The New Fram Ultra......

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This is where the genius of the "stash" is revealed. I have enough of everything to wait for these types of things to settle out.
Unless the Fram numbers are true and they did indeed improve it.

Once again, lots of assumptions are being made not in the absence of data, but in the face of data. Ridiculous. And few oil filters out there have metal backed pleats, or really backing of any kind. So where are all the failures? And if Fram's filtration claims are not true, the other companies will either sue or they will start making the same false claims. They aren't. Most won't publish their data because they can't even beat the lowly Extra Guard. So there is no evidence at all that Fram has compromised actual performance in any way, but in fact provided evidence to the contrary. And yet the Bitog sky is falling.

I contend that the metal backing was mainly for marketing purposes. To make customers feel good about the strength of their filters. In reality, it was entirely unnecessary. Again, the Mobil 1 filters I've run in my Pentastar had media that was easily torn after an OCI. The Fram is extremely difficult to tear apart. But the M1 filters never failed. So what's the point of the (in this case nylon or polymer) backing on the pleats? To make you feel good that it was so stinking hard to pull apart. Heck, I even ound the Mopar a little harder to tear apart than the Mobil 1. But the Fram filters better, so it remains my favorite.

Beretta once did something similar with the model 92 pistol slide. Early models had slide failures due to a material defect in the steel. (Not a design defect). So users lost confidence and considered the slide to be a weak design. So Beretta introduced the "Brigadier" version with pronounced humps in the slides where they were thickened. This was highly visible and gave users confidence that it was now stronger. In reality, it was unnecessary. They continued with other 92 models that did not have the weak or flawed steel and the breakage issue disappeared.
 
I contend that the metal backing was mainly for marketing purposes. To make customers feel good about the strength of their filters. In reality, it was entirely unnecessary.
The old Ultra media definitely needed the metal screen backing because the media was too soft and flexible without it. The new media design uses a much stiffer layer of media that can supposedly take the delta-p without extra backing material. If you watch the Whip City Wrencher YouTube videos posted in this thread you can see the difference in the stiffness of the two media designs.
 
Drama Update:

I took a small led flashlight with when I went to Walmart today and AAP. I looked at some XG and FS filters, small and large. The larger filters still have the metal backing, while the small ones don't. At least that's what I could see. I don't think it's a cost cutting measure. Small filters have only so much room to spare. Feel free to check out my story as there are plenty of Walmart and AAP stores across the US. I'm not on anyone's side and don't have a favorite oil filter, just looking to buy the one with the best filtration.
 
Drama Update:

I took a small led flashlight with when I went to Walmart today and AAP. I looked at some XG and FS filters, small and large. The larger filters still have the metal backing, while the small ones don't. At least that's what I could see. I don't think it's a cost cutting measure. Small filters have only so much room to spare. Feel free to check out my story as there are plenty of Walmart and AAP stores across the US. I'm not on anyone's side and don't have a favorite oil filter, just looking to buy the one with the best filtration.
I think you were looking at the metal inner tube. They have removed the metal backing which is a change that can’t be seen without cutting the canister. Even with the removal of this metal backing, it sounds like they have improved the overall efficiency of the filters slightly. Jury is still out on flow rate differences.
 
Drama Update:

I took a small led flashlight with when I went to Walmart today and AAP. I looked at some XG and FS filters, small and large. The larger filters still have the metal backing, while the small ones don't. At least that's what I could see. I don't think it's a cost cutting measure. Small filters have only so much room to spare. Feel free to check out my story as there are plenty of Walmart and AAP stores across the US. I'm not on anyone's side and don't have a favorite oil filter, just looking to buy the one with the best filtration.

I just picked up 2 Fram Ultra XG2 Oil Filters at Walmart, going by the date code it looks like both filters were made during the middle of June 2021

I just shined a small LED flashlight and I really cant tell what I am seeing, it looks like Filter Material.
 
The old Ultra media definitely needed the metal screen backing because the media was too soft and flexible without it. The new media design uses a much stiffer layer of media that can supposedly take the delta-p without extra backing material. If you watch the Whip City Wrencher YouTube videos posted in this thread you can see the difference in the stiffness of the two media designs.
There are a handful of individuals that I value their input. ZeeOSix is one of them. Especially, concerning the delta-p, and micron filtering etc. Again; testing , historical/anecdotal data will prove or disprove.
 
