First Time Gun Owner - Question

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Congratulations on making the decision to exercise your 2nd Amendment rights. You're going to find shooting to be a lot of fun! And you're very quickly going to want to add more firearms to your collection.

Those who have said that a handgun is just as easily locked up and kept safe from your kids are correct. Also, don't fall into the thinking that it's safer to leave a long gun sitting around.

I also agree with those who say just get a 12-GA. With low-recoil loads, and proper shooting technique (hold the stock tightly against the shoulder and lean forward a bit, into the stock), perceived recoil won't be much more than a 20-GA.

Here's an idea: I bought my sister a Maverick 88 shotgun for Christmas last year. Got it on sale for
That would leave you $$ to go out and get your (inevitable) next gun!
 
Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
Originally Posted By: Al
You can't shoot clays a 20 ga.

Incorrect.

lol...OK..I shoot clay birds 5 times a week and I can hit with 20 gauge but as a practical matter..let me know know many trap shooters use a 20 ga....lol

I just love how smug people are.
smile.gif
 
Originally Posted By: Kawiguy454


I guarantee if some tweaked up crack clown starts messing with your window or door his highly tuned criminal sonar will detect the distinctive sound a pump makes when you rack a round with authority. ...he will turn around and live another day. And you wont have a mess on your hands.


Urban myth.

And if the bad guy is a career criminal intent on bad deeds you just gave him your location and you gave up the element of surprise. And you're starting a potentially deadly high stress event with an empty weapon.

A 12 gauge shotgun with light loads doesn't do your wife much good if she can't present it. Hogue makes an 870 youth stock with a 12" LOP.
 
Originally Posted By: Al
Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
Originally Posted By: Al
You can't shoot clays a 20 ga.

Incorrect.

lol...OK..I shoot clay birds 5 times a week and I can hit with 20 gauge but as a practical matter..let me know know many trap shooters use a 20 ga....lol

I just love how smug people are.
smile.gif



You were, and remain, wrong.

The rebuttal with reliance on logical fallacy is pitiful.
 
Gun-proofing children is a lot like teaching them how to behave around swimming pools and not to play with matches.

My late husband was a teacher, and also a firearms safety instructor. If anyone's interested, this is how he gun-proofed his son:

When the boy was very small he didn't know there were guns in the house. When he was seven and getting curious about guns, his dad explained that guns were not toys, but very dangerous tools, like his shop tools. He took his son to the firing range, put a canteloupe on a rail, and again explained that guns were very, very dangerous and not toys.

Without putting hearing protection on his son (just this one time), he shot the canteloupe once with his .45. It was so loud, the canteloupe exploded so spectacularly, the boy was absolutely shocked. It was like nothing he had seen on TV. Then my husband asked him if he now understood that guns are not toys. The kid could only nod his head with his mouth hanging open, "Yes, Papa."

After that, the boy understood that if he ever wanted to see his dad's guns he only had to ask and his dad would get them out for him. He had to memorize the Four Rules of Firearm Safety, learned how to clean the weapons, and got taken to the range for lessons.

When watching TV together, they played a game to see who could count the most violations of the Four Rules of Firearm Safety. "He didn't check to see if the gun was loaded when he picked it up!" "She had her finger on the trigger when she wasn't ready to fire!" This reinforced the rules to him.

The Four Rules of Firearm Safety:

1. Treat every gun as a loaded gun, every time you pick it up. Even if you just put it down for only a moment, check it again when you pick it up. Make it a habit.

2. Never point your gun at anything you don't wish to totally destroy. Don't sweep the muzzle around the room or gesture with a gun in your hand.

3. Never put your finger on the trigger until you're aimed at your intended target and ready to fire.

4. Always be aware of your target background. If you miss or the round penetrates your target, what's behind that wall?

HTH.
 
Both the 500 and 870 are reliable guns and will work for your purpose. I'd stick with the 870 however. They have a steel receiver wich I personally like and are the gold standard of pump guns. They also don't rattle when hunting and are super easy to upgrade or service. Look around at cabelas etc and score a good used gun.

My favorite pumps are Ithica 37s and the BPS but they are more spendy and don't work any better than the 870
 
Originally Posted By: shiny
Gun-proofing children is a lot like teaching them how to behave around swimming pools and not to play with matches.

My late husband was a teacher, and also a firearms safety instructor. If anyone's interested, this is how he gun-proofed his son:

When the boy was very small he didn't know there were guns in the house. When he was seven and getting curious about guns, his dad explained that guns were not toys, but very dangerous tools, like his shop tools. He took his son to the firing range, put a canteloupe on a rail, and again explained that guns were very, very dangerous and not toys.

