Cold engine noise with Amsoil 0w30 in a Toyota 3.5

[Colt]

I like and have used Amsoil for quite awhile in other vehicles.
However,in the wife's RX 350 3.5L V6,Amsoil 0W30 caused some noise at start up(sort of like a rapping sound) until warm.Not really heard at idle,more in gear driving.Kept the Amsoil in for awhile and in a dealer visit,went back to Toyota dino and it was much quieter but want to stay with synthetic.
My question is would Amsoil 5w30 or even 10w30(cold weather?) cause the engine be as quiet as the Toyota dino with cold start up?
My ES V6 3.5L is quiet on start up and I'll try the 0w30 SSO or maybe just go with Amsoil 5w30 at about 8K miles.

 

[Gary Allan]

I'm curious about the origin of this noise. While we've discussed tonal qualities of various fluids (as odd as it seems) the onset of noise off idle between any conventional vs. synthetic over the same conditions would be peculiar. The synthetic, assuming like hot visc, will surely be thinner than its conventional counterpart at any point where it mattered.

What filter was in use?

I'm curious though, and I'm attempting not to sound defensive, your complaint with the SSO was while accelerating or otherwise off idle ..but you're stating that the conventional fluid produced a quieter idle condition ..that wasn't in question before hand.

Can I take that as meaning that the noise off idle was eliminated AND it produced a somewhat quieter idle in comparison to SSO?

 

[Colt]

Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
I'm curious about the origin of this noise. While we've discussed tonal qualities of various fluids (as odd as it seems) the onset of noise off idle between any conventional vs. synthetic over the same conditions would be peculiar. The synthetic, assuming like hot visc, will surely be thinner than its conventional counterpart at any point where it mattered.

What filter was in use?

I'm curious though, and I'm attempting not to sound defensive, your complaint with the SSO was while accelerating or otherwise off idle ..but you're stating that the conventional fluid produced a quieter idle condition ..that wasn't in question before hand.

Can I take that as meaning that the noise off idle was eliminated AND it produced a somewhat quieter idle in comparison to SSO?


Gary,Napa Gold element filter.Now dealer service installed Toyota filter and Toyota 5w30 oil.
Noise was only in gear(at least from behind the wheel) and when engine was cold even after a 3-4 minute warmup but disapears when engine warmed up.
I was at the dealer and with the noise thought maybe I should change back and when I did,I really don't hear anything when inside the RX with dino.
I didn't listen to the SSO outside of the RX at idle.I really didn't hear anything until in gear with load was on engine.
The thinness you mention is why I'm thinking of going to Amsoil 5w30 or even a 10w30.Or maybe a thicker 0w30 GC but it's SL rated.

I had mentioned this problem with SS0 in another thread and someone posted they had a noise problem with SSO but I don't know if it was the same type noise.

 

[lexus114]

Originally Posted By: Colt
I like and have used Amsoil for quite awhile in other vehicles.
However,in the wife's RX 350 3.5L V6,Amsoil 0W30 caused some noise at start up(sort of like a rapping sound) until warm.Not really heard at idle,more in gear driving.Kept the Amsoil in for awhile and in a dealer visit,went back to Toyota dino and it was much quieter but want to stay with synthetic.
My question is would Amsoil 5w30 or even 10w30(cold weather?) cause the engine be as quiet as the Toyota dino with cold start up?
My ES V6 3.5L is quiet on start up and I'll try the 0w30 SSO or maybe just go with Amsoil 5w30 at about 8K miles.


Mine is the same way on Synthetic oil,thats why I went back to Pennzoil YB and never looked back. The motor will still very much out last the rest of the vehicle any way.So why worry?

 

[Colt]

Originally Posted By: lexus114
Originally Posted By: Colt
I like and have used Amsoil for quite awhile in other vehicles.
However,in the wife's RX 350 3.5L V6,Amsoil 0W30 caused some noise at start up(sort of like a rapping sound) until warm.Not really heard at idle,more in gear driving.Kept the Amsoil in for awhile and in a dealer visit,went back to Toyota dino and it was much quieter but want to stay with synthetic.
My question is would Amsoil 5w30 or even 10w30(cold weather?) cause the engine be as quiet as the Toyota dino with cold start up?
My ES V6 3.5L is quiet on start up and I'll try the 0w30 SSO or maybe just go with Amsoil 5w30 at about 8K miles.


Mine is the same way on Synthetic oil,thats why I went back to Pennzoil YB and never looked back. The motor will still very much out last the rest of the vehicle any way.So why worry?


I do my own oil changes and want to extend the normal change interval.
The RX every 8K miles or so and the ES once a year which is 6K or so at this point.
I hate that friggen cannister.

