Saved $2,100 - HVAC

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I never call them, with all the info on Youtube these days there is no reason to call a repair person unless you need brazing done and don't have your own torch or you need to vacuum down and capture the entire system. My 30 year old Carrier units are still kicking on R22 and their original compressors. I JUST replaced the start cap on the upstairs unit squirrel cage motor. The downstairs unit has ate 2 circuit boards over the years and the upstairs has ate 3 or 4 resistive heat flame starters over the years.
I generally don't touch mine, I much prefer to have a local place to do all the service on it. That way if it quits in the middle of winter, hopefully they will be able to get back online quickly. But with any luck, with routine service, it won't go down.

I did replace a zone valve but it was just wiring I had to contend with.

To do a clean out and tune up I'd have to get a good vac I'd think... HEPA filter of some sort? I'm sure I could learn how, I usually watch how it is done, but I get lost easily when something goes sideways. And having a furnace go down is never a good time, I lose my hot water when that happens.
 
Last Thursday evening our furnace fan stopped fanning. Friday morning a "trusted" tech came out and deemed the fan dead; quoted $1200 for a new fan or $4200 for a new 2 stage Bryant furnace.
They did a nice job on my shiney new furnace on Monday.

Yup.
 
Sometimes they're not crooks. Sometimes they're just plain incompetent.

Years ago a friend of a friend's AC wasn't working. They had the HVAC contractor who lived across the street look at. He was getting ready to install a hard-start kit because the compressor wasn't coming on and it was just making a buzzing noise.

I looked it and noticed:

1)The buzzing was coming from the SINGLE POLE contactor.

2)The fan wasn't coming on either.

3)The HVAC contractor used a non-contact voltage detector to determine if the compressor was getting power, and concluded that it was.

It is NOT a valid test to use a non-contact voltage detector to determine if the compressor has power. Especially with a single-pole contactor.

I pushed in on the contactor and saw the remains of a dead bug squirt out of it as the compressor AND fan both started up.

I suggested replacing the contactor since it was contaminated with bug guts.
 
You type that like it's some top of the line equipment. 😂
No, just giving an idea of what we got for the price. If I said, "had it all replaced for $6,500", that doesn't mean anything. Was it cheap and generic? Was it name brand? Was it Trane/AS? Was it Rheem/Ruud? Was it Arcoaire? etc.

eta: one company wanted like $9k to upgrade from the 14SEER AC to a 17SEER AC, from their $7k price with the 14SEER. eek
 
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I live on the outskirts of our state capital.
I do not know of any HVAC company that does not push to sell you a new unit. It's a major business here, must be a dozen well known companies and its like whenever someones system needs a repair from 8 years old to 20, three days later you will see them installing a new unit.

This is how they work here.
1. Most are 1099 employees with some exceptions. On a repair call they get to charge the company repair price AND they can increase the repair cost to ANYTHING that they want and get that full extra amount in pay.
2. Sell you a brand new unit and even bigger payday.

I am CONSTANTLY amazed seeing new HVAC systems being installed in my community of 200 homes since we bought new 16 years ago. Laughable but what can I say? It's like homeowners can not reason and think for themselves anymore, heck, most young people dont even paint their own homes anymore or cut their own grass.
I felt so bad for a neighbor, elderly lady (but wealthy) must be pushing 90, really nice person, still always working in her yard. Some years back her condenser fan went out, the well known HVAC company with a fleet of shiny trucks charged her over $600 for a new fan. SOME YEARS LATER she had the unit replaced along with all the flex duct to sheet metal.

I had my own experience with one of my two units, main floor unit never really got cold, had a few people look at it, of course wanted to sell me a new one. I stood over the guy because I just wanted some freon put in it, still the older 22 but the unit is capable of conversion to the new. At the time I also had him replace the expansion valve and dryer.
Anyway he was "afraid" to put any more into it because the pressures. I put up with the marginal cooling for a couple years, since it was the main floor unit it wasnt a big deal as the second floor unit worked well AND never did it have an issue of keeping the house cold enough but I know refrigeration units and knew it should be colder and cycle off sooner. It was running too much and the low pressure side too warm.
All I ever heard was I should replace it from many people.

