energy usage calculation for home cooling

Joined
Jul 10, 2012
Messages
20,901
Location
North Carolina Coast
I know this is a long shot and maybe some day my A.D.D. will have me set the time aside to figure this out. The answer might help others too. I dont know. This is some really deep thought process in regards to energy consumption by our HVAC running in the summer.
Note, we never open windows, so it will and always be running frequently.

Structure-
New home, 2023 - 1800 sq ft., stick construction, slab, vinyl siding, one level, HIP roof, R-15 wall insulation, R-32 blown in the attic, Low E glass, slightly above builder grade LENOX 2 ton HVAC heat pump, ML17XP1-024 south facing house bakes in the sunlight all day long,

Ok, so, right now, maybe because the ground is still cool is a possibility.
We have been running the AC unit at 70 degrees from 11:15pm to 7:15AM
At 7:15AM the thermostat automatically goes up to 77 degrees
At 2PM the thermostat goes higher to 79 degrees
At 6PM the thermostat goes to 75 degrees then the cycle repeats going down to 70 degrees at 11PM

Peak rate is 21.5 cents kWh for 4 hours 2pm to 6pm, the other 20 hours the off peak rate is 7.95 cents a kWh.

I used to set the thermostat at 73 while sleeping but I have observed the following such as today. Bright sunshine, no clouds, 87 degrees at 4PM
Last night at 11:15PM the AC kicks down to 70 degrees, we love sleeping in the cold. when it kicks up to 77 degrees at 7:15 such as today, it is now 87 degrees outside at 4Pm, that is already 2 hours into the peak time and the AC unit has not turned on all day long since 7:15AM from its night time setting of 70 degrees. ON top of that, the house is still only 76 degrees. It is very possible it will not turn on by the time the peak expires at 6PM.

So the question is, is setting the night time thermostat to 70 degrees noting what I typed above saving money over setting the night time temperature like we used too at 73 degrees leaving all other settings the same?

I have another wrinkle that I think 70 degrees might be in favor. The night time setting down to 70 degrees is just that, nighttime when the night time air is MUCH cooler making the unit much more efficient. Being we live near the ocean, once night time falls and the sea breeze finishes cooling outside down it is significantly cooler. Like tonight with a high temp of 87 daytime, it will be 60/70 degrees night time. As summer goes into full swing those night time temps will be higher but still lower than daytime.

I don't expect many comments, I know this sounds insane. I think there is a thread somewhere on over thinking... but thinking is good, I think!

Honestly? we normally have our daytime temperature as it is, 77 degrees, after dinner time 75 and sleep time 73 this was last year and years before. However this is the first year of peak rates in this home.

So, I am wondering, after observing that when kicking the AC down to 70 at night, which we like. 11pm to 7am, once it bumps up to 77 degrees at 7am, then to 79 degrees 2 to 6PM the unit doesn't come on, though I do expect at times it will for the last two hours but not sure how much. I just know what is happening now.
 
Last edited:
To be honest , I tried to read your post but it was going to take WAY more concentration than I was able to muster up. Good luck to you ... :geek:
Yeah, I agree this has to be edge of insanity.
But there might be somebody out there who might be able to somehow enjoy figuring this out.🤔
 
1 - Won't you have an idea if this is cost effective when you get your electric bill?

2- When you're done thinking and figuring on this look into a whole house fan to pull that cool outside air in instead of cooling the air in the house.
 
since your peak time is 2pm you could set it to 73 and have it change to 79 at 2pm
save more. then back to 73f at 6pm.
of course I cant sleep well at 73f.

Also if it doesnt run for 8 hours usually parts of the house are becoming much warmer. and others are not.

1 - Won't you have an idea if this is cost effective when you get your electric bill?

2- When you're done thinking and figuring on this look into a whole house fan to pull that cool outside air in instead of cooling the air in the house.
except the air will be muggy and take additional electricity to cool..
it might be warm until late in the night.

Spring and fall whole house exhaust fan works good in Ohio.. summer not so much.
I'd imagine NC is worse.
 
My guess - your running your AC during a time that ambient is quite cool, so your system if very efficient.

Pre-cooling the house down to 70F during low ambient temperatures - new construction, fairly well insulated by Southern standards, your system set to 77F likely doesn't kick on until much later in the day.

The big commercial AC controllers use something called "intelligent recovery" or similar - I think that one is a trademark, where they actually learn these curves and do things like this specifically - like pre-cool when its cool outside.

If you really wanted to know you need to figure out how to log your system for when its actually running and then try different settings and compare results. I haven't looked for one in a long time but I assume there are some pretty low cost data loggers out there at this point.

