2022-2023 Toyota Tundra Recall - 98,600 vehicles for engine stall/failure issue

[edyvw]

Toyota had these issues in other markets before. The US market is specific. Huge roads, cheap gas. That allowed Toyota to run simple engines for a long time and build customer base around that.
In Europe they could not do that. They had to go with downsizing in 90’s too because in Europe family owns station wagon with 1.6 turbo diesel 4 banger, not 5.7 V8 or 3.5 V6. Toyota tried and failed several times miserably. They tried with 1.4 D-4D and that was engine that basically required laboratory clean diesel to run. 2.2 D-4D was I think only engine i know of in the last 20yrs that could not make 100k km, period. With those problematic a Hyundai’s you can get 100k miles, that 2.2 D-4D was dead at 60k miles, no exception. They tried to fix it, but it was always far behind in performance/consumption to Euro vehicles, which prompted Toyota to buy 2.0 diesel from BMW.
When things start to become complex, Toyota is not at all something I would put in reliability category at all. And that is consequence of pushing obsolete engines. It had to catch up with them once emission standards became so stringent that they did not have any work around it.
Also, I think there is more than this. Their quality in new vehicles, assembly and precision of assembly, is horrid. Huge gaps, thin seats etc. It could be combination of saving money where they should not and being behind in downsizing trend.

 

[PWMDMD]

Another great example of why it’s a good practice to avoid first year models.

Or second or third...

 

[PWMDMD]

Well, I originally thought this only included the Tundra but this affects the Tundra and the LX...the Tundra 3.4 is made in Texas and the LX 3.4 is made in Japan and they want us to believe both Texas and Japan can't clean the machining debris? Hmmm....sound like a design flaw to me.

Toyota Recalls Certain Model Year 2022-2023 Toyota Tundra and Lexus LX Vehicles - Toyota USA Newsroom

PLANO, Texas (May 30, 2024)—Toyota is conducting a safety recall involving certain model year 2022–2023 Toyota Tundra and Lexus LX (conventional gas model only) vehicles in North America. Approximately, 102,000 Toyota and Lexus branded vehicles are involved in this recall […]

pressroom.toyota.com

 

[edyvw]

Well, I originally thought this only included the Tundra but this affects the Tundra and the LX...the Tundra 3.4 is made in Texas and the LX 3.4 is made in Japan and they want us to believe both Texas and Japan can't clean the machining debris? Hmmm....sound like a design flaw to me.

Toyota Recalls Certain Model Year 2022-2023 Toyota Tundra and Lexus LX Vehicles - Toyota USA Newsroom

PLANO, Texas (May 30, 2024)—Toyota is conducting a safety recall involving certain model year 2022–2023 Toyota Tundra and Lexus LX (conventional gas model only) vehicles in North America. Approximately, 102,000 Toyota and Lexus branded vehicles are involved in this recall […]

pressroom.toyota.com

VW replaced 2,000 engines with questionable rod bearings. But they acted fast and did not allow 102,000 engines to be produced. If this was not pushed by NHTSA, it would end up the same as the 2017 problems with the transmission. Deal with those that show up in the dealership, sort of.

 

[PWMDMD]

VW replaced 2,000 engines with questionable rod bearings. But they acted fast and did not allow 102,000 engines to be produced. If this was not pushed by NHTSA, it would end up the same as the 2017 problems with the transmission. Deal with those that show up in the dealership, sort of.

Potentially $3B to remedy this?

 

[edyvw]

Potentially $3B to remedy this?

Who knows, but if there is no remedy yet, I would say engines with those issues are still being produced.
$3b might be the final bill.

 

[nicholas]

Says a lot for early first oil changes.

That's why I do 3 changes very early.......you never know.

 

[MalibuRam65]

They removed the transmission radiator in 2019 and now there is a small "puck" on the transmission with trans fluid running on one side and engine coolant on the other side. Its primary function is to warm the trans fluid when cold with warm engine coolant. Toyota claims it also acts to cool the trans fluid, which is technically true when the trans fluid temp exceeds the engine coolant temp, but it is minimal cooling. I watched a video of someone towing 3500lbs up the Ike Gauntlet with a 2013 Sequoia at 65mph and their trans temp never exceeded 210F. I can drive 75mph on flat highway unloaded and easily get to +225F. Mike Sweers was asked and he acknowledged the increased trans temps but said their testing showed the WS fluid would have no problem running these temps as "lifetime fluid". I call BS...hence I just had the transmission flushed at 50k miles.

Amsoil Signature Series might help with the heat .

 

[MalibuRam65]

That's why I do 3 changes very early.......you never know.

I have a 22 Tundra Platinum I’ve done 4 OCI in the first 10k figure I was keeping the wear in metals down not realizing about this debris crap . I am affected by this recall which sucks , my truck is currently at 24k running smooth and Quiet for now

 

[john_pifer]

Potentially $3B to remedy this?

Drop in the bucket for Toyota!

 

[PWMDMD]

Drop in the bucket for Toyota!

If you ignore the impact on reputation and sales. Tundra owners usually buy a Tundra because they have been more reliable than the alternatives. There is evidence of a dramatic increase in low-mileage, current generation, used Tundras, flooding the secondary market in the last few months and that was before this recall.

 

[PWMDMD]

I have a 22 Tundra Platinum I’ve done 4 OCI in the first 10k figure I was keeping the wear in metals down not realizing about this debris crap . I am affected by this recall which sucks , my truck is currently at 24k running smooth and Quiet for now

I really think this will pan out to be a design issue, likely with insufficient oiling at the main bearings. It just doesn't make sense that engines built in Texas and Japan are suffering the same issue with metal debris.

