Kreen cleaning sneak peek - 1st dose - 800 miles

[KCJeep]

Originally Posted By: LeakySeals


T6 HDEO over-rated, not the magic cleaner people claim it is. Average. Made the engine really smooth and quiet though! maybe the quietest oil I've ever used. M1 High Mileage BOOM. Thats the one. Varnish on dipstick gone in a few thousand. Cleaned what M1 and PP could not (over the course of a 7k OCI). Filthy black oil for several OCIs. PU is next up. The 08 GP has a varnished dipstick, varnish under the filler. PP cleaned a little, but its still there. We will see if PU has high levels of cleaners or not. So for me, M1 HM is the bar for cleaning with just oil. If PU can match it, will know in the spring.


Thanks for posting. I've found cleaning with oil alone very frustrating as well, and like you did not find HDEO's to appear to do any more than any other PCMO. I actually seemed to get better cleaning with PYB over Rotella. Castrol HM has done the best job for me so far though.

 

[electrolover]

I dont think you can put too much stock in varnish removal from a dipstick. My reason is personal experience.

I had an old nissan that had a very dark dipstick. I ran many conventional oils but one did make a difference on the stick. It was GTX HM. The varnish actually wipped off the first time I checked the oil. I thought this meant it was a powerful cleaner but when I changed the valvecover a few months later I found a very dirty engine.. my point is that dipsticks get wiped off and internals do not. So its not the best point of reference on what is happening inside the engine.

Just my two cents...

 

[KCJeep]

Interesting you saw a visible difference with Castrol HM, so have I. But I don't think any oil, or power cleaner for that matter, is going to do that much cleaning in a few months. Slow and steady is the way to go.

While Castrol HM seems to be doing more for me than anything else I've tried, it's still cruddy through the fill hole cap. It takes a long time to clean with oil IMO.

The Castrol HM did clear and reveal some bright shiny spots in one of our old Chevy's during a single OCI though, that was a first.

 

[LeakySeals]

Your situation was different than mine. Maybe you were in the early stages, why you were able to wipe it off. No wiping off my sticks. Its on there good. Both of them. Nothing dark, just varnish. One day I checked the oil and poof, gone. oil was M1 HM as discussed in prior post. Sorry for saying this but Castrol conventional, even the syntec semi causes varnish, doesn't remove it in my experiences. I no longer use their oil, what I'm cleaning up after now.

I think the varnished dipstick tells a lot about the oils ability to clean. Here's why. The engine surface and internals get a constant flow of oil, unlike the area of the dipstick I had/have varnish on. Way up high, completely out of the oil in a small tube. No flow, no oil at all. Only cleaning going on was vapors. I didn't wipe it off, can't wipe it off. There is far more varnish on the engine surface, so it makes sense there is some left on the engine after its gone from the stick. But that has nothing to do with the reliability of using a dipstick as an indicator that a oil or an additive is cleaning. Its there, or its gone.

 

[LeakySeals]

Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
Sorry for saying this but Castrol conventional, even the syntec semi causes varnish, doesn't remove it in my experiences. I no longer use their oil, what I'm cleaning up after now.

Not fair. If you run 3k OCI's, change your oil on time, don't abuse the engine, all oils are ok. Extend oil changes, don't change the oil on time, hot or sever conditions, all oils are NOT ok. Weaker oils break down leaving sludge, varnish, etc.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
Sorry for saying this but Castrol conventional, even the syntec semi causes varnish, doesn't remove it in my experiences. I no longer use their oil, what I'm cleaning up after now.

Not fair. If you run 3k OCI's, change your oil on time, don't abuse the engine, all oils are ok. Extend oil changes, don't change the oil on time, hot or sever conditions, all oils are NOT ok. Weaker oils break down leaving sludge, varnish, etc.


I thought so too, until this car was given to me from my father. Not all oils can keep every engine clean under all conditions unfortunately, these pictures prove it.

These are shots from a 2000 Century which had 84,655 miles when I got it. It was dealer serviced up until 18,325 miles then Avis Lube serviced, and a local shop serviced it for my dad. It got 3,000 mile Dino oil changes, some were a hair under 3K some a little over, no OCI exceeded 3,500 miles. My father is in his 80's and there is no telling him to run the oil any longer. It got Mobil, Kendall, or Pennzoil products, and a no frills filter. I have every invoice for service since day 1, he was the original owner. This is severe service Long Island NY use.

This what it looked like when I started.

So much for dino keeping an engine varnish free. There was no sludge visible, just heavy varnish. No coolant is being lost.







This was after I added Kreen and drove about 60 miles. I have a thread about it here. http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2753367&page=1

 

[LeakySeals]

For the past 30 years whenever I had sludge, varnish or ticking I always reached for the MMO. Never let me down. Starting to wonder if I should go back to it..

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
For the past 30 years whenever I had sludge, varnish or ticking I always reached for the MMO. Never let me down. Starting to wonder if I should go back to it..


Nothing wrong with that idea!

 

[electrolover]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
For the past 30 years whenever I had sludge, varnish or ticking I always reached for the MMO. Never let me down. Starting to wonder if I should go back to it..


Nothing wrong with that idea!

I like to add a pint once a year in winter. Nothing wrong with a little maintenance

 

[Vikas]

Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
Sorry for saying this but Castrol conventional, even the syntec semi causes varnish, doesn't remove it in my experiences. I no longer use their oil, what I'm cleaning up after now.

