Why not? It can handle it.
Heat Pump in Northern Climates?
- Thread starter tbm5690
- Start date
We've bottomed out here already and temps are already going up but the low Monday night is going to be 3F, the high Tuesday 8F and Tuesday night's low is -1F. Set it at zero and see what happens? It's technically rated to -5F. If I do this I'll do it while I'm home and if it's struggling I'll discontinue the experiment.
No need to do that. I believe most modern systems are somewhat smart and if it runs the HP at max for a certain period of time without hitting the set point it will turn on the aux heat to bring it up to the set temp. Heatpumps are most efficient that way and it will decrease the amount of gas/oil burned since it only needs to use the aux/emergency heat to make up some of the difference.
what are compared energy bills before & after installation ?
i´m not a believer into these reverse fridges. flame was mens best friend for thousands years.
i´m not a believer into these reverse fridges. flame was mens best friend for thousands years.
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The first 5 minutes your Bosch is actually running heat mode but it takes the compressor awhile to ramp up and start making heat. I have the IDS 1.0 system and its the same way. Ive installed a ton of the IDS 1.0 systems but have yet to do any 2.0 Bosch was supposed to fix this issue with 2.0 but I dont know if they actually did.
Is your oil furnace not kicking on during defrost? The heat pump sends a signal to the furnace in defrost mode to kick on the oil to help with defrost and also prevent super cold air from blowing from the vents.
No, that's not how it works. Defrost is simply the AC going on - the air-handler goes on without the condensing unit fan going on - heat from inside the house is used to heat the refrigerant and it's sent to the condenser to defrost. Once a certain temperature is reached, the reversing valve switches and now the condenser fan goes on and heat is pulled from the outside air and sent to the coil in the AH. The downside to defrost mode is it produces cold air during that time - just like it does in AC mode.
Again, it's not running in heat mode when it's in defrost mode. The condenser is outside a window and I can see it - normally a heat call turns the condenser fan on immediately and yes, it still takes a min or two to produce heat. The defrost cycle doesn't happen every time but when it does the condenser fan does not turn on but the AH does. If you watch the outside condenser you will actually see steam coming out of it and snow actively melting anywhere it's close to the coil. The AH at this point is producing cold air just like in AC mode. When the consider reaches a certain temp, the condenser fan turns on and the reverse valve reverses and heat is produced.
The baseboard oil boiler in my basement has absolutely NOTHING to do with my heat pump in the attic - there is no relationship or communication between the two at all except through the thermostat but it is HP OR oil boiler - those are the only two options. If the HP can't keep up or the outside temp below the switchover temp then the T-stat shuts the HP down and simply turns on the zone for the oil boiler.
There are more advanced heat pumps that work down to about -10F but the quality of the heat is meh
AKA The colder it gets the more lukewarm your “hot air gets” AKA large volumes of 72F heated air technically is heat but it’s not pleasant not to mention economically unless something dramatic changes in energy prices
heat pumps aren’t economical much below 20-30F
If the cost of a unit is basically the same as AC by all means get one as a furnace backup is always prudent but don’t expect to save lots of money
You don't believe in physics, thermodynamics.........only chemistry? Hahahhaha I'm kidding of course.
Heat pumps have a place. That place is NOT all by themselves in northern climates. Period. Dual source is the way to go. Shoulder seasons, no need to burn LP/oil on cool mornings or maintain the temp. Need a quick ramp up? Combustion, efficient combustion.
My electricity is much cheaper than oil at the moment. So far I estimate I'm spending about $200 less in oil per month but spending an additional $100 more in electricity. It is not an easy comparison as this year has been warmer than last year but it's as close I can estimate it.
At 10F my HP produces 91F air.
At 20F it produces 99-100F air.
At 35F it produces 103F air.
That is measured directly at the supply vent after running through an uninsulated attic.
The average run time to reach temp is about 12 mins and I'm spending +$100 less per month on heat this winter compared to last year only using oil.
What's wrong with the quality of that heat? My unit is rated to -5F and it's supposed to be 0F tonight - I'll measure supply temps.
Yes, they are pushing the envelope up north but the technology is evolving. My backup is a propane boiler. In my case, it was that I wanted AC, and for a few bucks more I got a heat pump that carries the load during the shoulder season at less than half the cost of propane. ( no natural gas here).
I encourage everyone to calculate their cost per GJ for types of energy available. Yes, heat pumps have a hard time competeting with natural gas, but compete well with oil and propane. The newer low temp heat pumps have been mentioned on this thread.
Modern heat pumps are 3-5x more efficient than gas, at minimum. This is definitely a situation where the "nothing has changed in the last 30 years" mindset sadly prevails. Heat pumps will, in essentially EVERY situation, save money on utility bills over gas unless you are at -30F or below for months on end.
This isn't 1990. Your information is years out of date.
Here is my latest gas bill in regard to my past posts, we have natural gas hot air on the main level, heat pump second level that has 4 bedrooms, pretty much keep heat pump off all winter long except for any guests that might stay for a day or two because they close their bedroom doors at night, heat rises so we rely on main floor gas when no one here to heat the second floor simply by keeping the door open to the two "offices" my wife and I use. Our electric bill is under $100 a month this time of year. Here is this months natural gas bill which I think someone asked me to post over the winter since gas is cheap here?
that makes sense, i wonder what gas is inside. probably something eco, with high boil temp.
one of our 2 stage temp test systems, big compressors 3phase
r404a + r23 (fluoroform) not very eco friendly. (mandatory annual gas checks.)
heatpump in similar fashion could work in upper canada.
https://www.directindustry.com/prod/voetsch-industrietechnik/product-16219-424325.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_refrigerants
not many gases that are safe in case of leak.
My last oil fill was $560 and that is going to last about 5-6 weeks which were a relatively warm 5 weeks - highs in the 30's and low 40's and lows in the 20's. When we have a cold snap where highs are in the single digits and lows are negative it's more like 3-4 weeks per tank if we have a few of those. They typically only last 3-5 days and then it warms but sometimes they can happen several times in 6-8 week period.
^^^ Yeah, I kind of get the heat cost up north, born, raised and most my adult life on Long Island NY (used to have oil heat there too)
