Mobil one extended performance 5w-30
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It's hard to tell, given the low resolution of the original video and photos. I'm sure this was purposeful.
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Here's another picture. Clearly the conventional oil bites big time. But quite frankly, that's way too much varnish for my tastes in the M1 photo. When you compare to the photo that Bill produced, there's no comparison. 15K mile OCIs with M1 Extended Performance, just does not make sense to me.
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Mobil 1 is factory fill in:
* Acura RDX
* Aston Martin
* All Bentley Vehicles
* Cadillac CTS, CTS-V, Escalade, XLR, XLR-V, SRX, STS and STS-V
* Chevrolet Corvette C6 and Z06
* Chevrolet TrailBlazer SS
* Chrysler 300C SRT-8
* Cobalt SS S/C Coupe
* Dodge Caliber SRT-4, Charger SRT-8, and Magnum SRT-8
* Jeep Cherokee SRT-8
* Mercedes-Benz AMG Vehicles
* Mercedes SLR
* Mitsubishi Evolution
* Pontiac Solstice GXP
* All Porsche Vehicles
* Saturn Ion Red Line and Saturn Sky Red Line
* Viper SRT-10
High praise that speaks louder than words.
How ironic, I'm the the Lib on here and yet I'm defending the capitalist pig XOM.
I never said M1 is the best oil in the world. Oil formulas change all the time. If it's good enough for some of the most prestigious cars in the world, I think it's good enough.
I guess I put more faith in the API, specs/actual lube engineers than I do voodoo analysts. Cars are lasting longer and oils have become better.
I guess Honda should have chose Castrol Syntec (same price as M1) for the new turbo RDX? The same Syntec that apparently did really poor in the TEOST test and failed the HT-06 spec.
Originally Posted By: txrhino
I see no sludge or varnish. That is typical discoloration that will be on any used engine using any oil.
After wrenching on cars for 20yrs. i'd say your statement is dead wrong. That's not "discoloration" it's varnish and it's not typical of any engine oil. I have several vehicles with over 150K and one with over 600K and none have the "discoloration" you describe and varnish as we call it. Just clean metal.
I have no axe to grind with Mobil and would describe it as a good oil but definitely overpriced. There are numerous oils that would have done as well or better for less money.
I see no sludge or varnish. That is typical discoloration that will be on any used engine using any oil.
After wrenching on cars for 20yrs. i'd say your statement is dead wrong. That's not "discoloration" it's varnish and it's not typical of any engine oil. I have several vehicles with over 150K and one with over 600K and none have the "discoloration" you describe and varnish as we call it. Just clean metal.
I have no axe to grind with Mobil and would describe it as a good oil but definitely overpriced. There are numerous oils that would have done as well or better for less money.
Originally Posted By: OilGuy
Mobil 1 EP also scores 3.9 on the industry standard TEOST test (part of GF-4, SM, Ford and Chrysler specs) to evaluate tendency to from sludge and deposits (36% less than regular M1 which scored a 5.3, and 676% less than Syntec's 26.4)
Good info OilGuy. Do you have a link?
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
What oil was used in that car at the end of the video? The valve cover was sludged up and the camshafts were heavily varnished.
Must have been Pennzoil.
Mobil 1 EP also scores 3.9 on the industry standard TEOST test (part of GF-4, SM, Ford and Chrysler specs) to evaluate tendency to from sludge and deposits (36% less than regular M1 which scored a 5.3, and 676% less than Syntec's 26.4)
Good info OilGuy. Do you have a link?
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
What oil was used in that car at the end of the video? The valve cover was sludged up and the camshafts were heavily varnished.
Must have been Pennzoil.
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
BTW: Here is a what I'd call a CLEAN motor..
...
No discoloring, NOTHING.
Not even the "discolor" that happens with any oil...
Bill
PS: BTW: motor above has 80k miles on it. VAD's photo.
What OCI did VAD follow? Most likely not 15K miles (severe service).
I can't see sludge in any of the M1 EP photos. Varnish or discoloration yes...
BTW: Here is a what I'd call a CLEAN motor..
...
No discoloring, NOTHING.
Not even the "discolor" that happens with any oil...
Bill
PS: BTW: motor above has 80k miles on it. VAD's photo.
What OCI did VAD follow? Most likely not 15K miles (severe service).