Not fair. If you run 3k OCI's, change your oil on time, don't abuse the engine, all oils are ok. Extend oil changes, don't change the oil on time, hot or sever conditions, all oils are NOT ok. Weaker oils break down leaving sludge, varnish, etc.


When one starts arguing with oneself on a public forum ...

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: electrolover
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
For the past 30 years whenever I had sludge, varnish or ticking I always reached for the MMO. Never let me down. Starting to wonder if I should go back to it..


Nothing wrong with that idea!

I like to add a pint once a year in winter. Nothing wrong with a little maintenance


Most of my cleaning maintenance is/was done during the winter. The MMO thins the oil slightly and that was always a plus IMO during the winter. Cold starts are much easier, and you're cleaning up the engine, a win, win situation in my book.

 

[LeakySeals]

Originally Posted By: Vikas
Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
Sorry for saying this but Castrol conventional, even the syntec semi causes varnish, doesn't remove it in my experiences. I no longer use their oil, what I'm cleaning up after now.

Not fair. If you run 3k OCI's, change your oil on time, don't abuse the engine, all oils are ok. Extend oil changes, don't change the oil on time, hot or sever conditions, all oils are NOT ok. Weaker oils break down leaving sludge, varnish, etc.


When one starts arguing with oneself on a public forum ...
they

 

[Phishin]

My truck engine was NASTY when I bough it. Hard crusy black crud everywhere.

I manually cleaned the valve train/under the valve covers.

MMO continues to clean her out. I put a quart of MMO in the 5 quart sump. The truck burns out, so I usually wait until it's a quart low, add a quart of 20w50 or something similar, and when a quart low again, I add a quart of MMO to offset the thinning effect.

The engine gets at least 1 and usually two quart of MMO per OCI at the end. The engine continues to puke out black oil. Probably always will.

 

[electrolover]

Originally Posted By: Phishin
My truck engine was NASTY when I bough it. Hard crusy black crud everywhere.

I manually cleaned the valve train/under the valve covers.

MMO continues to clean her out. I put a quart of MMO in the 5 quart sump. The truck burns out, so I usually wait until it's a quart low, add a quart of 20w50 or something similar, and when a quart low again, I add a quart of MMO to offset the thinning effect.

The engine gets at least 1 and usually two quart of MMO per OCI at the end. The engine continues to puke out black oil. Probably always will.



Get any pics???

 

[Artem]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: Artem
Rings are a different matter. Oil is not flowing directly through the rings. They scrape oil from the cylinder walls. Add combustion deposits to that and you see where the problem comes into play.



Did you ever do a UOA report on this car?


Of course. First report was done @ 190k.

UOA #1 - Mobil 1 0w30 - 5,200 miles

UOA #2 - Amsoil OE 5w30 - 5,600 miles

UOA #3 - Amsoil OE 5w30 - 7,000 miles

UOA #4 - Amsoil OE 5w30 - 5,400 miles

UOA #5 - Amsoil OE 5w30 - 5,000 miles

UOA #6 - Amsoil OE 5w30 - 5,000 miles


So what's your point?

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: Artem
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: Artem
Rings are a different matter. Oil is not flowing directly through the rings. They scrape oil from the cylinder walls. Add combustion deposits to that and you see where the problem comes into play.



Did you ever do a UOA report on this car?


Of course. First report was done @ 190k.

UOA #1 - Mobil 1 0w30 - 5,200 miles

UOA #2 - Amsoil OE 5w30 - 5,600 miles

UOA #3 - Amsoil OE 5w30 - 7,000 miles

UOA #4 - Amsoil OE 5w30 - 5,400 miles

UOA #5 - Amsoil OE 5w30 - 5,000 miles

UOA #6 - Amsoil OE 5w30 - 5,000 miles


So what's your point?


No point. I was curious, and continue to want to learn what can or can't be gathered from a UOA report.

 

[electrolover]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: Artem
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: Artem
Rings are a different matter. Oil is not flowing directly through the rings. They scrape oil from the cylinder walls. Add combustion deposits to that and you see where the problem comes into play.



Did you ever do a UOA report on this car?


Of course. First report was done @ 190k.

UOA #1 - Mobil 1 0w30 - 5,200 miles

UOA #2 - Amsoil OE 5w30 - 5,600 miles

UOA #3 - Amsoil OE 5w30 - 7,000 miles

UOA #4 - Amsoil OE 5w30 - 5,400 miles

UOA #5 - Amsoil OE 5w30 - 5,000 miles

UOA #6 - Amsoil OE 5w30 - 5,000 miles


So what's your point?


No point. I was curious, and continue to want to learn what can or can't be gathered from a UOA report.



Im very curious to see if the bearing wear drops after all this cleaning.
I dont understand why you didnt go to a thicker oil when you saw the first report. Is that something you would consider? Maybe a 5/40?

 

[Artem]

I wanna go thinner, maybe try a 5w20 and see how she ticks. Haha. Toyota did back spec this engine for it, so it must be safe, right?

I too wanna see another 5k report after all this cleaning, or should I say, Kreening.

If everything will still be the same, I'd be willing to try 5w40.

I personally feel that even with the 5w30 and the current bearing wear, the engine will still last me 300k. She's currently running extremely good, quiet and strong @ almost 230,000 miles.

 

[demarpaint]

^^ Give it a shot, the worst thing that can happen is you don't like something and you change back to 5W30. I ran 5W20 in my back-spec Aerostar with no problems. I switched back to 5W30 because it was leaking like a pig and I had a ton of 5W30 in my stash.

 

[steve20]

^^^^^
trying to picture what a leaking pig looks like?????