Without putting hearing protection on his son (just this one time), he shot the canteloupe once with his .45. It was so loud, the canteloupe exploded so spectacularly, the boy was absolutely shocked. It was like nothing he had seen on TV. Then my husband asked him if he now understood that guns are not toys. The kid could only nod his head with his mouth hanging open, "Yes, Papa."

After that, the boy understood that if he ever wanted to see his dad's guns he only had to ask and his dad would get them out for him. He had to memorize the Four Rules of Firearm Safety, learned how to clean the weapons, and got taken to the range for lessons.

When watching TV together, they played a game to see who could count the most violations of the Four Rules of Firearm Safety. "He didn't check to see if the gun was loaded when he picked it up!" "She had her finger on the trigger when she wasn't ready to fire!" This reinforced the rules to him.

The Four Rules of Firearm Safety:

1. Treat every gun as a loaded gun, every time you pick it up. Even if you just put it down for only a moment, check it again when you pick it up. Make it a habit.

2. Never point your gun at anything you don't wish to totally destroy. Don't sweep the muzzle around the room or gesture with a gun in your hand.

3. Never put your finger on the trigger until you're aimed at your intended target and ready to fire.

4. Always be aware of your target background. If you miss or the round penetrates your target, what's behind that wall?

HTH.


Fantastic post!

Sharing with my sister and her husband, who have 2 small boys and are gun owners.
 
Originally Posted By: shiny
Gun-proofing children is a lot like teaching them how to behave around swimming pools and not to play with matches.

My late husband was a teacher, and also a firearms safety instructor. If anyone's interested, this is how he gun-proofed his son:

When the boy was very small he didn't know there were guns in the house. When he was seven and getting curious about guns, his dad explained that guns were not toys, but very dangerous tools, like his shop tools. He took his son to the firing range, put a canteloupe on a rail, and again explained that guns were very, very dangerous and not toys.

Without putting hearing protection on his son (just this one time), he shot the canteloupe once with his .45. It was so loud, the canteloupe exploded so spectacularly, the boy was absolutely shocked. It was like nothing he had seen on TV. Then my husband asked him if he now understood that guns are not toys. The kid could only nod his head with his mouth hanging open, "Yes, Papa."

After that, the boy understood that if he ever wanted to see his dad's guns he only had to ask and his dad would get them out for him. He had to memorize the Four Rules of Firearm Safety, learned how to clean the weapons, and got taken to the range for lessons.

When watching TV together, they played a game to see who could count the most violations of the Four Rules of Firearm Safety. "He didn't check to see if the gun was loaded when he picked it up!" "She had her finger on the trigger when she wasn't ready to fire!" This reinforced the rules to him.

The Four Rules of Firearm Safety:

1. Treat every gun as a loaded gun, every time you pick it up. Even if you just put it down for only a moment, check it again when you pick it up. Make it a habit.

2. Never point your gun at anything you don't wish to totally destroy. Don't sweep the muzzle around the room or gesture with a gun in your hand.

3. Never put your finger on the trigger until you're aimed at your intended target and ready to fire.

4. Always be aware of your target background. If you miss or the round penetrates your target, what's behind that wall?

HTH.


I do a fair amount of training with some very switched on people (current/former SEAL/Delta/Ranger/etc.) and those 4 rules are repeated and explained often, before the beginnings of each class. It does NOT MATTER how familiar, experienced, or well trained you are. Those rules, and that mentality, are ALWAYS pertinent! Excellent post. My father did very similar with me, when I was 3-4 years old, with his .357 Magnum. Except he used a big clod of dirt/mud.
 
Originally Posted By: AZjeff
Originally Posted By: Kawiguy454


I guarantee if some tweaked up crack clown starts messing with your window or door his highly tuned criminal sonar will detect the distinctive sound a pump makes when you rack a round with authority. ...he will turn around and live another day. And you wont have a mess on your hands.


Urban myth.

And if the bad guy is a career criminal intent on bad deeds you just gave him your location and you gave up the element of surprise. And you're starting a potentially deadly high stress event with an empty weapon.

A 12 gauge shotgun with light loads doesn't do your wife much good if she can't present it. Hogue makes an 870 youth stock with a 12" LOP.


Most people I know are best served by around a 12" LOP on a combat shotgun. Clays...not so much. but that's a different thing.
 
Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
Originally Posted By: Al
Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
Originally Posted By: Al
You can't shoot clays a 20 ga.

Incorrect.

lol...OK..I shoot clay birds 5 times a week and I can hit with 20 gauge but as a practical matter..let me know know many trap shooters use a 20 ga....lol

I just love how smug people are.
smile.gif



You were, and remain, wrong.

The rebuttal with reliance on logical fallacy is pitiful.