Willmington over the last day:

1779227095840.webp
 
There are things which you're not tracking which induce significant variability into the equation:
- direct thermal loading due to sunshine and shade; this is something you can't adjust for easily
- thermal mass balance; everything in your house has mass, not just the air. So the air can cool quickly, but the objects in the house won't change temps nearly as quickly (walls, tables, chairs, books, cabinets, etc ....). Large mass objects lag air temps significantly in rates of change.
- ambient temp change rates; how quick does the outside air heat up or cool down - this isn't a constant rate by any means and will vary by the hour
 
I think the major unknown variable here in determining total energy usage is: how long is your system active between each temperature setting? That is, your system cycles on and off for different periods depending on temp settings.
 
I know this is a long shot and maybe some day my A.D.D. will have me set the time aside to figure this out. The answer might help others too. I dont know. This is some really deep thought process in regards to energy consumption by our HVAC running in the summer.
Note, we never open windows, so it will and always be running frequently.

Structure-
New home, 2023 - 1800 sq ft., stick construction, slab, vinyl siding, one level, HIP roof, R-15 wall insulation, R-32 blown in the attic, Low E glass, slightly above builder grade LENOX 2 ton HVAC heat pump, ML17XP1-024 south facing house bakes in the sunlight all day long,

Ok, so, right now, maybe because the ground is still cool is a possibility.
We have been running the AC unit at 70 degrees from 11:15pm to 7:15AM
At 7:15AM the thermostat automatically goes up to 77 degrees
At 2PM the thermostat goes higher to 79 degrees
At 6PM the thermostat goes to 75 degrees then the cycle repeats going down to 70 degrees at 11PM

Peak rate is 21.5 cents kWh for 4 hours 2pm to 6pm, the other 20 hours the off peak rate is 7.95 cents a kWh.

I used to set the thermostat at 73 while sleeping but I have observed the following such as today. Bright sunshine, no clouds, 87 degrees at 4PM
Last night at 11:15PM the AC kicks down to 70 degrees, we love sleeping in the cold. when it kicks up to 77 degrees at 7:15 such as today, it is now 87 degrees outside at 4Pm, that is already 2 hours into the peak time and the AC unit has not turned on all day long since 7:15AM from its night time setting of 70 degrees. ON top of that, the house is still only 76 degrees. It is very possible it will not turn on by the time the peak expires at 6PM.

So the question is, is setting the night time thermostat to 70 degrees noting what I typed above saving money over setting the night time temperature like we used too at 73 degrees leaving all other settings the same?

I have another wrinkle that I think 70 degrees might be in favor. The night time setting down to 70 degrees is just that, nighttime when the night time air is MUCH cooler making the unit much more efficient. Being we live near the ocean, once night time falls and the sea breeze finishes cooling outside down it is significantly cooler. Like tonight with a high temp of 87 daytime, it will be 60/70 degrees night time. As summer goes into full swing those night time temps will be higher but still lower than daytime.

I don't expect many comments, I know this sounds insane. I think there is a thread somewhere on over thinking... but thinking is good, I think!

Honestly? we normally have our daytime temperature as it is, 77 degrees, after dinner time 75 and sleep time 73 this was last year and years before. However this is the first year of peak rates in this home.

So, I am wondering, after observing that when kicking the AC down to 70 at night, which we like. 11pm to 7am, once it bumps up to 77 degrees at 7am, then to 79 degrees 2 to 6PM the unit doesn't come on, though I do expect at times it will for the last two hours but not sure how much. I just know what is happening now.
Get a dehumidifier so you can run your A/C for cooling and not for dehumidification. I find this lets a warmer temp feel comfortable.
 
I used to do something similar in Illinois when I had real-time electricity pricing. The peak cost was from 2:00-7:00PM, so I would set the temperature to whatever I wanted in the morning then about 1:00 turn the temperature down a couple degrees to bank some cold in the house. At 2:00 I would turn the A/C off and leave it off until peak demand went away, then turn the A/C back on. I have no clue how much it saved, but it did and it was much simpler than trying to calculate the savings.
 
Are you asking if getting ahead of the game on off peak rates is saving you money when peak rates arrive?
Yes
I am also curious if Cooling the house more than normal during cooler nighttime temperatures is more efficient since that cold air in the house is now stored in the house and can run through most of the day without the unit turning on
 
I used to do something similar in Illinois when I had real-time electricity pricing. The peak cost was from 2:00-7:00PM, so I would set the temperature to whatever I wanted in the morning then about 1:00 turn the temperature down a couple degrees to bank some cold in the house. At 2:00 I would turn the A/C off and leave it off until peak demand went away, then turn the A/C back on. I have no clue how much it saved, but it did and it was much simpler than trying to calculate the savings.
Yes, I get that. It was more of a fun type of question if that makes any sense?
Our electric here is cheap and our house 16 years before this in that area was even less expensive than now.

Part of the question though was being conservative with the thermostat we used to sleep at 73° at night however we find it much more pleasant sleeping at 70 and actually pulling a sheet and a blanket over us at night while we sleep. So once I started overthinking all this, I started thinking I might even be saving money doing that because the house seems to hold the cold air throughout the day since we bump up the thermostat until evening anyway
 
Back
Top Bottom