I saw the movie Top Gun Maverick today. My review

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This made me laugh and I can't help but want to know how many more years in the brig or how many more times Maverick would be put to death after this movie?

 

schwinney

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I’ve seen it twice. In IMAX and regular. IMAX is overpriced for not much more. Movie is great either way. Seen the first one about 100 times. Used to live in San Diego so I even went to check out the filming spots. Some things are funny. The sailing scene was not San Diego. Penny’s house is in San Pedro, The bar was built on the Coronado beach as a set, bummer, wish it was real. Penny is a single mom with a Rolex, vintage Porsche, beach house, $$$$ sail boat, owns a beach front bar? Maverick does use Snap-on tools. I liked that. What about the CA motorcycle helmet law?

Provided by the Navy...

I guess it makes sense. Snap-On must be the very best.

CA motorcycle helmet law

On Federal land?
 

Astro14

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Well they never really say it, but the only country with F14s is Iran and I don't think they have 5th gen fighters yet, but I guess it's a movie and maybe it happens somehow in the future. Plus with a specific gps coordinate, can't you fire a lot of cruise missiles, regular missiles or whatever to hit the target? Some of them would get through the SAM guarding it. But yeah, check your brain at the door and enjoy those flying sequences.
The tactics were a plot construct.

The deep valley/mountain bowl in which the target was located precluded a lot of weapon types, and a lot of delivery types, so that it had to be a manned aircraft delivery using low level ingress and a high G, high risk egress.

The Punch Bowl, a similar bowl in the Chocolate Mountains North of Yuma and the Salton Sea, has tanks and other armor for targets. Dropping live bombs in the Punch Bowl required a low level ingress, followed by a high pop (AB climb to mid altitude, roll over, pull into 45 degree dive) delivery. So, I've done the same type of attack, though it lacked the pretty scenery of valley streams and snow-capped peaks.

A heavy SAM threat, as part of a good IADS (Integrated Air Defense System - Including early warning radars, GCI radars, ELINT systems, Sam acquisition and targeting radars, SAMs themselves, and of course, fighter bases and fighters), precludes a lot of delivery tactics and a lot of weapon types.

You can take down an IADS, as part of a serious campaign, but it's a process, involves both kinetic and other methods, and is going to be viewed by the target nation as starting a full-scale war.

Taking out one target, on one strike, and leaving, as the Israelis did with Iraq's nuclear facilities at Osirak, is far more preferable to starting a full-scale war. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Opera

The tactics of low level ingress in a canyon were believable...and also convenient for showing off low level flying by Super Hornets.

The movie wasn't made to be totally realistic, it was made for general audiences, but the tactics, and the flying, were realistic enough. They were far better than the first movie. When you see dust kicked up on the desert floor (filmed near Fallon, from the looks of it) by a high-G pull up of an F/A-18 that was very low - that was a camera on a real F/A-18 flying very low.

Very low.

The enemy order of battle was also a plot construct. The "5th Generation fighters" looked a lot like the SU-57, which Russia hasn't yet exported because they've only built a few of them so far. They had to get an F-14 in there, so, yeah, a fictional adversary nation.

You bet I loved it when they decided to steal the F-14. The engines don't start that quick, and there isn't a round counter for the gun, but again, keeping the story/plot moving was a driver above technical accuracy. The sequences in the F-14 were filmed in the cockpit. Those switches, emergency wingsweep handle, and multitude of circuit breakers, were all authentic, even if their use wasn't exactly correct. You would use auto for the wingsweep, not the emergency handle, and full flaps, not flaps up, would've been a better choice for short field takeoff.

I talked about "splitting the throttles" to rapidly maneuver the airplane at low speed in my thread on the F-14. I smiled at that detail - they clearly talked to a Tomcat driver when they wrote this movie, even if not every detail was technically accurate.

Penny Benjamin was a really well done character - a link back to the original move, believable (yeah, I know, yacht, Porsche, beach house, but it's Hollywood, and the P-51 is out of reach of a Navy Captain, too) and beautifully portrayed by Jennifer Connelly, who was the right age for Maverick while still looking fabulous in her 50s.

I thought the inclusion of Val Kilmer, in his present condition, was a poignant and powerful link back to the first movie. The text exchanges were great. The missing man formation was as well done as I've seen them and the Veteran's Cemetery at Point Loma was a fitting site for his funeral. Wings pounded into a coffin was also a great plot point, done for many years as a tradition in the Navy, particularly among SEALs.

Many of the characters, while well done, made no sense from a billet/job perspective. "Hondo" the project director made no sense as the guy doling out pushups, or rigging the barricade. He wouldn't be immediately put in charge of the flight deck like that. The admirals were similarly multi-role in a way that made no sense - but having different characters in each of those roles - Strike Group Commander, Air Boss, Top Gun/NSAWC CO would've been too confusing for the audience and would've diluted the Maverick/Top Brass conflict that was key to the story.

In all, I loved it. Sure, it had some technical inaccuracies, but it was fun, it was believable, it was engaging and it had great flying.

A worthy and well-done sequel to the original.

Go see it.
 

Astro14

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This made me laugh and I can't help but want to know how many more years in the brig or how many more times Maverick would be put to death after this movie?


Every clown with a Youtube presence and a military connection wants to comment on the movie.

...yawn...

Wake me up when someone who has a couple hundred traps, a hundred combat missions flying off a boat, some time in the F-14, and a realistic perspective on the whole thing is talking...