The old Ultra media definitely needed the metal screen backing because the media was too soft and flexible without it. The new media design uses a much stiffer layer of media that can supposedly take the delta-p without extra backing material. If you watch the Whip City Wrencher YouTube videos posted in this thread you can see the difference in the stiffness of the two media designs.
That may be, but the new material appears to filter even better and doesn't require it. Therefore I think it was unnecessary unless the new filter media was not yet developed, which may be the case.
 
FWIW, I ordered a few from Amazon today based on the product box on the website showing they had the metal screen (i.e. old version). Product that arrived was for new version. Almost surely an over-reaction on my part but I’m returning them as the product was not as described.
 
FWIW, I ordered a few from Amazon today based on the product box on the website showing they had the metal screen (i.e. old version). Product that arrived was for new version. Almost surely an over-reaction on my part but I’m returning them as the product was not as described.
I don't think it is, they made an unexpected and unwanted change, they can have it back. It's not ridiculous like people that bought oil during the SP transition that would whine about receiving SN+ stock.
 
I just picked up 2 Fram Ultra XG2 Oil Filters at Walmart, going by the date code it looks like both filters were made during the middle of June 2021

I just shined a small LED flashlight and I really cant tell what I am seeing, it looks like Filter Material.
Yes, you can see it easily with a flashlight down the center tube through the tube holes.

Here's an older XG7317 I have on deck with the metal screen backing.

1629232152716.jpeg


And here's a new XG7317 I took a photo at Walmart yesterday without the metal screen backing.

1629232200206.jpeg
 
That may be, but the new material appears to filter even better and doesn't require it. Therefore I think it was unnecessary unless the new filter media was not yet developed, which may be the case.
The Ultra with the metal screen backing has been around for many years, so don't know what you're getting at with saying "unless the new filter media was not yet developed". They are two entirely different media designs between the two configurations.
 
That may be, but the new material appears to filter even better and doesn't require it. Therefore I think it was unnecessary unless the new filter media was not yet developed, which may be the case.
So why when you ask them about 5 microns do they start telling you 10 micron and up data?

Because it’s worse at 5 micron is why.

Also I can’t get an answer about holding capacity.

Again, because it’s worse.

If it was better they would tell us.

I don’t even really care. I don’t think the efficiency is the end all be all, but sketchy answers I don’t like.
 
18 minutes ago

RE: I just picked up 2 Fram Ultra XG2 oil filters from walmart A11691 and A11781 these are the codes on the oil filters, Seems these oil filters were made in June of 2021, when did Fram go to the new design on this oil filter, meaning no metal screen insi​

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Technical Hotline​

4:46 PM (7 minutes ago)
to me, Technical
Hello Brian,


FRAM is currently in the process of changing the XG Ultra filters over to the new improved dual layer media. Not all of the filters have been changed yet, only some of the part numbers have been at this point. The rest will be changed out over the coming months.

While the metal screen is gone, that is because the XG Ultra filters now utilize two synthetic media layers and the structural integrity of the media was improved, meaning it no longer needed the metal screen for support. Which is what the metal screen was there for on the earlier version, it did not help filtration and was for structural support that the older media needed.

The new dual layer media has the same great efficiency rating of 99+% @ 20 micron. The new media actually increased the rating below that. Example - 15 micron – Old media was 91% and the new is 93%.

The other long life gaskets and anti-drainback valves remain the same. As does the 20K mile interval capability. These were indeed improvements and not cost cutting measures.


Along with the technical improvements to the specifications of the XG Ultra series filters. The new filters will be made in the USA and will add over 50 new jobs in the US at our FRAM facilities as we move production of many of our offshore filter lines back to the USA.



Regards,
Technical Support

I looked again at the 2 oil filters I bought at Walmart today, went ahead and got a flashlight with a magnifying glass and went in a dark room and I could see the metal screening. I also have a Royal Purple 20-820 that I never used and it has been sitting on my desk for 12 years. and it has the Metal Screening.
 
