yep...trying to convince my better half that 4k is fine (slowly move her up to 5k) on dino.
right now, i am running ST, with MC 5W-20 standing by for the oil change this weekend.
60% ase mechanics say change every 3k
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yep...trying to convince my better half that 4k is fine (slowly move her up to 5k) on dino.
right now, i am running ST, with MC 5W-20 standing by for the oil change this weekend.
I know many mechanic's and unfortunately I would have to say the majority of them are still stuck on 3K OCI's. Not from a shop profit's point of view but just from lack of knowledge about modern oils.
If you really think about it what does increased knowledge about oil do for a real mechanic? Think about what he does all day. He is given a repair order to work on a vehicle. If it's a oil change (LOF) he just pulls in the vehicle, drops the oil and filter, spins on a new filter, fills the oil using the bulk dispensed oil from a tank in the back room and gives it a grease job (if it even has any grease fittings). If it's anything else he diagnosis a fault, disassembles it, orders parts, installs new parts, test to ensure the repair is done and he's finished. In fact he has no real control over what oil goes into a vehicle and how often it goes in since most of that is dictated by the shop/dealer owner. Knowledge about oil and OCI's in no way increases how much he makes or how efficient he is at repairing a vehicle. It's a sad fact of life but true.
If anyone needs increased knowledge about oil and OCI's other than the consumer it's the shop/dealership owner. They after all are the ones that select the oils used in their shops and what OCI to put on the little window sticker.
Now having said that should the mechanic be more knowledgeable about oils and OCI's? Sure they should. It is after all the life blood of what he works on.
I think the real problem is the mentality of the repair industry. What does it mean for my bottom line profit margin. Will instructing their mechanic's about lubricants and service intervals make them anymore money, probably not.
I personally have never been the norm and am very proud of that. I try to think of each and every one of my customers vehicles as my own and treat each of them as such. I also have the advantage of being a small repair business and can pick and choose my customers. I tend to only work on trucks/tractors that are owned by people that truly care about their equipment and the investment they made in it. I try to keep my customers well informed about preventative maintenance practices and the benefit on their bottom line. I also try to stay well informed about what I am working on and what goes in them.
I don't put much faith in the reliability of ASE certified mechanic's but it does have one advantage. It does at lease expose those that do take the test to the knowledge and information about what they are taking the test for. There are test for engines, HVAC, transmissions, electrical, etc... Maybe they need to add a new category. Something like "Lubricants Technology" that would test their knowledge about lubricants, their certifications, applications, UOA's and how to pick the proper OCI. At least then they would be exposed to the information. It couldn't be any worse then it is now.
who knows?3k is safe,you will probably be back in before 5 or 7k by the time you remember that you needed a 3k oil change.Just because you can pass a test doesnt mean you know what your speaking on.I work with some very good [and very bad] mechanics who are quick to disseminate false information because they just dont know ant better.They also laugh at guys who fret over oil types and oci's.I worked with one guy that never changed his oil because his car was worth 500 bucks if that.He finally let it die at 300k.His mind is made.
I wonder what would happen to these master techs if they come to Oz to work and dealer OCI's are 10,000/12,000/15,000kms or more on dino. What would the idiots say then?
FD777, great stuff. I went to lunch this week with one of the owners of that Toyota dealership. The master tech stopped me and handed me an oil chart for Toyota's and asked me if I was really running that 0w-30 Syntec, to which I answered, yes. He said that he was worried, that with the warm weather coming that I should switch to the much "thicker" 5w-30. He said I was lucky to get away with such a thin oil. I took him into one of the owner's office and we started surfing the net and writing spec's on a white board and looking up terms. A called a friend, a Terry Dyson kind of guy that works as a chemist for an oil company, put him on a speaker and we had a talk with our mechanic friend. The conversion from fantasy to facts was so complete and so quick that this mechanic an I went off to Autozone to buy some CG for his car. One down and more to go. I'm going to try to get him to join us but he has never used a computer, challenge number two.
Nice work Lonnie! It is very difficult when you are dealing with people whose approach is basically "Don't confuse me with the facts....my mind's made up!". You are a patient man to devote so much time to saving this one soul!
Only 99.9999999% of mechanics left to convert. How much time have you got?
Only 99.9999999% of mechanics left to convert. How much time have you got?
I wonder what those 98% think about the OLM (oil life monitor), which as I understand it, usually allows at least a 5,000 mile OCI?
Jan Richter
how does the OLM determine when to change???
I do not have an issue with the 3k OCI! What I have an issue with is why it is not required to have 100% used oil recyleing!!! It can be used for more then just makeing more automotive oil! That is what I think is a waste!
The real downside of long oil change intervals for the masses is that they never check the oil level. The 10k mile or longer oil change intervals recommended on many european cars also can result in it being over 10k miles between checks of the oil level.
My thought is that any car with an OLM type system also needs to have an oil level monitoring system.
My thought is that any car with an OLM type system also needs to have an oil level monitoring system.
Europeans have it still instilled in them to check their oil at least. I have people complaining their washers are broken just to find it was 1.25 gallons low. Oh it holds 1.25 Gallons.
