Outhink the manufacturer.

[stchman]

Originally Posted By: zach1900
Originally Posted By: bigt61
Originally Posted By: ChevyBadger
Its good to question all things in life, otherwise you're just one of the sheep that listens to the dictator.

You mean a Democrat?

So true my friend, though establishment Dems and Gops are more alike than different, it's all window dressing.


OK, the topic changed direction.

The Democrats and Republicans are the reason that I am becoming more and more Libertarian every day.

 

[demarpaint]

Ah yes, every car designed, and every engineer hired had/has a perfect track record, and the products they produce are trouble free if you follow the book. That statement might be true but there are exceptions. Bitog has alerted many people to such problems.

I'm sure there are several members here that can rattle off a few makes and models with engineering problems requiring service interval modifications that were discovered after the book was written. For starters I recall OLM's being re-calibrated because of issues, etc. etc. Not everything people do here that's not is in the book is to feel good.

 

[Triton_330]

Originally Posted By: stchman
Originally Posted By: zach1900
Originally Posted By: bigt61
Originally Posted By: ChevyBadger
Its good to question all things in life, otherwise you're just one of the sheep that listens to the dictator.

You mean a Democrat?

So true my friend, though establishment Dems and Gops are more alike than different, it's all window dressing.


OK, the topic changed direction.

The Democrats and Republicans are the reason that I am becoming more and more Libertarian every day.

Welcome to the Libertarian Party! I am one, too.

However, as for your OP... You say to stick with the manufacturers recommended oil and grade.

Well, what about vehicles that used to be spec'd one grade, then were spec'd something different later? Like, say... My truck! The engines didn't change. 5w-30 was spec'd from 97 to 00, and then it changed to 5w-20. I drive a 2001 that specs 5w-20, but I use 5w-30. Why? Because I can, and, because that's what I believe all the Triton engines from 97-2003 should use, since that's what they originally spec'd.

Sometimes you gotta think outside the spec to use what your engine really needs.

~ Triton

 

[CarbonSteel]

Originally Posted By: Triton_330
Sometimes you gotta think outside the spec to use what your engine really needs.
What testing criteria did you use to determine this? What were the results of the testing?

 

[wemay]

Originally Posted By: 2010_FX4
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
And thats perfectly fine. Its your prerogative to blindly follow the print you read in your manual. Personally, I engage my brain when I make a decision. Best example is CAFE dictated viscosities.
Despite the move to "CAFE dictated viscosities" as you say, what harm has it done? I live in the same climate that you do and xW-20 has served my engine(s) well--even while towing and in Nevada/Montana heat of 115F+. I have said it before that when xW-16 and xW-12 are the main stays, everyone on BITOG will be talking about how thick xW-20 is...


+1

 

[Bud]

I don't follow anyone's suggestions, only what I think is right. Be it right or wrong it satisfies me and I have never had a vehicle give up the ghost due to type of oil or filter I use. But I enjoy the heck out of the BTOG forums so keep the discussions going. The owners manuals are mainly for covering the manufacturers behinds. If not, they sure would not pay the printing cost associated with putting them out.

 

[davebarnum]

I have put your oxymoron in bold. If you don't care, why did you read/post anything? I could speculate, but that'd be just about as productive as your post.

Originally Posted By: stchman
I know this is going to get me a lot of flack, but I frankly don't care.

I have been on this forum for quite some time and it appears to be a common theme that people on here seem to think they know better as to what viscosity, interval, filter, etc.

IMO, it is absurd to think that we know more about the vehicle than the designers of the vehicle. If the manufacturer calls for 5W-30, then that is what I put in. I don't put in 0W-40 because it makes me "feel" better. What I "feel" about an engine oil is completely irrelevant.

And another one are people that "feel" they need a longer filter and putting on a filter that is 3/4" longer is going to make all the difference in the world to an engine.

My truck calls for a dexos approved oil, instead of bellyaching about that I can't use an oil that makes me "feel" good, I use an oil that meets the manufacturer recommendation.

I am a firm believer that if you maintain a service interval as per the manufacturer, the engine will probably outlast the body.

 

[sciphi]

Or perhaps the blanket specification does not suit local conditions. Or they use a different specification for the identical engine in other countries. Sometimes using that specification does indeed reduce or eliminate issues caused by a specification made for other reasons here in the US. Honda VCM issues come to mind.

 

[Cujet]

And in other news, the engineers that designed the Boeing 787 sure make great pilots.... NOT.

GM's failing balancer chains is primafacie example, number one. Long drain intervals, coupled with an oil that is clearly too thin for maximum chain life, added to a short chain with high cyclic loads, and rapid wear is the result.

Another perfect example is VW's 507.1 oil required on the PD diesels. The result:

The solution for VW's PD camshaft problems remains the same solution as so many other engines. Higher viscosity, more ZDDP, AND shorter drain intervals.


Operational experience, is still valid.


I've written on this extensively, but stationary, air cooled generators, often spec 10W-30 or 5W-30 oil. They failed by the tens of thousands here in South Florida, post hurricanes.

