Microguard select, Toyota 3.5 V6, and a new engine noise!

[Chryslercruiser]

I am new to oil filter investigations. New to the site, and still learning!

Based upon the ease of obtaining a 'good' oil filter at Oreilly's and disliking the oil change process on a toyota 3.5 V6 I decided to do a longer oil change interval.

In the past I have used the Toyota brand oil filter, and Havoline 5W20 synthetic oil. The engine has 265K.

Thinking I could go to longer on an oil filter change, I got the micorguard select locally, and installed it.

The worrisome thing is on a cold start when the temperatures were below 20* I can hear what sounds like a rod knock...

That is a sharp metallic noise, with some frequency. Heaver sounding then valvetrain/lifter noise, and only when outside Temperatures are one the cold side.. The noise would go away within 30 or so seconds, but that felt like a lifetime to me.

Taking no chances I went back to the Toyota brand filter, and installed 0W20 oil. It's cold out this morning so I will see if the noise is gone for good, or if I am in the process of loosing an engine. I did not see any shiny flakes in the oil filter..

 

[53' Stude]

I am new to oil filter investigations. New to the site, and still learning!

Based upon the ease of obtaining a 'good' oil filter at Oreilly's and disliking the oil change process on a toyota 3.5 V6 I decided to do a longer oil change interval.

In the past I have used the Toyota brand oil filter, and Havoline 5W20 synthetic oil. The engine has 265K.

Thinking I could go to longer on an oil filter change, I got the micorguard select locally, and installed it.

The worrisome thing is on a cold start when the temperatures were below 20* I can hear what sounds like a rod knock...

That is a sharp metallic noise, with some frequency. Heaver sounding then valvetrain/lifter noise, and only when outside Temperatures are one the cold side.. The noise would go away within 30 or so seconds, but that felt like a lifetime to me.

Taking no chances I went back to the Toyota brand filter, and installed 0W20 oil. It's cold out this morning so I will see if the noise is gone for good, or if I am in the process of loosing an engine. I did not see any shiny flakes in the oil filter..

Needs a better investigation before blaming the filter.

 

[GSCJR]

If it's the 2GR-FE, they have what sounds like piston slap when cold; normal.

 

[rijndael]

That is a sharp metallic noise, with some frequency. Heaver sounding then valvetrain/lifter noise, and only when outside Temperatures are one the cold side.. The noise would go away within 30 or so seconds, but that felt like a lifetime to me.

I've heard this in my 2GRFE one time, it's nearing 200K. It was in cooler temps when I turned it on for a short time, then shut it off, and on the restart (later) I heard what sounded like a cam phaser rattle.

 

[JavierH19]

The 5w-20 definitely wasn't it unless it goes to below -20 where you're at so I wouldn't be against pouring that back in the bottle for next time, it's new oil. Could possibly be the filter as that has happened to other engines but it could also be piston slap which my old 5.3 sierra sometimes has in the cold but not my old 6.0 yukon or new 6.2.

 

[PWMDMD]

My wife's 2GRFE with only 65K miles and an impeccable maintenance history has a little startup rattle sometimes when cold. Otherwise, it runs like a top and so I'm not going to worry about it.

 

[Glenda W.]

Sharp rod knock type noises or piston slap generally aren’t filter related but let us know how it goes. 5w is good to about -25.

 

[Chryslercruiser]

It does not sound like cam phasers if such is a rattle... but if they knock then maybe...

Based upon the 2 engines I have heard piston slap in, they have a metallic "ring" to the sound.. but both them were ancient by 2009 standards. One was a Mercedes 240D from 1983, and an oil changed solved it.. the other is a Dodge Flathead 6 from the 50's..

Based upon those piston slap sounds, this sounds more like a knock than a ring... AND it just did it to a lesser extent this morning.. not as loud, or as long.. but still a noise..

Thanks for the replies.. I'm going to keep driving it, and keep tabs on the noise. At 270K + miles it does not really owe me anything, so long as I don't strand myself somewhere..

 

[Glenda W.]

