cap monthly student-loan payments

[Gary Allan]

Originally Posted By: Ursae_Majoris
Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
Quote:
Not if the school has to pay higher taxes in order for the gov. to forgive student loans...


Hmmm... The Hill School, a favorite of Donald Trump's son ..and a multitude of children of The League of Distinguished Gentlemen ...located RIGHT HERE in scummy Pottstown PA pays no property taxes ..since they are a non-profit organization. Now the place is surely loaded with wealth ..but ..as you point out ..wealth needs help.

You do not know what you are talking about, do you? Schools pay UBIT taxes, look it up. I spend a month every year working on it.


Give me the CliffNotes® version. By looking it up, it would only be a factor where the alleged non-profit organization engaged in an ongoing revenue generating entity that wasn't part of their core business.

For it to be a matter of consequence, the income or unrelated activity would have to be SUBSTANTIAL compared to the core EXEMPT status of the (again alleged) non-profit organization.

It would be whining about accounting for thousands (maybe many) of unrelated income ..where millions are exempt.

 

[Ursae_Majoris]

It might not be a whole lot, but the fact is, you like to make blanket statements without studying the problem at hand.

 

[Drew99GT]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
Quote:
You support vouchers for private education.

Please show me where I have stated this?


"More good reasons to get my kid into private school. School vouchers really need to become the norm in order to break the strangle hold the crazies have on the government (NOT public!!) schools."

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...rue#Post1013726

You socialist. You want to take MY hard earned money so your kid can go through private school.

But you don't want anyone to take your money so we can have a more college educated work force.

 

[Gary Allan]

Are you saying that my blanket statements are "mostly true" ..but in a very minor view ..not fully truthful to the nth degree?

Point taken. I'll reset my neuro-decimal point more digits to the right.

You must be friends with mori. Everything I say about stuff I hear from Europe is totally inaccurate ..but his retorts/rebuttals merely reinforce my impressions. It's complaining about the rhyme and meter of the assertion ..totally ignoring the MEAT of the discussion.

Abdul killed 5000 people!

You liar!! Abdul only killed 3285 people!! You lame misinformationist western dog!!

Totally ignoring that Abdul was a blood thirst killer was the point of the discussion.

 

[Tempest]

Originally Posted By: Drew99GT

"More good reasons to get my kid into private school. School vouchers really need to become the norm in order to break the strangle hold the crazies have on the government (NOT public!!) schools."

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...rue#Post1013726

I was responding to this post (To provide a little context):
Quote:
The same punishment was applied to a 9 year old that drew a gun (flint lock rife that was historically significant), a 15 year old with a shotgun in his back pack and an 8 year old with a finger nail clipper because of zero-tolerance. When of the three would you not like to face in a dark alley in the middle of the night?

I applaud the parents for moving out of the school district rather than submit their child to drugs to make him easer to manage.

In a thread about a 2nd grader getting suspended for drawing a picture of a gun on paper...in government schools. I was pointing out the things and the frustration that comes from government schools. And that there need to be options.

Now with you pointing out that very thread about gov. schools, and the ridiculous things that come from them, you want EVEN MORE government control of schools? I take it that you support such policies?

 

[Drew99GT]

Yes Tempest. I support public education as a general proposition. Both my parents and several extended family members are all public school teachers. It's easy to point out rare but increasingly common stories like the gun drawing, but I think in general, getting rid of the public school system would do more harm then good. Education should be available to all kids if we want to remain competitive with the developing world, as countries like India and China turn out more engineers and workers with technology back grounds.

If we ditched the public school system, there would certainly have to be yet more government programs such as vouchers, to help people who could not afford to educate their children on their own.

Same with this student loan deal. I generally think it's a wise move to have more college educated people in this country, as the rest of the world, with it's big government funded higher education systems (such as in China and India) is on the verge of having the capacity to kick our economic arses.

But I digress and agree with you that because we keep spending money on wasteful things OTHER then what the funding is for, we're just going to bankrupt ourselves with more incompetent government (not well run government (ya, I'm laughing I typed that too

)).

 

[Gary Allan]

Quote:
Now with you pointing out that very thread about gov. schools, and the ridiculous things that come from them, you want EVEN MORE government control of schools? I take it that you support such policies?


No. I think he's saying that you like redistributions of wealth that serve you. They're okay. Those you don't particularly care for are evil conspiracies against the honorable memory of the founding fathers. You know the right amounts and forms of socialism to administer based on your intimate relationship with those noble men.

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
However, Panda is more than happy to take my comments out context in order to attack me on something I never said.


Like you always said, it was a hypothesis as well.

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
Yes, Drew. It appears that you are perfectly willing to take my hypothesis out of context as well.


It's just a hypothesis, why take it so seriously.

Hey, if I have 1 million (actually, 1 million is not wealth anymore, let's make it 30 million), everything that takes money out of my pocket is fair game, and I better be able to defend all the money I pay for and not doing me any good too.

Just business, nothing personal.

 

[PandaBear]

To help Tempest out by distracting all the people who attack him, I'll try to get back to the topic.



I was paying out of state tuition when I was in college, back in 96-01. It was about 3x as much as other in state students for the public university (UC Davis), and at that time it was already costing something like 35k a year. This is the cost that the school can run without help from the Fed and State government.

So to be fair, let's make college just as expensive for everyone as me, so only middle class and wealthy folks can afford to send their kids to college. The school would sit empty, and accept a whole bunch of foreigners that will pay this amount of money, just like our graduate school system all over the nation.

What we will get eventually, is a nation full of Indian and Chinese, and every college grad that made it, other than a few decedents of the upper middle class and the rich folks, is an immigrant with Indian and Chinese accent. Nothing wrong with that, they are nice people (p.s. I'm one).

