OW-16 vs 0W-20 viscosity specs - does it really matter.

[tolian21]

I wondered if I didn't get a 0W20 instead of 0W16 in our hybrid when we had dealer service the Highlander??

Lol, thats another thing to consider. Customers dont see their cars being worked on at the dealer, who knows if invoice matches the actual oil in the car? Especially if its from bulk barrels…

 

[Heywood_6078]

I am really considering going to 0w20 from 0w16 in our Rav 4. 0w20 HPL, as I don't really see any problems using the 20 grade over the 16 and, gives me a bit more peace of mind with the hot summer months coming up.

 

[JohnnyJohnson]

I am really considering going to 0w20 from 0w16 in our Rav 4. 0w20 HPL, as I don't really see any problems using the 20 grade over the 16 and, gives me a bit more peace of mind with the hot summer months coming up.

Certainly the CAFE Police will be after you night and day they are relentless! 30 grade would likely put you on the most wanted list.

 

[Bill7]

As I stated up above, it used to be 5W20 VS 5W30. Now we have evolved to 0W16 VS 0W20. Let the "thick vs thin" debates begin!

Not really. Many of us on this forum only use 30 weight oils (no matter what the CAFE influenced owners manual recommends) as we googled HTHS wear graph, and found that any oil with HTHS < 2.6 causes exponentially high engine wear. Even 20 weight oils start out at the marginal HTHS = 2.6, but will shear and get thinner during the oil change interval, going into the high wear danger zone.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Many of us on this forum only use 30 weight oils (no matter what the CAFE influenced owners manual recommends) ...

A xW-30 will work well in just about anything. If there was only one oil viscosity in the world, it would have to be 0W-30 (the 0W to cover all the cold climates).

 

[SC Maintenance]

Since my thread was bumped - I ran the 0w-16, or whatever the dealer put in it - for 6 months and about 4000 miles. Then I dumped it and replaced it with Mobil1 EP 0w-20 and a new OEM filter, mainly because I already had both.

I will likely just go to M1EP 5W-30 next time, since that is what I use in my truck anyway - commonality of parts makes stocking spares easier

 

[ZeeOSix]

Since my thread was bumped - I ran the 0w-16, or whatever the dealer put in it - for 6 months and about 4000 miles. Then I dumped it and replaced it with Mobil1 EP 0w-20 and a new OEM filter, mainly because I already had both.

I will likely just go to M1EP 5W-30 next time, since that is what I use in my truck anyway - commonality of parts makes stocking spares easier

Yeah, morph in to a "thicky" one step at a time.

 

[Titan]

I use 0w20 in a Camry with the Dynamic Force Engine. With three adults and luggage, driving from Charlotte to Chicago and back, averaging over 70 mph (going 75 most of the time), I got right at 40 mpg. It's been running 0w20 for 90,000 miles, and always get great mpg...one tankful we got 53 mpg cruising at the speed limits (55-60 mph on those roads), again with three adults in the car. Oil level stays on full the entire OCI...which has been 5000-7500 miles depending upon whether it had short-trips and/or cold weather (that's when it gets 5000 mile changes). HPL 0w20 in there now, I plant to run that oil 10,000 miles...and will get a UOA to make sure it's holding up well.

 

[VTECOverRated]

I ran 0w16 TGMO in my camry for 260k Miles. You know what went wrong? The transmission (even with fluid changes every 50k).
So the engine will outlast the rest of the car.

 

[billt460]

So... According to this, if the oil pump "knows" that someone installed 10W-30 instead of "required" 5W-20, what does it do when the guy who installed the 5W-20 like a good little boy, suddenly moves from Miami to Fairbanks? And in the process, his "cold" engine goes from 80F at night, to -35F ? And the 5W-20 proceeds to get thicker than caramel in a refrigerator.

The dashboard should light up like a Christmas tree as soon as he turns the key, and it should start throwing codes faster than the Space Shuttle going on internal power..... Unless of course he wrote a letter to his oil pump, telling it of the move.

