Is 10W-30 really obsolete?

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: Garak
To be fair, we're in the PCMO forum, and I think we're mainly addressing gasoline passenger vehicles, not garden tractors, diesels, or air compressors, all of which may call for a 10w-30 of one sort or another.


I guess that it would be also only fair to limit the discussion of uber VI, thin oils to the PCMO portion of the board (which the OEMs and oil manufacturers have indicated is either CAFE, or CO2 driven), and avoid dragging the rest of the forum off topic.

 

[BISCUT]

Originally Posted By: bigt61
It might be a touch more shear resistant, but that was more true 20 years ago. Modern 5W-30 has made 10W-30 pretty much irrelevant.


+1

I'm not asking to be a wise arse; but because I don't know the true answer. Is there any plausable reason to purchase a 10-30 over a 5-30 for any modern engine? Assuming a vehicle 2000 and newer; SN rated comparison; and nothing exotic.

 

[A_Harman]

Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: Garak
Well, I guess Merkava will have to clarify.


The 2000 Buick LeSabre owners manual specifies 10W-30 above
0 degrees F, but 5W-30 is okay for 61 degrees F and below.

The 2004 Buick LeSabre owners manual says 10W-30 is okay
above 0 degrees F, but 5W-30 is preferred for all temperatures.

Both cars have the same exact engine.


The change in oil specification may have something to do with GM redesigning the engine between 2000 and 2004. The 3800 Series II was introduced in 1995, and the 3800 Series III was introduced in 2003.

 

[pcoxe]

I wonder if 10w-30 would be better for DI engines that are prone to fuel dilution in the oil. The extra thickness when cold might reduce the amount of fuel getting past the rings during richer cold starts.

 

[05LGTLtd]

Take a look at the NOACK and HTHS specs on PU 10w30. There are a few oils like GC that can beat it for HTHS, but that NOACK is crazy low. It's a stand out as far as 10w-30's if you are looking to optimize those specs. VI is low, but for the lower half of the country, it's still a 3-4 season oil.

I've been switching around some, but since my Walmart still has PU, and I'm considering switching back to the PU 10w-30. If I had a Five dollar coupon off a PU Jug I'd buy as many 10w-30's as they let me...

 

[Flareside302]

Originally Posted By: 05LGTLtd
Take a look at the NOACK and HTHS specs on PU 10w30. There are a few oils like GC that can beat it for HTHS, but that NOACK is crazy low. It's a stand out as far as 10w-30's if you are looking to optimize those specs. VI is low, but for the lower half of the country, it's still a 3-4 season oil.

I've been switching around some, but since my Walmart still has PU, and I'm considering switching back to the PU 10w-30. If I had a Five dollar coupon off a PU Jug I'd buy as many 10w-30's as they let me...


PU is definitely the top tier OTS oil right now with their EXTREMLY LOW NOACK.

 

[The motor guy]

It's all down south

 

[javacontour]

Obsolete? Probably not.

Out of favor? For newly built gasoline powered passenger cars, it's moving that way.

You also have to ask where. My answers assume North America. What about Europe, Asia and Australia?

Your mileage may vary.

 

[TFB1]

Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: Garak
Well, I guess Merkava will have to clarify.


The 2000 Buick LeSabre owners manual specifies 10W-30 above
0 degrees F, but 5W-30 is okay for 61 degrees F and below.

The 2004 Buick LeSabre owners manual says 10W-30 is okay
above 0 degrees F, but 5W-30 is preferred for all temperatures.

Both cars have the same exact engine.


The 2004 recommendation allows for oil improvement and tightening CAFE regulations, and really that's it in a nutshell...

Some of use are hoping 10W-30 HDEO will be around a long, long time as we use it in our older vehicles rather than some boutique oil that sell 4-5X prices...

 

[NHGUY]

20/50 and 10/40 will be gone long before 10/30.

 

[KCJeep]

Nope, not at all. Certainly out of fashion here though. Plenty of vehicles still driving around that the manual specs 10w30 as preferred (such as my Jeep).

20w50 is obsolete for all but obscure uses, not 10w30.

This thread is another example of the classic BITOG contradictions too... compare 10w30 vs 5w30 and "today's 5w30's are so good there's no need for 10w30" are typical responses. But peruse a typical 5w20 vs 5w30 thread and "the 5w30 will most likely shear to a 20 grade anyway" are common posts.

Can't have it both ways. I still find 10w30 quite useful, and just about anything will run great on it.

 

[y_p_w]

I remember there were some cars that only specified 10W-30 or heavier weights, such as the Acura NSX or the Honda S2000. There are still a lot of cars on the road with 10W-30 as the preferred weight. That might not mean a modern 5W-30 wouldn't work just fine, but most people don't tinker with that.

Even back (early 90s) when 5W-30 became more prevalent, it was hard to find. Most owners manuals said that 10W-30 was OK for certain ambient temps (above maybe -10 F) , and it was almost always what a quick lube place would have. By the mid 90s 5W-30 was ubiquitous.

 

[jrustles]

Generally speaking, 10w30's have been evolving just as quickly as 5w30, it's not like they use specially selected [censored] Gr1 base oils they they've been keeping in tanks since the 80s. The only thing it'll be missing is as much PPD/VII as the 5w30, generally speaking. This translates into lower NOACK and better shear stability, no matter how good 5w30 mineral oils will be, the 10w30 counterpart will always be more shear stable. Lacking as much polymers, the 10w30 might fare better in varnish/deposit if an OCI were to get really out of hand, or the engine were to overheat. If I were taking a cross country trip or driving hundreds of KM each day, I would probably intentionally select 10w30, synthetic or mineral, for a 5w30 spec'd car.

So the question: Is it really obsolete?

Well, who told you it was obsolete? Certainly not the oil blenders, and certainly not the American Southerners

 

[05foresterXT]

I'd still use a GOOD 10w30 in a turbo motor, or in warmer months.

 

[Hyde244]

I just bought some PP 10w30 for my girlfriend's Chrysler Sebring to be used next summer.

It was a great deal on sale, and offers a better Noack than 5w30. Since she is burning oil, I figured it would be worth a shot!

 

[Eddie]

Long live 10w30)

 

[stchman]

Originally Posted By: Realtech214
Well I live in Florida so theres really no reason to use 5w 0r 10w. Since 15w40 must be better


By that logic, 20W50 must be even better!!!

If you are in a climate where it is always warm 10W30 and 5W30 are essentially the same.

Just use what the manufacturer recommends.

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: A_Harman
I think 10w30 synthetic is obsolete.
10w30 dino isn't.

That pretty much sums it up.
Virtually no auto manufacturer in NA, Europe or Japan specifies the 10W-30 grade any longer and of course a syn' 10W-30 has never been specified because it is technically redundant.

 

[lubedude13]

At lower temps. Maybe the same at running temp but it would flow slower at cold temps

 

[Merkava_4]

Originally Posted By: jrustles

Well, who told you it was obsolete? Certainly not the oil blenders, and certainly not the American Southerners

CATERHAM. He has told me it was obsolete many, many times.