I can't see sludge in any of the M1 EP photos. Varnish or discoloration yes...
Buster
Isn't marketing grand. As you should know well, it's not the best oil that becomes factory fill, it's the one that meets minimum specs and has the lowest cost or best co-marketing agreement.
I have no problem with M1 being a pretty good oil. But the hype about it being the best oil is without foundation. Yes some auto manufacturers use it as factory fill. Other auto manufacturers use other oils like Castrol, Fuchs ... etc as factory fill. So what? All the auto manufacturer cares is that the oil that goes into it's engine will meet the minimum requirements, have a low cost to them, and will allow their engine to make it through the warranty and extended warranty periods without problems. Beyond about 100K miles, auto manufacturers quite frankly do not care.
I presented those pictures because people falsely said that Mobil 1 does not cause varnish. Clearly it does. Whether it causes sludge (which is really a function of the engine design and the detergent package) is up for debate, since XOM did not see fit to provide any high resolution photos of the engine components. But, it is clear from the way that they edited the video that they steered clear of having the independent expert discuss anything more than the main bearings.
Isn't marketing grand. As you should know well, it's not the best oil that becomes factory fill, it's the one that meets minimum specs and has the lowest cost or best co-marketing agreement.
I have no problem with M1 being a pretty good oil. But the hype about it being the best oil is without foundation. Yes some auto manufacturers use it as factory fill. Other auto manufacturers use other oils like Castrol, Fuchs ... etc as factory fill. So what? All the auto manufacturer cares is that the oil that goes into it's engine will meet the minimum requirements, have a low cost to them, and will allow their engine to make it through the warranty and extended warranty periods without problems. Beyond about 100K miles, auto manufacturers quite frankly do not care.
I presented those pictures because people falsely said that Mobil 1 does not cause varnish. Clearly it does. Whether it causes sludge (which is really a function of the engine design and the detergent package) is up for debate, since XOM did not see fit to provide any high resolution photos of the engine components. But, it is clear from the way that they edited the video that they steered clear of having the independent expert discuss anything more than the main bearings.
RI, points taken. I still disagree about quality of M1 based on your comments but everyone has their own opinions.
The only oils I'm aware of that will produce little to no varnish are your ester based oils. Maxima/Redline and maybe the new RLI oils. Amsoil/M1/PP will all show varnish if pushed to it's limits. It's hard to make out what exactly is varnish from those photos.
What is really strange to me, is the constant bashing of an oil that has always exceeded more industry specs than any other oil available on the retail shelf. It was always a true synthetic oil. As of right now, they are the ONLY large oil producer actually making an "extended drain" oil. I think they deserve more credit.
Look at the alterntives? 4-Ball wear tests, adaptive molecules, torture tests....I find all the other oil makers worse than XOM.
The only oils I'm aware of that will produce little to no varnish are your ester based oils. Maxima/Redline and maybe the new RLI oils. Amsoil/M1/PP will all show varnish if pushed to it's limits. It's hard to make out what exactly is varnish from those photos.
What is really strange to me, is the constant bashing of an oil that has always exceeded more industry specs than any other oil available on the retail shelf. It was always a true synthetic oil. As of right now, they are the ONLY large oil producer actually making an "extended drain" oil. I think they deserve more credit.
Look at the alterntives? 4-Ball wear tests, adaptive molecules, torture tests....I find all the other oil makers worse than XOM.
It's interesting that 100% of the IRL teams use Mobil 1. It's also interesting that over 1/2 of NASCAR uses Mobil 1 (XOM only gives free oil to only the 2 (soon to be 3) Penske cars; there's no rule that says you have to use the oil brand you are paid to advertise for...
As for companies only caring to protect their butt during the warranty period, I'd think that companies care very much about persuading return customers vs only caring about their own warranty obligations. A me first and customer 2nd attitude catches up with you sooner or later; it's better to have a win-win.
As for companies only caring to protect their butt during the warranty period, I'd think that companies care very much about persuading return customers vs only caring about their own warranty obligations. A me first and customer 2nd attitude catches up with you sooner or later; it's better to have a win-win.
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Why are you all getting so worked up about it?????
The only clear lesson is not to do 15K OCI with M1EP. Which of course is a bad idea with most oils. It doesn't say much about M1 and certainly doesn't say anything about M1 vs Castrol.