The reason is excessive oil temperatures, due to ambient conditions. The solution, the same as ever. Higher viscosity, more ZDDP.

 

[GM4LIFE]

I just hope you don't plan on running the PF48E e-core oil filter. Stay away from all e-core oil filters. The PF48 oil filter you are using has been discontinued in favor of the PF48E part number. Do yourself a favor and get the PF63 oil filter instead or a Fram Ultra XG 10575. Mobil 1 5W30 is perfect for your truck, but Mobil 1 is NOT the factory fill and it isn't what GM dealers use for oil changes on 99% of GM vehicles.

 

[stchman]

Originally Posted By: GM4LIFE
I just hope you don't plan on running the PF48E e-core oil filter. Stay away from all e-core oil filters. The PF48 oil filter you are using has been discontinued in favor of the PF48E part number. Do yourself a favor and get the PF63 oil filter instead or a Fram Ultra XG 10575. Mobil 1 5W30 is perfect for your truck, but Mobil 1 is NOT the factory fill and it isn't what GM dealers use for oil changes on 99% of GM vehicles.


People keep saying that you can substitute a PF63 for a PF48. If for some reason I have to have warranty service on my engine, I could see the dealer giving me a hard time for putting the wrong oil filter. I have about 10 PF48 oil filters left in my stash. When they run out, I will have to get a different filter. Maybe I can find a few PF48s in excess stock at some stores.

Mobil 1 used to be the factory fill on Corvettes, it might still be.

My girlfriend has a Malibu and the dealer changes the oil, they use AC Delco semi synthetic oil.

 

[hatt]

Originally Posted By: stchman
Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
Originally Posted By: stchman
2013 Chevrolet Silverado LTZ 2WD 5.3L
Mobil 1 5W-30
AC Delco PF48


Per your owners manual: "Use only engine oil licensed to the dexos1 specfication, or equivalent, of the proper SAE viscosity grade."

It states nothing about using Mobil 1, a top-tier synthetic. Nor can you provide any evidence that when following the manufacturer service interval, you'll achieve lower wear or longer engine life with Mobil 1. Good job on trying to outthink GM.

I wasn't trying to out think GM, I just used what they wanted. I didn't come on a forum and have a hissy fit that I couldn't use Amsoil or something else.

When I bought my truck there were only a handful of dexos approved oils, Mobil 1 was one of them. I get Mobil 1 at my local Costco for $27(incl tax) for a 6 pack. That comes to $4.50 a quart, not a bad price. Mobil 1 has been a factory fill for many GM cars, so I figure if it is good enough for them, good enough for me. Is GM perfect, far from it, but they do know a lot more about vehicles than I do.
Walmart has Dexos oil for $3.40/qt. Maybe some even cheaper. So you can stop wasting money with vanity oils that according to the manufacturer offer absolutely no benefit in you application.

 

[Solarent]

I posted this about a year ago.
Quote:
This is how I chose oil:
-1- Start with OEM recommendations
-2- Pick my desired maintenance program (OCI length, DIY/DIFM etc)
-3- Do a couple of UOA's to determine a baseline trend
-4- Pick my candidate oils based on price, availability and packaging (like I said - I'm shallow like that)
-5- Monitor my UOA trend to make sure I can achieve my maintenance goals with my selection (lucky for me I have access to really good cheap analysis)
-6- Adjust accordingly (this could mean trying a different oil based on viscosity performance or UOA results,or adjusting the OCI, it could also mean experimenting with blends or filters or additives etc.)

Everyone's engine will respond differently based on a wide range of conditions - what works well for someone in Canada might not make sense for someone in Australia. This is true even when you have the exact same engine and use the exact same oil. That's why having a choice of oils is good, because you can find the one that meets your needs for your engine in your conditions and driving habits.


To each their own. Some people won't bother with it and you are right following the OEM recommendation will probably keep the engine lasting a long time. But there is an entire subculture of petrolheads that want more than a recommendation - they want to know that their money is being well spent.

 

[CarbonSteel]

Originally Posted By: Cujet
GM's failing balancer chains is primafacie example, number one. Long drain intervals, coupled with an oil that is clearly too thin for maximum chain life, added to a short chain with high cyclic loads, and rapid wear is the result.
That or it was simply a bad design from the start and increasing the viscosity of the oil is either a band-aid solution or simply delays the inevitable...

 

[901Memphis]

Originally Posted By: stchman
Originally Posted By: GM4LIFE
I just hope you don't plan on running the PF48E e-core oil filter. Stay away from all e-core oil filters. The PF48 oil filter you are using has been discontinued in favor of the PF48E part number. Do yourself a favor and get the PF63 oil filter instead or a Fram Ultra XG 10575. Mobil 1 5W30 is perfect for your truck, but Mobil 1 is NOT the factory fill and it isn't what GM dealers use for oil changes on 99% of GM vehicles.