18 minutes ago

RE: I just picked up 2 Fram Ultra XG2 oil filters from walmart A11691 and A11781 these are the codes on the oil filters, Seems these oil filters were made in June of 2021, when did Fram go to the new design on this oil filter, meaning no metal screen insi​

Inbox

Technical Hotline​

4:46 PM (7 minutes ago)
to me, Technical
Hello Brian,


FRAM is currently in the process of changing the XG Ultra filters over to the new improved dual layer media. Not all of the filters have been changed yet, only some of the part numbers have been at this point. The rest will be changed out over the coming months.

While the metal screen is gone, that is because the XG Ultra filters now utilize two synthetic media layers and the structural integrity of the media was improved, meaning it no longer needed the metal screen for support. Which is what the metal screen was there for on the earlier version, it did not help filtration and was for structural support that the older media needed.

The new dual layer media has the same great efficiency rating of 99+% @ 20 micron. The new media actually increased the rating below that. Example - 15 micron – Old media was 91% and the new is 93%.

The other long life gaskets and anti-drainback valves remain the same. As does the 20K mile interval capability. These were indeed improvements and not cost cutting measures.


Along with the technical improvements to the specifications of the XG Ultra series filters. The new filters will be made in the USA and will add over 50 new jobs in the US at our FRAM facilities as we move production of many of our offshore filter lines back to the USA.



Regards,
Technical Support

I looked again at the 2 oil filters I bought at Walmart today, went ahead and got a flashlight with a magnifying glass and went in a dark room and I could see the metal screening. I also have a Royal Purple 20-820 that I never used and it has been sitting on my desk for 12 years. and it has the Metal Screening.
Interdasting. FU ftw.
 
....

The new dual layer media has the same great efficiency rating of 99+% @ 20 micron. The new media actually increased the rating below that. Example - 15 micron – Old media was 91% and the new is 93%.

....

Reply and ask them how it is at 5 micron compared to the old and also what the holding capacity of new and old is.
 
Also ask them if the flow vs delta-p has changed between the old vs new media on the same filter model number (like an XG7317).
 
I guess ill be the guinea pig here.

Currently have the old-style frame ultra on my car right now (2017 accord), my oil change will be around 53k miles (the car has 49k right now)
I've got an early new style (A11681) of the new material.

ill cut open the filters and see if the the new one collapses (or explodes lol) will still stick to the same Amsoil, and change at the same mileage
 
Last edited:
18 minutes ago

RE: I just picked up 2 Fram Ultra XG2 oil filters from walmart A11691 and A11781 these are the codes on the oil filters, Seems these oil filters were made in June of 2021, when did Fram go to the new design on this oil filter, meaning no metal screen insi​

Inbox

Technical Hotline​

4:46 PM (7 minutes ago)
to me, Technical
Hello Brian,


FRAM is currently in the process of changing the XG Ultra filters over to the new improved dual layer media. Not all of the filters have been changed yet, only some of the part numbers have been at this point. The rest will be changed out over the coming months.

While the metal screen is gone, that is because the XG Ultra filters now utilize two synthetic media layers and the structural integrity of the media was improved, meaning it no longer needed the metal screen for support. Which is what the metal screen was there for on the earlier version, it did not help filtration and was for structural support that the older media needed.

The new dual layer media has the same great efficiency rating of 99+% @ 20 micron. The new media actually increased the rating below that. Example - 15 micron – Old media was 91% and the new is 93%.

The other long life gaskets and anti-drainback valves remain the same. As does the 20K mile interval capability. These were indeed improvements and not cost cutting measures.


Along with the technical improvements to the specifications of the XG Ultra series filters. The new filters will be made in the USA and will add over 50 new jobs in the US at our FRAM facilities as we move production of many of our offshore filter lines back to the USA.



Regards,
Technical Support

I looked again at the 2 oil filters I bought at Walmart today, went ahead and got a flashlight with a magnifying glass and went in a dark room and I could see the metal screening. I also have a Royal Purple 20-820 that I never used and it has been sitting on my desk for 12 years. and it has the Metal Screening.
Thanks for this post.

Ok guys time for you to test the snot out of these new Ultra XG's, so in 2+ years I'll know if it's safe to buy the new model once my old stash dries up.
 
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