What we will get is 2 classes of citizen, the native born with no education and stuck with union jobs, and low income, living off social services, and the immigrants that can afford the college education and make most of the money of the nations.

Look at Indonesia and see what happen, the Chinese is 10% of the population and has 90% of the wealth, let's see how much of a political and civil unrest, and how stable the US would be if we go that path.

 

[pickled]

Paid off $50k in student loans from grad school, sister had $150k from med school. All and all the federal consolidation program was good enough for me. The people that get really screwed up are the folks that "tried" but didn't get the final sheepskin! A friend of mine tried pharmacy school twice and, well it didn't work out. Needless to say that's a pretty large payment to make when you're not knocking down the $80k you thought you would...sucks to be those guys!
The other type of people that really [censored] me off who might benefit from this are those that are the eternal philosophical student. I have a relative who was in college from the age of 18-34 and never had a job!!! Needless to say the student loans were insane and the poor soul (who must have loved living on mac n' cheese) had to take out private bank loans on top of maxing out all possible benefits. Finally got a doctorate and is helping folks out at the community college level.

 

[oilyriser]

Originally Posted By: PandaBear
What we will get eventually, is a nation full of Indian and Chinese, and every college grad that made it, other than a few decedents of the upper middle class and the rich folks, is an immigrant with Indian and Chinese accent. Nothing wrong with that, they are nice people (p.s. I'm one).



I can imagine how bad it would be with a nation full of the most intelligent people from all around the world...

 

[Drew99GT]

Originally Posted By: PandaBear
To help Tempest out by distracting all the people who attack him, I'll try to get back to the topic.






I wasn't trying to attack Tempest. I was pointing out that he supports government funding of his child's private education, yet loathes government funding to reduce college loan payments.

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: oilyriser
Originally Posted By: PandaBear
What we will get eventually, is a nation full of Indian and Chinese, and every college grad that made it, other than a few decedents of the upper middle class and the rich folks, is an immigrant with Indian and Chinese accent. Nothing wrong with that, they are nice people (p.s. I'm one).



I can imagine how bad it would be with a nation full of the most intelligent people from all around the world...


That is not bad... like I said it was the "only rich foreigner could afford college education" that bothers me.

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
Originally Posted By: PandaBear
To help Tempest out by distracting all the people who attack him, I'll try to get back to the topic.


I wasn't trying to attack Tempest. I was pointing out that he supports government funding of his child's private education, yet loathes government funding to reduce college loan payments.


I was being sarcastic, and merely Quote Tempest directly as he claims that we were all attacking him.

 

[Ursae_Majoris]

Originally Posted By: PandaBear

I was paying out of state tuition when I was in college, back in 96-01. It was about 3x as much as other in state students for the public university (UC Davis), and at that time it was already costing something like 35k a year. This is the cost that the school can run without help from the Fed and State government.


So you CHOSE to go to an out-of state college and pay higher tuition. Now you want taxpayers to pay for YOUR choices??? Cry me a river.

I have 2 bachelor degrees and a Masters. I CHOSE not to go a tier 2 or tier 1 college. I graduated with $0 in school debt. So did my wife. We have no school debt, and even though I earn less than someone with a degree from UC Davis, I probably take home more in NET pay, since I do not have to pay $1000 a month in college loans.

College education is open to anyone who wants to work for it. Get a part time job and and go to school. That's what I did.

 

[Gary Allan]

Quote:
So you CHOSE to go to an out-of state college and pay higher tuition. Now you want taxpayers to pay for YOUR choices??? Cry me a river.



That's not what he said. He said let's remove all the subsidies that he didn't qualify for and charge everyone the higher rate that he had to pay. Wouldn't that be nice??

 

[Tempest]

Quote:
This is the cost that the school can run without help from the Fed and State government.

Where does that "help" come from? Taxes, which reduces people's purchasing power. Do you really think that a college education should cost $35K a year...at a state college?

That number should be screaming at you as to what the state running things does to costs.

There are already numerous government programs for student loans. These have been in place for a long time. The price of tuition continues to skyrocket far above inflation. So obviously what we need are even more government programs!

It's the same effect that FM and FM had on housing prices. Costs will continue to rise (the intentional effect) but they will give you an "out" by doing the government's bidding.

 

[Gary Allan]

..all fine and good, Tempest. I won't argue that when you give a dog a bone every time it rolls over ..it will roll over every time it wants a bone.

I say the same thing about medical treatment ..which you seem to support full throttle raping of the population ..but that's another matter.

..but what is the likely outcome of the removal of all government assistance in the matter?

I'd say that it would mean that only those of nobility would be granted access to high learning ...they would be the only ones to afford the ante to qualify for the best positions ..etc..etc. Now it will have a bunch of colleges closing their doors ..but I can live with that end of it. I don't think that higher education was ever in a free market situation. Effects of economies may have made them swell or not ..but I don't think they've ever really competed on any plane other than the prestige of that the name implies.

..when geniuses at any lower station will remain digging ditches in Tempestopia.

 

[Kestas]

The $35K per year cost is an eye opener. There's no reason everyone should get a college degree, as some people would like to think. I truly believe colleges and universities have become bloated beyond their usefulness. I also believe only the talented and the rich should go to college. There's nothing wrong with a person who isn't college material to seek vocational schooling. Vocational schools are incredibly underrated, yet so important to our economy and well-being as a country.

Why should a marginally talented person saddle himself (or his parents, or even the taxpayer) with this incredible cost that bring little return to himself or others? On top of that, it takes away 2 to 5 years wages from the person.

I would like to think that our school systems allow talented students from underpriveledged backgrounds to get a college education via scholarships based on their performance in secondary schopols. I'd hate to think that a bright mind is stuck with a menial job, simply because his parents can't afford higher education.