It simply demonstrates that 15K OCI is to be avoided. Got it. Move on. Nothing to see here
The only clear lesson is not to do 15K OCI with M1EP. Which of course is a bad idea with most oils. It doesn't say much about M1 and certainly doesn't say anything about M1 vs Castrol.
It simply demonstrates that 15K OCI is to be avoided. Got it. Move on. Nothing to see here
It is true that Mobil only gives free oil away to it's specific race teams. The others all chose to use it.
bob, I disagree. If you do extended drains it shows you should use an oil like M1 EP and not a conventional oil that really sludged up. The engine looked good overall.
bob, I disagree. If you do extended drains it shows you should use an oil like M1 EP and not a conventional oil that really sludged up. The engine looked good overall.
Buster, I am not bashing, just presenting information. However, I personally have a problem with people who blindly follow marketing hype without objective data. From my experience on BITOG, and in analysis on RS4 engines, M1 produces less than stellar wear performance when compared to other alternatives.
Originally Posted By: buster
It is true that Mobil only gives free oil away to it's specific race teams. The others all chose to use it.
bob, I disagree. If you do extended drains it shows you should use an oil like M1 EP and not a conventional oil that really sludged up. The engine looked good overall.
Buster, yet again, you're not getting the point. You and I have no way of knowing whether or not the engine looked really good. Only one part of the engine was examined by an independent expert. That was the main bearings. Otherwise, the video was carefully edited. Don't you think that the if the results were stellar across the entire engine that the guy from Southwest Research Institute would have been allowed to say much more. He was not, and in my opinion there was a reason.
I agree with a previous poster who says that 15K miles is too much, even for this oil.
It is true that Mobil only gives free oil away to it's specific race teams. The others all chose to use it.
bob, I disagree. If you do extended drains it shows you should use an oil like M1 EP and not a conventional oil that really sludged up. The engine looked good overall.
Buster, yet again, you're not getting the point. You and I have no way of knowing whether or not the engine looked really good. Only one part of the engine was examined by an independent expert. That was the main bearings. Otherwise, the video was carefully edited. Don't you think that the if the results were stellar across the entire engine that the guy from Southwest Research Institute would have been allowed to say much more. He was not, and in my opinion there was a reason.
I agree with a previous poster who says that 15K miles is too much, even for this oil.
Originally Posted By: RI_RS4
Originally Posted By: buster
It is true that Mobil only gives free oil away to it's specific race teams. The others all chose to use it.
bob, I disagree. If you do extended drains it shows you should use an oil like M1 EP and not a conventional oil that really sludged up. The engine looked good overall.
Buster, yet again, you're not getting the point. You and I have no way of knowing whether or not the engine looked really good. Only one part of the engine was examined by an independent expert. That was the main bearings. Otherwise, the video was carefully edited. Don't you think that the if the results were stellar across the entire engine that the guy from Southwest Research Institute would have been allowed to say much more. He was not, and in my opinion there was a reason.
I agree with a previous poster who says that 15K miles is too much, even for this oil.
RI, I understand your point. You may be right. I'm not saying my point of view is 100% correct. It's simply my take on it. Sure, some editing could have taken place.
Originally Posted By: buster
It is true that Mobil only gives free oil away to it's specific race teams. The others all chose to use it.
bob, I disagree. If you do extended drains it shows you should use an oil like M1 EP and not a conventional oil that really sludged up. The engine looked good overall.
Buster, yet again, you're not getting the point. You and I have no way of knowing whether or not the engine looked really good. Only one part of the engine was examined by an independent expert. That was the main bearings. Otherwise, the video was carefully edited. Don't you think that the if the results were stellar across the entire engine that the guy from Southwest Research Institute would have been allowed to say much more. He was not, and in my opinion there was a reason.
I agree with a previous poster who says that 15K miles is too much, even for this oil.
RI, I understand your point. You may be right. I'm not saying my point of view is 100% correct. It's simply my take on it. Sure, some editing could have taken place.
Originally Posted By: Mokanic
After wrenching on cars for 20yrs. i'd say your statement is dead wrong. That's not "discoloration" it's varnish and it's not typical of any engine oil. I have several vehicles with over 150K and one with over 600K and none have the "discoloration" you describe and varnish as we call it. Just clean metal.
I have yet to see under the valve cover of a car with over 100k and not see discoloration like that.