 

[ZeeOSix]

^^^ I highly doubt the sensors are so sensitive and accurate to know the difference between a few cSt of viscosity at hot operating temperatures. It might be able to see the difference between a xW-16 and a xW-40 or 50. They would have to have a pretty wide limits range on the "viscosity sensing system" to not be tripping some check engine light all the time because the system "thinks" the wrong viscosity is being used. And take into account cold temperature operations, or only make it start monitoring after the oil reaches a certain temperature. Will it also trip a warning if too thin of oil is used, or if the oil is thinned down pretty good from fuel dilution?

And as pointed out many times before, the cars used in other countries with the same engines using the same variable output oil pumps specify a range of viscosity in the owner's manual.

 

[CKN]

"Thin (er) vs. Thick (er) AGAIN!!

 

[kschachn]

^^^ I highly doubt the sensors are so sensitive and accurate to know the difference between a few cSt of viscosity at hot operating temperatures. It might be able to see the difference between a xW-16 and a xW-40 or 50. They would have to have a pretty wide limits range on the "viscosity sensing system" to not be tripping some check engine light all the time because the system "thinks" the wrong viscosity is being used. And take into account cold temperature operations, or only make it start monitoring after the oil reaches a certain temperature. Will it also trip a warning if too thin of oil is used, or if the oil is thinned down pretty good from fuel dilution?

And as pointed out many times before, the cars used in other countries with the same engines using the same variable output oil pumps specify a range of viscosity in the owner's manual.

The biggest red flag of bs to me is that a car “needs” a lower viscosity oil.

 

[ZeeOSix]

"Thin (er) vs. Thick (er) AGAIN!!

That will not happen when there is only one oil viscosity in the world.

 

[Bill7]

What instigated this thread is I am debating dumping the new 0W-16 out of my Toyota and replacing it with 0W-20. The 0W-16 is new. I took the car to the dealer - feel obligated as its still in warranty - and they changed the oil for free - work order and window sticker say 0w-16 which is what the manual calls for.

In reviewing the J300 specs, there is quite a bit of overlap in the spec, and HTHS isn't that far apart?

I also have no idea what they put in - likely the cheapest crap around. However in looking at the M1 Advanced Fuel Economy for the 16 vs 20 weight, there like 7.2 Vs 8.2 KV@100C?

So do I dump it and put in 0w-20?

Side question, if I do - do I change the filter - its a new OEM filter - so I am thinking not on that part.


View attachment 137054

HTHS matters. If I were in your position I would go with the 0W-20. The 2.6 HTHS is just enough to provide enough protection.

 

[Bill7]

That will not happen when there is only one oil viscosity in the world.

For most vehicles the optimal oil viscosity for longevity is 5W-30. That is the only viscosity I'll ever use.
I don't have respect for owner's manuals specifying 0W-16 with 10,000 mile / 1 year OCI.
This whole debate of 20 weight versus 16 weight won't ever affect me.

 

[billt460]

And as pointed out many times before, the cars used in other countries with the same engines using the same variable output oil pumps specify a range of viscosity in the owner's manual.

Bingo! We have a winner!

 

[billt460]

Yeah, that's equivalent to $106 a jug for the 0W-30 LM, not sure if that includes VAT or not. People here piss themselves if they can't buy a jug of syn on clearance for $10...

The above pic if from Germany but no idea when it was taken. But the taxes on the Mobil 1 0W-40 would be over $16 alone...

You have to remember those German prices include all of their "free" health care.

 

[SC Maintenance]

HTHS matters. If I were in your position I would go with the 0W-20. The 2.6 HTHS is just enough to provide enough protection.

Not debating the HTHS part, but do we really know the 0W-20 has higher HTHS than 0W-16 given their viscosities overlap? If you bought 2 brands - one 16 and on 20 that had the same viscosity - would they have different HTHS values?

 

[OVERKILL]

Not debating the HTHS part, but do we really know the 0W-20 has higher HTHS than 0W-16 given their viscosities overlap? If you bought 2 brands - one 16 and on 20 that had the same viscosity - would they have different HTHS values?

They have different HTHS limits. The minimum for an xW-20 is 2.6cP, the minimum for an xW-16 is 2.3cP.