No way, I bought a gauge set and tank of freon off eBay many years back. I looked at the charge pressures of the second unit as the unit I was working on the sun baked the stats off. Hooked up the gauges opened the valve for the freon to flow and charged to the pressure I thought it should be. Right away for the first time ever the low pressure side got cold, inside the home the temp difference between the intake and output was about 18 degrees if I remember correctly. We just sold the house and I did this 5 years previously and the system still working perfect.
Over time some minor repairs, I replaced the capacitors in both units and one contactor. Also at one time the fan motor went in one of them, had a HVAC company replace it, long before I started doing my own work, they used a generic one size fits all motor that crapped out in 3 years or so, I replaced with a OEM motor.

Ok, with all that said! Here is some creditability to this.
We just sold this house and our real estate firm sent two true professionals to do pre inspections. One for termites, (none)
and one HVAC inspection guy. He tore into everything, removing covers testing ect, I was surprised how long he was here. Anyway, (this was mentioned above) he did pick up one contactor was pitted and said the capacitor should be replaced at the same time. I said YAY~ ! I got them in the garage, I just haven't had time to replace them because we were moving. I paid him $50 and he put them in and left it off the report which the report was perfect.

Anyway. this guy was as professional as they come. SO I asked him, curious, is there ANY HVAC company that he could recommend to people. (keep in mind, this is a HVAC inspector, his only business ) and he replied, "honestly no".
Its just luck, so he didnt want to say too much and I suggested their only objective is to sell you a new unit and he shook his head yes, I also told him about the lady next door and its my understanding that they can charge whatever they want and keep any amount over what the company charges, again, he said you got it and WHY HE got out of the service business and went only into inspections. The dishonesty in the business was overwhelming to him.
As advertised on TV, it never ends! Personal injury lawyers too.
 
IME HVAC are the biggest thieves of them all. No ability to even remotely justify their pricing. Case in point.
I completely agree. The prices charged for time worked and what was done is out of this world crazy.

This is why I do all my own stuff, and will buy tools when/if needed. Even investing in tooling you’re still way ahead.
 
I used to have a buddy that was an HVAC repair and salesman (didn't do install) and he's always tell me the ways HVAC guys, including him, will do to get more sales. 1-3 units bought per day equated to a $2-$3000 bonus on his check per week. It's like $600 for a capacitor and install of it when you can buy the same one yourself from the hvac distributor warehouse down the street for like $8.

I would like to add he doesn't care if people cry in front of him, calling their relatives for help with buying a new HVAC, water heater, or AC units - usually on very frigid days.

Luckily, nowadays there's online resources and youtube to help troubleshoot many things so if one is willing to do their own research they can normally come out ahead.
 
I completely agree. The prices charged for time worked and what was done is out of this world crazy.

This is why I do all my own stuff, and will buy tools when/if needed. Even investing in tooling you’re still way ahead.
Same here. Back in the day (80s) the only place an individual could readily purchase HVAC equipment was Sears but these days it is much easier. I have all sorts of tools and equipment that I've only used once or twice but the cost of the tools was hardly anything compared to the alternative.

Also Grainger still opens a branch after hours for only $50, I have used the service twice. Once for myself and for a neighbor lady when her furnace motor went out in the winter.
 
i trust very FEW repair places + always look at DIYing most everything + todays internet can not only find parts BUT can sometimes tell you how to DIY it, BUT people with deep pockets care less + are EZE prey for less than honest repairmen because they care to not even look for obvious EZE fixes + of course many people are NOT mechanical mined + have NO tools for even simple stuff!!
 
i trust very FEW repair places + always look at DIYing most everything + todays internet can not only find parts BUT can sometimes tell you how to DIY it, BUT people with deep pockets care less + are EZE prey for less than honest repairmen because they care to not even look for obvious EZE fixes + of course many people are NOT mechanical mined + have NO tools for even simple stuff!!
Why are you capitalizing random words? It's rhetorical.
 
Some of you are believing some seriously stretched stories about HVAC Techs/salespeople or are inflating them yourselves.

