wouldn't worry about either one's "science". There's no doubt Castrol and Mobil are master blenders. I'd sleep well at night ,with either one in the sump.
M1 FS 0W40 vs. Castrol Edge 0W40
- Thread starter VQAndrew
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Quality wise they are total equals in my mind. but the decision is easy Mobil 1 EP $26.47 Castrol $28.94.
Always nice to meet a kindred spirit.
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Johnny, I don't think EP comes in 0w40.
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You don't infer that you looked at both oils though.
I think you're right. so I use regular 0W-40 when it drops again, they have it at $29.97 now I'll leave them both on the shelf and go with QSFS Euro!
I'm not 100% sure the Castrol Edge 0W-40 we have in Europe is the same as the one in the US, but it used to be labeled as Vollsyntetisch in Germany and now it isn't, meaning before it was mostly PAO and now it's presumably mostly Group 3 with some PAO but not majoritt like before, it still has the same specs i believe , and kt definitely still is a very good oil but clearly Castrol has "cheapened" it.
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What does 'looked at it in the lab' entail, exactly?
What do you estimate the VM loading to be in this product and what polymer is the VM? A sytrene likely Infinium V500?
I am attempting to correlate @Gohkan HTFS chart with a high specification lubricant with a suspected high VM load.
Sorry in advance for pointed questions. My only dog in the fight is my personal transportation where I have been moving to a more stable lubricant for my D.I Ford application tying to stay within the ILSAC GF-6A Cert. Then there is just the curiosity and learning factor.
Thank you
- Ken
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I looked at the shear stability, oxidation stability, wear, and everything on J300, we have all of those instruments in our lab. The FS 0w40 is a solid product as I said. If you are comfortable with the SAPS level it’s probably the best value out there.
I did not make any attempt to figure out how they formulate. That does not matter to me. I was only looking at the end results. To me what it does is more important than what it is.
David
I did not make any attempt to figure out how they formulate. That does not matter to me. I was only looking at the end results. To me what it does is more important than what it is.
David
Likely the SV series if from infineum, but we can't be sure. Aren't xom known in the industry for their "ability" to tweak some packages and get their product approved by the oems? @Foxtrot08 pointed out in some thread that they don't rely exclusively on infineum. Maybe at some point they tweaked some "Inbrizol/Inbriztonite" pack, and i bet that they do have some pretty good connection with vanderbilt, basf, lanxess, akzo or evonik. Why would they do that? Maybe because they just can. How did they get the approval? Maybe they had or have some mb/vw/porsche engines lying around in their lab
That has NOT been my experience with my '12 Kia Turbo Optima. My UOA on M1 FS 0W-40 (I had run the prior M1 0W-40 oil for a couple of years) would oxidize badly and break down significantly (this engine also has high fuel dilution) in less than 4K miles. I switched to Castrol Edge 0W-40 oil and have run it ever since. My UOA for it showed no significant oxidation of the oil (even in the presence of the high fuel dilution issue) and not much loss of viscosity. As a result, I'm a firm believer in Castrol Edge 0W-40. I also run Fram Ultra XG9688 filters and stick to 93 octane Top Tier fuel (I am tuned) and an OCI of 4K miles. Daily driver. My UOA was with both BlackStone and Oil Analyzer's (Amsoil guys) labs.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Did you do a VOA to gauge virgin oxidation? IIRC, it's reasonably high due to ester content. How were you determining breakdown?
The Viscosity reduction from virgin stated levels (12.9 cSt) to what the lab reported is how I judged the oil getting sheared down.
As for oxidation levels, my last two M1 FS 0W-40 runs were at 34 and 33 abs/cm (flagged as "Critical") while my Castrol Edge 0W-40 was 11 abs/cm (flagged as "Normal"). This was all with ~4K miles on the oils. I judge the oxidation issue as the biggest factor for me. YMMV.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
And how much fuel was in the sample? Typically, the biggest driver in viscosity loss is fuel dilution.
That sounds pretty normal for that oil. My oxidation with it in my M5 was 39, the Ravenol in my SRT was 27, I expect my HPL to come back at least as high as the Mobil, but probably higher, due to the higher ester content.
Last VOA we have of M1 0W-40 with oxidation had virgin at 25:
Mobil 1 0w40 Euro
Sorry, I’ve been meaning to post this for about a month. Put this in a 19’ Atlas 3.6 EA390 CDVC VR6. Cheers!
bobistheoilguy.com
Once you factor that in, it didn't oxidize any more than the Castrol product did, in fact, it oxidized less (in absolute terms, assuming the Castrol product VOA'd at 0).
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Fuel dilution was over 5% on all samples (except Blackstone that doesn't measure this correctly), but it was high according to their analysis.
Thus, the very high fuel dilution of my engine didn't affect the Castrol Edge nearly as much as the M1 oil.
As to oxidation, the numbers I stated were flagged as critical so that can't be "normal". Compare that to what I had for Castrol Edge and the difference is massive.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
I'd be curious to see a percentage-based analysis of this, just because both oils have to pass the same stay-in-grade requirements. Castrol ended up at 11.9cSt in my 6.4L while Ravenol SSL ended up at 12.0cSt for example, both with less than 1% fuel.
Different vehicle, but the Mobil product was at 11.24cSt with 5% fuel in my M5.
No comments on my oxidation stuff? I ask because you said that was your biggest concern.
I would choose Castrol 0W-40 A3/B4 over Mobil 1 FS 0W-40 A3/B4 over principle because Mobil 1 still hasn't updated to API SP with a modern mixed calcium–magnesium detergent. I think Mobil 1 might have given up on the European market and no longer care about the performance of their European oils.
0w oils also generally have higher volatility which is a negative for GDI without PFI to wash the valves off.
OP, if you buy a 5 gal bucket of HPL that gets you 2 oil changes for about $90 each, which may ease your concerns and certainly cover any performance questions you would have about the oil’s capabilities. Out of the two choices you have, even though I’m not a huge M1 fan, it’s hard to top their track record, as others have stated.
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