After wrenching on cars for 20yrs. i'd say your statement is dead wrong. That's not "discoloration" it's varnish and it's not typical of any engine oil. I have several vehicles with over 150K and one with over 600K and none have the "discoloration" you describe and varnish as we call it. Just clean metal.
I have yet to see under the valve cover of a car with over 100k and not see discoloration like that.
The SWRI guy said the engine was good for another 100k "probably".
I would love to see Syntec, Amsoil, RLI or whatever oil run in those conditions for 15,000 miles.
Quote:
Testing the new grades
“The goal was to design these oils to perform well in difficult situations such as harsh climate extremes and different types of driving styles,” says Bill Buck, section head, Passenger Vehicle Lubrication Development, ExxonMobil Research and Engineering Company.
Starting in the laboratory, ExxonMobil researchers developed a series of relatively basic bench-top experiments to test the new grades. From there the trials progressed to more sophisticated procedures that involved real engines and simulated actual driving conditions. Once the experimental oil earned a passing grade in the lab, more strenuous exercises followed.
Still in a controlled environment, the oils were poured into the engines of cars placed on a system of rollers. Thanks to an external fuel line that never let the gas tank reach empty, the vehicles ran for 210,000 miles, with short stops every 15,000 miles for oil drains and scheduled light maintenance.
A computer-controlled program replicated some of the worst driving conditions imaginable to further push the lubricant’s capabilities. And even then, ExxonMobil scientists looked for further proof that the oils met all requirements.
The toughest test of all
“When we were sure we had gotten it right in the lab,” says Buck, “we moved to the ‘real’ test — taxicabs in Las Vegas, Nevada.”
Buck describes Las Vegas as the “gold standard for testing,” noting that, “the driving conditions there are some of the most severe in the United States. Most of the cabs run 20 to 22 hours a day, with short downtimes for refueling and a change of drivers. With daytime temperatures that can reach 110 degrees Fahrenheit, the air conditioning runs all day and puts a lot of strain on the engines. And even though most of the trips are short, an average vehicle can put on 8,000 to 10,000 very hard miles a month, with lots of idling and quick starts and stops. So it’s a good place to see how your motor oil will stand up to extraordinary punishment.”
After extensive testing, all four grades “hit the jackpot.” Across the board, the results surpassed expectations, especially in terms of oil thickening, a persistent problem experienced by lesser-quality grades .
I would love to see Syntec, Amsoil, RLI or whatever oil run in those conditions for 15,000 miles.
Quote:
Testing the new grades
“The goal was to design these oils to perform well in difficult situations such as harsh climate extremes and different types of driving styles,” says Bill Buck, section head, Passenger Vehicle Lubrication Development, ExxonMobil Research and Engineering Company.
Starting in the laboratory, ExxonMobil researchers developed a series of relatively basic bench-top experiments to test the new grades. From there the trials progressed to more sophisticated procedures that involved real engines and simulated actual driving conditions. Once the experimental oil earned a passing grade in the lab, more strenuous exercises followed.
Still in a controlled environment, the oils were poured into the engines of cars placed on a system of rollers. Thanks to an external fuel line that never let the gas tank reach empty, the vehicles ran for 210,000 miles, with short stops every 15,000 miles for oil drains and scheduled light maintenance.
A computer-controlled program replicated some of the worst driving conditions imaginable to further push the lubricant’s capabilities. And even then, ExxonMobil scientists looked for further proof that the oils met all requirements.
The toughest test of all
“When we were sure we had gotten it right in the lab,” says Buck, “we moved to the ‘real’ test — taxicabs in Las Vegas, Nevada.”
Buck describes Las Vegas as the “gold standard for testing,” noting that, “the driving conditions there are some of the most severe in the United States. Most of the cabs run 20 to 22 hours a day, with short downtimes for refueling and a change of drivers. With daytime temperatures that can reach 110 degrees Fahrenheit, the air conditioning runs all day and puts a lot of strain on the engines. And even though most of the trips are short, an average vehicle can put on 8,000 to 10,000 very hard miles a month, with lots of idling and quick starts and stops. So it’s a good place to see how your motor oil will stand up to extraordinary punishment.”
After extensive testing, all four grades “hit the jackpot.” Across the board, the results surpassed expectations, especially in terms of oil thickening, a persistent problem experienced by lesser-quality grades .
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