North American vs. European OCI

[glennc]

double vanos:

"Final analysis: Car manufacturers know what's best for cars vs a government agency."

I have a slightly different perspective on that. Europe is economically more inclined towards protectionism than the US. Protect industries/companies/economies/jobs as they exist now. Perhaps that shows up in the ability of corporate entities like the auto manufacturers to insist on proprietary maintenance regimens, lubricants and the like. On the contrary we in the US, fortunately I believe, have specific legal protections which encourage universal serviceability, with broad-spectrum oil grading being just one example.

Perhaps this is changing. BMW does not want to make it possible for an independent shop to work on your car, so they have proprietary software and even, I believe, proprietary hardware to make it virtually impossible for an indie to effectively talk to the computer on at least some late-model bimmers. This seems to me to be a pretty sneaky way to avoid fair competition for your business, and I'm sure it's not only BMW, and pretty confident that it's only the beginning of a trend. The incentive for any corporation to incrementally increase revenues through subtle behaviors that encourage or require existing customers to become recurring streams of income is powerful, and I believe that instances like these are among those in which our usually remarkable system of free-market enterprise needs to be tempered by a little bit of careful intervention (Moss-Magnuson intent, updated for the new century).

- Glenn

 

[JohnBrowning]

I aprenticed in Germany and lived their off and on from 1976-1991. I spent most of my school year in Germany. I do not recall seeing alot of smokeing hulks either. Sure you did see the occasional pile of junk but it was rare compared to here in the USA. The fact that you must regulary get certified prevented most of this. Sure you could bribe the guys doing the testing with smokes and Jack Daniels but you could not count on that consistently. You still had to worry about being cited or inbounded by local athorities if it was bad enough.

Now the older diesels obviously belched out more soot then modern diesels but I would not say they belched out black smoke though.

While the USA was way ahead in emission laws prior to say 1991 most industrilized and or westernized European countrys are not far behind. I always wished the USA would adopt safety certification type laws that required regular checks. I hate shareing the road with some of the beat to heck unsafe piles of trash I see in the USA.

I saw a Ford Tarus that was bent in the shape of a bananah(sp) right in the middle. All four wheels did not touch the ground and the door's had bungee cords holding them shut. This guy was driveing 80mph-90mph occalateing between his four wheels. That same day I saw an old rear wheel drive olds cutlas that had $6000 in wheels and tires on a rusty body. Each time he hit a bump the car would bounce up and down about 25-30 times. This car was on the HWY doing about 75mph! It appeared to not have any shocks in the back just leaf springs.

The day before that I saw a Ford Tempo that had all four axles bent so bad that the wheels wobbled badly. I though the wheels were going to fly off. This car too was going 70mph-80mph.

I regularly see Chrysler K-cars,Saturns and Cadilacs in my area that look like they are running smoke generators for a beach landing!!!

In all my travles in Europe I have never seens as many consistently unsafe or dis-repaired automobiles as I have seen in the USA.

 

[Paranoil]

quote:

---

Perhaps that shows up in the ability of corporate entities like the auto manufacturers to insist on proprietary maintenance regimens, lubricants and the like. On the contrary we in the US, fortunately I believe, have specific legal protections which encourage universal serviceability, with broad-spectrum oil grading being just one example.

---

There is European legislation in force which states that, provided you follow the manufacturers service recommendations (time/milage/necessary checks/adjustments etc) and use parts/fluids as per the manufactures specification, you can have your vehicle serviced/maintained at any registered workshop, and the car maker cannot void your warranty. You don't have to use the manufactures appointed dealer.

quote:

---

BMW does not want to make it possible for an independent shop to work on your car, so they have proprietary software and even, I believe, proprietary hardware to make it virtually impossible for an indie to effectively talk to the computer on at least some late-model bimmers.

---

Again, there is legislation (pending I think) which means manufacturers have to allow, at least minimal interogation of their on-board computers/diagnostics by indepentant/3rd party workshop computers.