 

[lexus114]

Originally Posted By: Colt
Originally Posted By: lexus114
Originally Posted By: Colt
I like and have used Amsoil for quite awhile in other vehicles.
However,in the wife's RX 350 3.5L V6,Amsoil 0W30 caused some noise at start up(sort of like a rapping sound) until warm.Not really heard at idle,more in gear driving.Kept the Amsoil in for awhile and in a dealer visit,went back to Toyota dino and it was much quieter but want to stay with synthetic.
My question is would Amsoil 5w30 or even 10w30(cold weather?) cause the engine be as quiet as the Toyota dino with cold start up?
My ES V6 3.5L is quiet on start up and I'll try the 0w30 SSO or maybe just go with Amsoil 5w30 at about 8K miles.


Mine is the same way on Synthetic oil,thats why I went back to Pennzoil YB and never looked back. The motor will still very much out last the rest of the vehicle any way.So why worry?


I do my own oil changes and want to extend the normal change interval.
The RX every 8K miles or so and the ES once a year which is 6K or so at this point.
I hate that friggen cannister.

I understand since you mention the longer drain interval,but I am one of those guy`s that will simply not fall for that.However,a European vehicle such as Mercedes-Benz can do the long intervals due to a sump that holds around 9qts. of oil. My RX only holds 5qts.Plus I do a lot of short trips,and I like getting the oil out of their sooner.

 

[Colt]

Originally Posted By: lexus114
Originally Posted By: Colt
Originally Posted By: lexus114
Originally Posted By: Colt
I like and have used Amsoil for quite awhile in other vehicles.
However,in the wife's RX 350 3.5L V6,Amsoil 0W30 caused some noise at start up(sort of like a rapping sound) until warm.Not really heard at idle,more in gear driving.Kept the Amsoil in for awhile and in a dealer visit,went back to Toyota dino and it was much quieter but want to stay with synthetic.
My question is would Amsoil 5w30 or even 10w30(cold weather?) cause the engine be as quiet as the Toyota dino with cold start up?
My ES V6 3.5L is quiet on start up and I'll try the 0w30 SSO or maybe just go with Amsoil 5w30 at about 8K miles.


Mine is the same way on Synthetic oil,thats why I went back to Pennzoil YB and never looked back. The motor will still very much out last the rest of the vehicle any way.So why worry?


I do my own oil changes and want to extend the normal change interval.
The RX every 8K miles or so and the ES once a year which is 6K or so at this point.
I hate that friggen cannister.

I understand since you mention the longer drain interval,but I am one of those guy`s that will simply not fall for that. A European vehicle such as Mercedes-Benz can do the long intervals due to a sump that holds around 9qts. of oil. My RX only holds 5qts.Plus I do a lot of short trips,and I like getting the oil out of their sooner.


The 3.5L holds 6.5 qts which is a bit better but if I do dino it will be every 4K and/or 6 months.I'd rather go twice as long.

 

[Gary Allan]

Well, just to isolate the origins here, whatever oil you choose next time, try the OEM filter with it. In this evolution you changed two elements that could potentially be the cause. Again, visc alone should favor the SSO at every step of the way during the warm up process. The hot visc is probably identical between the two oils (within .xx cSt) and somewhat "less thick" over the entire warm up curve. The cessation of noise upon partial warming suggests a viscosity related issue ..which makes your experience odd in that using an oil that would/should exacerbate the condition ..relieved it. Way counter intuitive (but still possible after you've been here long enough)..hence it leaves the filter as a potential origin for the noise.

 

[Colt]

Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
Well, just to isolate the origins here, whatever oil you choose next time, try the OEM filter with it. In this evolution you changed two elements that could potentially be the cause. Again, visc alone should favor the SSO at every step of the way during the warm up process. The hot visc is probably identical between the two oils (within .xx cSt) and somewhat "less thick" over the entire warm up curve. The cessation of noise upon partial warming suggests a viscosity related issue ..which is counter intuitive to what one would expect ....hence it leaves the filter as a potential origin for the noise.


Very interesting,Gary.I never though about the filter being a possible cause.
Ok,going with a Toyota filter,would you stay with the SSO or just go with the 5w30 ASL?Which oil would you use in your vehicle given the choice.

 

[lexus114]

Originally Posted By: Colt
Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
Well, just to isolate the origins here, whatever oil you choose next time, try the OEM filter with it. In this evolution you changed two elements that could potentially be the cause. Again, visc alone should favor the SSO at every step of the way during the warm up process. The hot visc is probably identical between the two oils (within .xx cSt) and somewhat "less thick" over the entire warm up curve. The cessation of noise upon partial warming suggests a viscosity related issue ..which is counter intuitive to what one would expect ....hence it leaves the filter as a potential origin for the noise.


Very interesting,Gary.I never though about the filter being a possible cause.
Ok,going with a Toyota filter,would you stay with the SSO or just go with the 5w30 ASL?Which oil would you use in your vehicle given the choice.