 

[350Rocket]

They removed the transmission radiator in 2019 and now there is a small "puck" on the transmission with trans fluid running on one side and engine coolant on the other side. Its primary function is to warm the trans fluid when cold with warm engine coolant. Toyota claims it also acts to cool the trans fluid, which is technically true when the trans fluid temp exceeds the engine coolant temp, but it is minimal cooling. I watched a video of someone towing 3500lbs up the Ike Gauntlet with a 2013 Sequoia at 65mph and their trans temp never exceeded 210F. I can drive 75mph on flat highway unloaded and easily get to +225F. Mike Sweers was asked and he acknowledged the increased trans temps but said their testing showed the WS fluid would have no problem running these temps as "lifetime fluid". I call BS...hence I just had the transmission flushed at 50k miles.

That seems crazy. I watch the trans temp on my 05 Silverado and if I get on the highway not far from my house and drive a steady speed in lockup the trans doesn't go above about 120f and if I get stuck in the city stop and go on a hot day (not towing but full payload in the truck) then it will get to about 190. I did add an auxiliary cooler to the one in the rad, unfortunately I don't know prior to that mod because I did it before getting an obd2 adaptor.

 

[tcp71]

That seems crazy. I watch the trans temp on my 05 Silverado and if I get on the highway not far from my house and drive a steady speed in lockup the trans doesn't go above about 120f and if I get stuck in the city stop and go on a hot day (not towing but full payload in the truck) then it will get to about 190. I did add an auxiliary cooler to the one in the rad, unfortunately I don't know prior to that mod because I did it before getting an obd2 adaptor.

Your 05 silverado has a very different transmission design than more modern ones with thermostats, LV or even ULV fluids. It was designed to keep temps as low as possible. To meet EPA requirements in 05, the transmission fluid drag wasn't a concern, but more modern transmission designs have to take it into account. This is why the GM/Ford 10 speed runs ULV fluids.
The 6R80 in my 2016 has a thermostat and runs 195-200f unloaded, regardless of driving conditions. Mercon LV fluid handles that without a lot of issue. Towing, I've seen up to 235, but even that isn't a great concern for a limited time.
Making comparisons with older designs vs. modern requirements doesn't make sense.

 

[john_pifer]

I really think this will pan out to be a design issue, likely with insufficient oiling at the main bearings. It just doesn't make sense that engines built in Texas and Japan are suffering the same issue with metal debris.

So, this engine has reportedly also been used in the Lexus LS since 2017.

If it’s a design problem (insufficient oiling), then why haven’t there been any reported problems with the LS?

I realize that the engines between the LS and the Tundra/LC may not be identical. But they’re close enough that I doubt there would be major bottom end design differences.

I’m not sure I would jump to the conclusion that it’s a design fault and that Toyota is being deceptive.

Toyota hasn’t gotten to where they are by operating in that manner.

 

[PWMDMD]

So, this engine has reportedly also been used in the Lexus LS since 2017.

If it’s a design problem (insufficient oiling), then why haven’t there been any reported problems with the LS?

I realize that the engines between the LS and the Tundra/LC may not be identical. But they’re close enough that I doubt there would be major bottom end design differences.

I’m not sure I would jump to the conclusion that it’s a design fault and that Toyota is being deceptive.

Toyota hasn’t gotten to where they are by operating in that manner.

It’s not exactly the same engine and they sold 2600 LS last year. It may be happening but to so few it hasn’t raised attention to the issue.

I guess I could ask the same question back. If they are the same engine and presumably the blocks for the LS and LX are made by the same supplier in Japan, why haven’t they reported problems with the LS?

 

[JeffKeryk]

There are those who say Toyota is not what it used to be... There seems to be a reason for it.

 

[350Rocket]

Your 05 silverado has a very different transmission design than more modern ones with thermostats, LV or even ULV fluids. It was designed to keep temps as low as possible. To meet EPA requirements in 05, the transmission fluid drag wasn't a concern, but more modern transmission designs have to take it into account. This is why the GM/Ford 10 speed runs ULV fluids.
The 6R80 in my 2016 has a thermostat and runs 195-200f unloaded, regardless of driving conditions. Mercon LV fluid handles that without a lot of issue. Towing, I've seen up to 235, but even that isn't a great concern for a limited time.
Making comparisons with older designs vs. modern requirements doesn't make sense.

It makes me wonder though, how many less problems would there be (specifically with the 10 speed Ford's) if they didn't choose to borderline overheat them during normal usage.
Even in 2005 they were doing stuff similar to this (for emissions I assume)...i had to tell my coworker not to stop turning off the AC when I'm not in the truck... because he'll get too cold but leave the engine running and it does not turn on cooling fans until 230f unless the AC or defrost is active then it keeps it under 200. It drives me nuts.

 

[Exhaustgases]

Lexus is having engine failures too. Just do the search.

 

[AutoMechanic]

As a Toyota tech it’s disappointing to see the turbos and engines always having problems on these models. Amazing trucks but the 2022+ style is notoriously bad for the turbos and engines and that’s really a shame. This style (2022+) and the first generation ones are my favorites. I don’t like the price though haha.

I’d hate to imagine what a customer would have to pay for the labor and parts once out of warranty. One of our techs left the drain plug loose on one and it blew the engine when it came out and it cost the shop almost $18,000 with the engine, turbo and labor to pay a tech but that’s with no up charge on parts since we get them for our cost. We replaced the turbo out of good faith for the customer since it’s a known issue. The tech who done it covered the very hefty tow bill from Interstate 95 to Christainsburg VA where my shop is at which is very far away. Let’s just say the tech no longer works there either.