There are people that actually use a 28 or 410 gauge for busting clays. I know when I want a challenge I take out the old 410 to see what I can do.

http://www.nssa-nsca.org/index.php/nssa-...-shoot-the-410/


As for the suggestion to get a 22, I say that is a bully idea, IF you can get ammo in your area at a decent price. I cut my teeth at 5 on a Winchester 69 22 bolt action. Had a 5 round detachable mag.
 
Get a Mossberg Maverick 88 12ga with a cylinder bore barrel. You can get one for $250-$300 and see if you like it. It will do the same job as any other 12ga. I have several guns but always like a 12ga but didn't want to spend too much $$ because my kids are in College.

Then if you really like shotgunning....you can upgrade later. If not, you aren't out too much $$.


http://blog.cheaperthandirt.com/mossberg-maverick-88-shotgun/

BTW, you don't need a safe...you can get a Stack On security steel gun cabinet for $100

https://www.stack-on.com/categories/security-cabinets
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: HerrStig
How many small children can figure out the safety systems on a 1911 without help, or have the strength to work the slide? A revolver, on the other hand, is just too easy to work.


My cousin and I did once when I was 4 years old. he shot a hole in the floor.
 
Originally Posted By: Robenstein

There are people that actually use a 28 or 410 gauge for busting clays. I know when I want a challenge I take out the old 410 to see what I can do.


Yea fair enough. I am just saying almost no one would buy a 20 to shoot clays if they had only 1 shotie.

Originally Posted By: Ws6
I've shot 870's and Mossberg 590's.
Half dozen one or the other. both of them lack in QA/QC, in my opinion, by a lot.

Yea..very true but if the 870 works well for the first few boxes of shells it should be at least reliable.

My son bought one for learning to shoot clays and he just went out and bought it with asking me. ...and I have a Model 12 which is his for the asking.

Now he won't get my 1927 Iver Johnsons though..lol.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Al
Originally Posted By: Robenstein

There are people that actually use a 28 or 410 gauge for busting clays. I know when I want a challenge I take out the old 410 to see what I can do.


Yea fair enough. I am just saying almost no one would buy a 20 to shoot clays if they had only 1 shotie.

Originally Posted By: Ws6
I've shot 870's and Mossberg 590's.
Half dozen one or the other. both of them lack in QA/QC, in my opinion, by a lot.

Yea..very true but if the 870 works well for the first few boxes of shells it should be at least reliable.

My son bought one for learning to shoot clays and he just went out and bought it with asking me. ...and I have a Model 12 which is his for the asking.

Now he won't get my 1927 Iver Johnsons though..lol.


Better yet, go buy a used 70's Wingmaster and a spare 20" IC choked barrel with rifle sights. You have an amazing piece of craftsmanship that can be used for duck, clays, etc. or HD and deer, as the mood strikes.
 
Originally Posted By: Al
Get a 12 Gauge. You can pick up an 870 for $275 if you watch for sales. Do not consider anything except a 12 Gauge You can't shoot clays a 20 ga.

Keep control of the shells and don't lock it up.

Really? That's just nonsense. See my screen name. The competitive sport of American Skeet (as opposed to International) uses all four gauges.
Mike B
PS: and please stop using "shotie" - it makes me want to kick puppies.
 
Last edited:
You can't go wrong with an 870 in either 12 gauge or 20 gauge. I'd have a strong preference for the former, but again it comes down to personal preference and what your shoulder can handle(BTW, in my experience a lightweight 20 is more punishing than a heavy 12).

BTW, one thing to remember when practicing is that the "bulk" ammo you buy(including the $5/25 and $50/250) is usually low brass "range" ammo that designed for someone to shoot all day and not beat themselves up. High brass hunting and SD ammmo usually has MUCH more recoil than range ammo. I'd strongly suggest firing several rounds of the ammo you plan to keep loaded in the gun at the range to become familiar with it.

Someone mentioned above not keeping a round chambered. I'm skeptical of the "bad guy wetting his pants when you rack the gun" theory, but I think it's in general good advice with a shot gun. The reason is that-as a general rule-shotguns aren't drop safe and have been known go off when dropped. The typical "button" safety on the trigger guard(or tang safety on some gun types) is really just a trigger block and not a firing pin block. The only shotgun I feel sort of safe keeping chambered is a Winchester 97 on half cock, but even then half cock isn't really a safety(and I'm not going to completely lower the hammer on one with a round chambered). Even in that condition, I still either thumb the hammer back or rack the gun.
 
Originally Posted By: bunnspecial

Someone mentioned above not keeping a round chambered. I'm skeptical of the "bad guy wetting his pants when you rack the gun" theory, but I think it's in general good advice with a shot gun. The reason is that-as a general rule-shotguns aren't drop safe and have been known go off when dropped. The typical "button" safety on the trigger guard(or tang safety on some gun types) is really just a trigger block and not a firing pin block.


Agreed....
 
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