Just curious,does Lexus use Synthetic oil in the 350? Sounds like they dont,since you mentioned after the dealer oil change all was well again.

 

[Colt]

Originally Posted By: lexus114
Originally Posted By: Colt
Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
Well, just to isolate the origins here, whatever oil you choose next time, try the OEM filter with it. In this evolution you changed two elements that could potentially be the cause. Again, visc alone should favor the SSO at every step of the way during the warm up process. The hot visc is probably identical between the two oils (within .xx cSt) and somewhat "less thick" over the entire warm up curve. The cessation of noise upon partial warming suggests a viscosity related issue ..which is counter intuitive to what one would expect ....hence it leaves the filter as a potential origin for the noise.


Very interesting,Gary.I never though about the filter being a possible cause.
Ok,going with a Toyota filter,would you stay with the SSO or just go with the 5w30 ASL?Which oil would you use in your vehicle given the choice.


Just curious,does Lexus use Synthetic oil in the 350? Sounds like they dont,since you mentioned after the dealer oil change all was well again.


The Toyota 20 weight is a synthetic,not the 5w30.
The '10 RX 350 calls for the 20 weight.The '09 RX and I believe my '10 ES is a 5w30 and Iike the 30 weight over the 20.

 

[lexus114]

Cool thanx. but like I mentioned,mine was very noisy on Synthetic (on cold motor) enough that it was the reason I switched back.

 

[Colt]

Originally Posted By: lexus114
Cool thanx. but like I mentioned,mine was very noisy on Synthetic (on cold motor) enough that it was the reason I switched back.


It was you that posted in that other thread when I casually mentioned the noise problem with SSO.

I'll give it another Amsoil synthetic try with a Toyota filter and see what happens.

 

[lexus114]

Originally Posted By: Colt
Originally Posted By: lexus114
Cool thanx. but like I mentioned,mine was very noisy on Synthetic (on cold motor) enough that it was the reason I switched back.


It was you that posted in that other thread when I casually mentioned the noise problem with SSO.

I'll give it another Amsoil synthetic try with a Toyota filter and see what happens.


Yes,and please dont think I am bashing Synthetic oil,because I`m not. I use Amsoil in my transmission. It`s just that I believe some motors are more satisfied on conventional oil.Mine appears to be one of them.

 

[Johnny]

The SSO 0W-30 is no doubt their premium product. I would stick with the OEM filter and give the SSO another try. It is a very robust oil.

 

[Colt]

Originally Posted By: lexus114
Originally Posted By: Colt
Originally Posted By: lexus114
Cool thanx. but like I mentioned,mine was very noisy on Synthetic (on cold motor) enough that it was the reason I switched back.


It was you that posted in that other thread when I casually mentioned the noise problem with SSO.

I'll give it another Amsoil synthetic try with a Toyota filter and see what happens.


Yes,and please dont think I am bashing Synthetic oil,because I`m not. I use Amsoil in my transmission. It`s just that I believe some motors are more satisfied on conventional oil.Mine appears to be one of them.


No problem.It just puzzles me because I've used Amsoil in a '07 Camry 3.5L without a problem.I don't remember what filter I used and it was only one warm weather oil change because I hit a deer and dumped the car right after the $9K repair was done.

 

[Colt]

Originally Posted By: Johnny
The SSO 0W-30 is no doubt their premium product. I would stick with the OEM filter and give the SSO another try. It is a very robust oil.


Yeah Johnny,I'll probably give SSO another try but the last one was a pretty expensive 1K mile dumping of that SSO.

 

[Johnny]

If you want to experiment, try some Mobil 1 5W-30EP (Extended Performance) in it. Another robust oil.

 

[lexus114]

Originally Posted By: Johnny
If you want to experiment, try some Mobil 1 5W-30EP (Extended Performance) in it. Another robust oil.


Very true Johnny! but I noticed cold engine performance was kinda poor when I had it in mine. I guess I just have another retarded vehicle.Seems quite happy,and runs well on the YB though.

 

[gathermewool]

While a new motor shouldn't make much noise, regardless of oil, my experience with the old subie with 202k on'er has been all over the place as far as cold-start, cold-day noise is concerned. I've used M1, Shell, Rotella, GTX of all weights and the noise has subsided and returned as it [censored] well pleases haha

What I mean is, regardless of the oil, or how long into the OCI, the motor will make TONS of noise - and I do mean tons - and then, a day or maybe a month later, will make a minimal amount of racket.

That being said, the old subie DOES seem to have marginally fewer scary loud cold-engine starts using either M1 HM or Castrol GTX, bot in the 10W-30 flavor. My current run of RTS 5W-40 seems to make the most noise so far, but I still plan to wait until 7500 to change out, as it sounds silky smooth at N.O.T.