It does not sound like cam phasers if such is a rattle... but if they knock then maybe...

Based upon the 2 engines I have heard piston slap in, they have a metallic "ring" to the sound.. but both them were ancient by 2009 standards. One was a Mercedes 240D from 1983, and an oil changed solved it.. the other is a Dodge Flathead 6 from the 50's..

Based upon those piston slap sounds, this sounds more like a knock than a ring... AND it just did it to a lesser extent this morning.. not as loud, or as long.. but still a noise..

Thanks for the replies.. I'm going to keep driving it, and keep tabs on the noise. At 270K + miles it does not really owe me anything, so long as I don't strand myself somewhere..

So it didn’t go away with 0w20 and Toyota filter?

 

[kschachn]

It does not sound like cam phasers if such is a rattle... but if they knock then maybe...

Based upon the 2 engines I have heard piston slap in, they have a metallic "ring" to the sound.. but both them were ancient by 2009 standards. One was a Mercedes 240D from 1983, and an oil changed solved it.. the other is a Dodge Flathead 6 from the 50's..

Based upon those piston slap sounds, this sounds more like a knock than a ring... AND it just did it to a lesser extent this morning.. not as loud, or as long.. but still a noise..

Thanks for the replies.. I'm going to keep driving it, and keep tabs on the noise. At 270K + miles it does not really owe me anything, so long as I don't strand myself somewhere..

Post a recording of the sound.

 

[ZeeOSix]

"Rod knock" is due to excessive bearing clearance. You either have rod knock all the time, or you don't. In order for rods to knock that have correct bearing clearance, the rods would have to be completely starved of oil, which I highly doubt is happening due to an oil filter. I mean even when and engine's oil and filter is changed, and a new filter is installed without pre-filling it and the galleries above the filter are empty, engines don't have rod knock until the oil reaches the rods.

 

[Chryslercruiser]

"Rod knock" is due to excessive bearing clearance. You either have rod knock all the time, or you don't. In order for rods to knock that have correct bearing clearance, the rods would have to be completely starved of oil, which I highly doubt is happening due to an oil filter. I mean even when and engine's oil and filter is changed, and a new filter is installed without pre-filling it and the galleries above the filter are empty, engines don't have rod knock until the oil reaches the rods.

Generally I agree with you... But I am not so sure it is black and white, but that there is some grey in the mix as well.

My experience: I have heard some engine knocks that happen until oil pressure rises on worn or whupped engines.. and I have hear it once on my daily driver that took a long time to build oil pressure.. that engine is still running and driven daily..

It is my opinion that some rod or main bearings that are starting to have slightly large clearance due to wear can make noise until oil reaches them.. and "Rod Knock" that happens all the time is a result of a rod that has gotten deformed, or spun, or pounded out for some reason, and then all the oil pressure in the world does little..

 

[ZeeOSix]

Generally I agree with you... But I am not so sure it is black and white, but that there is some grey in the mix as well.

My experience: I have heard some engine knocks that happen until oil pressure rises on worn or whupped engines.. and I have hear it once on my daily driver that took a long time to build oil pressure.. that engine is still running and driven daily..

It is my opinion that some rod or main bearings that are starting to have slightly large clearance due to wear can make noise until oil reaches them.. and "Rod Knock" that happens all the time is a result of a rod that has gotten deformed, or spun, or pounded out for some reason, and then all the oil pressure in the world does little..

Yes, it's possible your engine has worn enough for this to start happening. But I highly doubt it was due to the oil filter. Quite possible that the 0W instead of the 5W made the difference. If you would of only changed out the oil filter (changing one factor, not two) then it would be more clear if the filter had a role in the change. Has it ever made knocking sounds on the first start-up after an oil and filter change if you didn't pre-fill the oil filter?

I once say someone change the oil on their car what was pretty new and in good condition, and they started the engine before putting oil back in it. The poor engine made all kinds of knocking noise after it ran for about 15-20 seconds. There was definitely rod knock going on in that case. So even if the rod bearings were in brand new shape and clearance, given enough time with not oil supply they will start knocking.