If it's such a lucrative industry, why don't you get out from in front of that keyboard, stop typing out all that code that needs to be fixed next week with an update and go into the HVAC business yourself?
 
Some of you are believing some seriously stretched stories about HVAC Techs/salespeople or are inflating them yourselves.

If it's such a lucrative industry, why don't you get out from in front of that keyboard, stop typing out all that code that needs to be fixed next week with an update and go into the HVAC business yourself?
Just because a job is lucrative doesn't mean people want to do it. I'm sure being a gay porn fluffer is super lucrative but that doesn't mean I want to do it.
 
Some of you are believing some seriously stretched stories about HVAC Techs/salespeople or are inflating them yourselves.

If it's such a lucrative industry, why don't you get out from in front of that keyboard, stop typing out all that code that needs to be fixed next week with an update and go into the HVAC business yourself?

So you're in HVAC or a relative is and feel a bit defensive. I'm all for small business and free enterprise until it feels greedy. In my case if I can buy a common HVAC control board easily for $120 the local HVAC place can buy it for less. Their shop is 5 minutes from me and it would have taken a tech 10 minutes from the time he touched the unit until he closed it up to change the board. I readily paid the $80 call out fee and would have paid $250 to have it fixed no question but I already knew what the board cost. Marking up the board 2x to $250 still leaves $300 for 10 minutes of actual HVAC repair, 10 minutes to drive here and back. And he used my ladder to get to the unit up in the trusses. Seems steep. If you can explain that margin I'd really like to hear it.
 
The problem is that they have so many customers that are ready and willing to drop $12-18k on new units that they don't need to concern themselves with making comparatively small potatoes each week by diagnosing repairs and sourcing replacement parts, making 2-3 trips between your house and the HVAC supply, etc. etc.

Installers around me charge 13-15k to install heat pump combos that the HVAC supply sells for $6550 and depending on where/how the air handler is installed it takes them 5-10 hours with a two man crew. That's far better money than burning an entire day to make $600 troubleshooting a malfunctioning furnace.
Agree. The first mini split I installed they said it was like $5k. I think the equipment was maybe $1500. My recommendation was straight through the exterior wall. Run of maybe 8ft. They insisted that there was no way to know the complexity of the install. I offered to drill the hole since I knew it was a hollow balloon frame.

Nothing but lies. I bought all the US made equipment, and did a superior, cleaner install than any of them ever would. Then I did another.

People on here years ago were trying to defend the hvac company because they needed to have a van, and training, and go get the unit from the supplier, and get certified to handle refrigerant. All ridiculous claims to try to justify. Irrelevant in fact. You know it because if nothing else, you know what auto shops charge to do ac work, with brick and mortar overhead and all the same tools.

HVAC tries to net hundreds of dollars an hour with no transparency and it’s crazy.
 
Some of you are believing some seriously stretched stories about HVAC Techs/salespeople or are inflating them yourselves.

If it's such a lucrative industry, why don't you get out from in front of that keyboard, stop typing out all that code that needs to be fixed next week with an update and go into the HVAC business yourself?
Actually that’s what I did. I got my own tools and installed mini splits and verified the time and effort. It validated highway robbery. I have a day job so I don’t need to run an hvac business, but I do mine, and my cars in some cases. And come out way ahead.

There’s a difference between paying for skilled labor, and paying theft prices with no substantiation of the parts and labor costs.
 
There’s a difference between paying for skilled labor, and paying theft prices with no substantiation of the parts and labor costs.

Wonder how skilled the labor was that blew up a zone controller when he was wiring it for my new house. Seems he didn't know that heat pump air handlers get 240V instead of 120V, and used the wrong tap on the transformer...which buzzed rather loudly for a few seconds and then went silent in a puff of smoke along with the zone controller.
 
A great friend got a job back in Pa as an HVAC salesman for a local company. Right off they sent him to school with one of the manufacturers to learn the equipment. When that was done he has classes on sales and closing. He was impressed with the training. Then the owner told him how he was expected to upsell from the calculated proper sizing and inflate proposals. He tried but morally just couldn't do it. This was close to 20 years ago so the situation isn't new.
 
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