I laffed my boobies off when I 1st heared that 3K oil changes were the norm in the US, mind you the damd stuff is so cheap over there why not ?
6K has been the norm in euroland fer eons..... Gawd knows bout extended intervals .... Sounds a bit ifi to moi
6K has been the norm in euroland fer eons..... Gawd knows bout extended intervals .... Sounds a bit ifi to moi
I think if I was a mechanic I would want for people to have their oil changed by me every 3 months/3000 miles. That way I would be able to check stuff that so many people (in the USA anyway) never even check, like tire air pressure, brakes, fluid levels, etc. I would not want for one of my customers to be killed in a car crash with tires grossly underinflated and people maybe taking a look at me.
And the way some people treat their cars and trucks there NEEDS to be frequent inspection of the vehicle.
With all the sale prices on oil changes where maybe an oil chnage is priced at $15.00 or $20.00 or so, I don't think mechanics are making a fortune on oil chnages. They are making money off other maintenance that needs to be done (or the mechanic says needs to be done even if it does not really need to be done if the mechanic is dishonest). I would be an honest mechanic, but I would want to take a look at the car or truck every 3 months/3000 miles. Might as well do an oil and oil filter change.
And the way some people treat their cars and trucks there NEEDS to be frequent inspection of the vehicle.
With all the sale prices on oil changes where maybe an oil chnage is priced at $15.00 or $20.00 or so, I don't think mechanics are making a fortune on oil chnages. They are making money off other maintenance that needs to be done (or the mechanic says needs to be done even if it does not really need to be done if the mechanic is dishonest). I would be an honest mechanic, but I would want to take a look at the car or truck every 3 months/3000 miles. Might as well do an oil and oil filter change.
im an ASE certified tech, and i just tell people to use whatever hte manual says and change it whenever it says. i just left the shop i was at for 2 years and couldnt take my boss telling people that they had to do it every 3k miles even if they used synthetic.
also got tired of trying to tell other techs they were wrong. our shop didnt make any money on oil changes, just money on any upsells we could get. i was the one of 2 techs to take the time to refill windshield resivours, check air pressure, etc, etc. also i refused to work at a shop who performed trans services and used the same fluid in all cars. i told the manager it was wrong and he said "corporate said that since its a synthetic fluid it can be used in an car". #@$%! my boss got mad at me when i would check the tire pressures, front end and want to road test a car getting an alignment. said that it was wasting the customers time and they were jsut paying for an alignment, not a test drive.
as a tech its jsut easier to say what the customer wants to hear than tell them what is correct.
also got tired of trying to tell other techs they were wrong. our shop didnt make any money on oil changes, just money on any upsells we could get. i was the one of 2 techs to take the time to refill windshield resivours, check air pressure, etc, etc. also i refused to work at a shop who performed trans services and used the same fluid in all cars. i told the manager it was wrong and he said "corporate said that since its a synthetic fluid it can be used in an car". #@$%! my boss got mad at me when i would check the tire pressures, front end and want to road test a car getting an alignment. said that it was wasting the customers time and they were jsut paying for an alignment, not a test drive.
as a tech its jsut easier to say what the customer wants to hear than tell them what is correct.
Thank you for your honesty bdcardinal.
In the same token, that's what #@$%! me off amongst other things that made me decided to leave the automotive repair industry.
Take care and all the best to you (appreciate your honesty)
In the same token, that's what #@$%! me off amongst other things that made me decided to leave the automotive repair industry.
Take care and all the best to you (appreciate your honesty)
its hard taking pride in your work. i was also very annoyed that i was the only person with a sizeable amount of tools, all of high quality. people thought that once i unlocked my toolbox in the morning it was open season to borrow all they want.
I hope the euro guys chiming in here realize that when us American bloks say "K's" we are use it as slang for "miles" traveled - not Kilometers! 3000'ks'(miles) here in the states equals about 5000 real K's driven in Europe(and else where in the world). Do I believe in the 3000mile oil change- NO! - I think 5000mile is good for regular oil and the everyday consumer who pays to change his oil but for me, who has NEVER paid to have his oil changed and will NEVER(as long as I am fisically able to do it myself) does it every 10,000miles and have had samples done to prove it's ok(GC-AMS but_M1-0w30 most of the time). 167000+++miles and still running fine 98Suzuki Swift 1.3L 5speed and 43.03 MPG overall average so far for the last 130000 miles!!! ( I don't count the first 37thou being the first 11thou of it I did't own it and the next 27thou it was parked most of the time being I was still putting the 216,000++ on my 96 Metro that is still running today with almost 300thou on it. The oil in it was changed about every 82/8400miles being it was change every 200hours per a hour meter using re-refined oil the first 100thou than regular Texaco/Shell the rest of the time I had it). P.S. I did a 15,000 mile run using M1-EP and it did GREAT on it's sample and would have kept using it except for the stock pile of M1-0w30 I have after buying so much of it with the buy3get3free coupons a few years ago at PepBoys.
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