People keep saying that you can substitute a PF63 for a PF48. If for some reason I have to have warranty service on my engine, I could see the dealer giving me a hard time for putting the wrong oil filter. I have about 10 PF48 oil filters left in my stash. When they run out, I will have to get a different filter. Maybe I can find a few PF48s in excess stock at some stores.

Mobil 1 used to be the factory fill on Corvettes, it might still be.

My girlfriend has a Malibu and the dealer changes the oil, they use AC Delco semi synthetic oil.





#PIP4889: Engine Break In Oil Filter Number PF48 From New Delivery - Not The Same As The Service Number PF63 In Owners Manual - (Mar 8, 2011)

Subject: Engine Break In Oil Filter number PF48 From New Delivery - Not The Same As The Service number PF63 In Owners Manual

Models: 2011 Buick LaCrosse
2011 Buick Enclave
2011 Chevrolet Traverse, Equinox
2011 GMC Acadia, Terrain
Only with engine RPO Codes LF1, LFW, and LLT 3.6L

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The following diagnosis might be helpful if the vehicle exhibits the symptom(s) described in this PI.

Condition/Concern:
Some customers may comment that the oil filter # the engine came from the factory with is not the same # required for service per the owners manual and gm parts catalog. Engine was delivered with AC Delco PF48 and Service Oil Filter is AC Delco PF63

Recommendation/Instructions:
The PF63 filter has the same high quality attributes as the PF48 with but is 22mm longer which will provide an additional 22 mm of media filtration material. There will also be additional filtration protection during high mileage oil change intervals. The PF63 filter is a NEW release for the 2011 model year. These 2011 engines will be built with a break in oil filter of PF48 with service replacement being PF63.

The PF63 filter can be used on all M/Y vehicles with RPO codes LLT, LF1 and LFW engines if PF48 is the service filter.

 

[bluesubie]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint


I'm sure there are several members here that can rattle off a few makes and models with engineering problems requiring service interval modifications that were discovered after the book was written. For starters I recall OLM's being re-calibrated because of issues, etc. etc. Not everything people do here that's not is in the book is to feel good.

One thing that following the manufacturers original OCI recommendation got me, and many other 2.5L turbo Subaru owners, was a blown turbo and a wallet that was lighter by $2,000.

p.s. - Still trying to figure out what outhink means. Is that French?

-Dennis

 

[aquariuscsm]

Originally Posted By: GM4LIFE
I just hope you don't plan on running the PF48E e-core oil filter. Stay away from all e-core oil filters. The PF48 oil filter you are using has been discontinued in favor of the PF48E part number. Do yourself a favor and get the PF63 oil filter instead or a Fram Ultra XG 10575. Mobil 1 5W30 is perfect for your truck, but Mobil 1 is NOT the factory fill and it isn't what GM dealers use for oil changes on 99% of GM vehicles.


Can you still get the PF48 "classic" at the parts chains? Back when we had an Olds I'd always buy the oil at Walmart and the filter at Az because they had the non-ecore classic while Walmart sold only the ecore version.

 

[Cujet]

Originally Posted By: bluesubie
Originally Posted By: demarpaint


I'm sure there are several members here that can rattle off a few makes and models with engineering problems requiring service interval modifications that were discovered after the book was written. For starters I recall OLM's being re-calibrated because of issues, etc. etc. Not everything people do here that's not is in the book is to feel good.

One thing that following the manufacturers original OCI recommendation got me, and many other 2.5L turbo Subaru owners, was a blown turbo and a wallet that was lighter by $2,000.

p.s. - Still trying to figure out what outhink means. Is that French?

-Dennis


I love the attempt at minimizing the issue. (a few makes and models, HA) Ford's Cam Phasers, used in just about every engine Ford produces now, do far better with increased viscosity, and synthetics. So don't purchase a Ford, don't purchase a VW diesel, don't purchase a GM product with a balancer chain, or anything turbo, and so on. OR choose oil by it's ability to protect, instead of it's ability to reduce fuel consumption.

 

[gfh77665]

Originally Posted By: 2010_FX4
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
And thats perfectly fine. Its your prerogative to blindly follow the print you read in your manual. Personally, I engage my brain when I make a decision. Best example is CAFE dictated viscosities.
Despite the move to "CAFE dictated viscosities" as you say, what harm has it done? I live in the same climate that you do and xW-20 has served my engine(s) well--even while towing and in Nevada/Montana heat of 115F+. I have said it before that when xW-16 and xW-12 are the main stays, everyone on BITOG will be talking about how thick xW-20 is...


You need to ask the manufactures. Ask them why they replaced the term "optimal protection" with the term "adequate protection". Let us know what you find out, thanks.

 

[WiskyBadger]

Originally Posted By: stchman
Originally Posted By: zach1900
Originally Posted By: bigt61
Originally Posted By: ChevyBadger
Its good to question all things in life, otherwise you're just one of the sheep that listens to the dictator.

You mean a Democrat?

So true my friend, though establishment Dems and Gops are more alike than different, it's all window dressing.


OK, the topic changed direction.

The Democrats and Republicans are the reason that I am becoming more and more Libertarian every day.
Right on man