Ward "Mooch" Carroll - A friend and fellow Tomcat guy gives a good review of the movie.

Every other video I've seen on it, every other one, is some clown like this guy trying to tear it down to make themselves look good and generate traffic.
 
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Every clown with a Youtube presence and a military connection wants to comment on the movie.

...yawn...

Wake me up when someone who has a couple hundred traps, a hundred combat missions flying off a boat, some time in the F-14, and a realistic perspective on the whole thing is talking...

Ward "Mooch" Carroll - A friend and fellow Tomcat guy gives a good review of the movie.

Every other video I've seen on it, every other one, is some clown like this guy trying to tear it down to make themselves look good and generate traffic.
Well...these guys only address the legality of various movies. One guy is a former JAG lawyer and all he does is cover what could happen if you actually did a flyby or disobeyed an order or decided to follow a woman into the bathroom. It has nothing to do with whether or not it's a good movie.

He reviews a bunch of movies from a legal POV - the My Cousin Vinny review is also funny.
 
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The movie wasn't made to be totally realistic, it was made for general audiences, but the tactics, and the flying, were realistic enough. They were far better than the first movie. When you see dust kicked up on the desert floor (filmed near Fallon, from the looks of it) by a high-G pull up of an F/A-18 that was very low - that was a camera on a real F/A-18 flying very low.

Very low.

I watched a few behind the scenes videos on youtube and they said that was filmed at the salt flats. I assumed they meant Bonneville but I guess it could be somewhere else. The plane really did fly over the crew only by a couple dozen feet or so to get the shot of the sand/salt vortex when it went vertical.

I talked about "splitting the throttles" to rapidly maneuver the airplane at low speed in my thread on the F-14. I smiled at that detail - they clearly talked to a Tomcat driver when they wrote this movie, even if not every detail was technically accurate.

I'm glad you touched on this because I was meaning to ask you if it was even a real thing.
 
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Every clown with a Youtube presence and a military connection wants to comment on the movie.

...yawn...

Wake me up when someone who has a couple hundred traps, a hundred combat missions flying off a boat, some time in the F-14, and a realistic perspective on the whole thing is talking...

Ward "Mooch" Carroll - A friend and fellow Tomcat guy gives a good review of the movie.

Every other video I've seen on it, every other one, is some clown like this guy trying to tear it down to make themselves look good and generate traffic.
So what are your thoughts on a man being able to pull more g's than guys that are probably 36 years younger than him in the first movie? I suppose maybe you can outshoot someone no matter the age due to better skills. I think of it like marathon runners, yeah, there are some pretty fast guys in their 50/60s, but they're not winning the race, the guys in their 20/30s are, they're just winning in their age category.

And yeah, isn't an F14 that's still flying and maintained by a different country going to be a little bit different than the last time you flew it a few decades ago?

Anyway, still fun to watch.
 
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Taking out one target, on one strike, and leaving, as the Israelis did with Iraq's nuclear facilities at Osirak, is far more preferable to starting a full-scale war. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Opera
Oh yeah, I seem to remember that being mentioned about some new facilities, they've built them much deeper in the earth so that regular bombs wouldn't be able to get to them and they might even be safe from bunker busters.
 

Astro14

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So what are your thoughts on a man being able to pull more g's than guys that are probably 36 years younger than him in the first movie? I suppose maybe you can outshoot someone no matter the age due to better skills. I think of it like marathon runners, yeah, there are some pretty fast guys in their 50/60s, but they're not winning the race, the guys in their 20/30s are, they're just winning in their age category.

And yeah, isn't an F14 that's still flying and maintained by a different country going to be a little bit different than the last time you flew it a few decades ago?

Anyway, still fun to watch.
I haven't pulled 9 G in 25 years, so, I don't know how realistic that is, however, guys in their 60s are still doing aerobatic competitions, which require high G - so I don't see that as unrealistic.

Are you certain that an F-14 maintained by a different country is going to have any serious differences?

They (both the real country, and in the movie, the fictional country) haven't replaced the engines, or flight controls, or most of the weapon system. Sure, a few components might be updated, like radios, and missiles, but fundamentally, the jet, as it exists in the real world, and in the movie, is the same as when it rolled off the Grumman assembly line.

I could get in a Boeing 757, not much newer than the F-14, owned by any nation, and still fly it. I don't see what happened in the movie, starting up and flying an old airplane, as a stretch at all.

I sat in an F-14 cockpit a few years ago, in the Naval Aviation Museum in Pensacola. I closed my eyes, reached out and put my hands on every single switch and control, just as I remembered them.

I don't think anyone who isn't a fighter pilot can understand how connected you are to the machine.

I didn't get 2,000 hours by flying long, boring, multi hour missions. Flights were short, intense, and I had to know the airplane inside and out. I started the engines thousands of times. I reached for every switch and control thousands of time. I could walk you through the start sequence (greatly abbreviated in the movie) because I still remember exactly how I did it back then.

I even remember every single memory item from the emergency procedures. I had to know them, by heart, years ago, my life depended on that. So, yeah, I remember every single word, every single step, of those procedures.

Sitting in that airplane recently, it was all still muscle memory for me.

I have no doubt, that given a chance, I could fly the airplane again.

On a moment's notice.
 
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Military personnel must use helmets whenever riding a motorcycle, even in jurisdictions that don't require them, even while off duty.

Any civilian riding on a military base for any reason must also use a helmet.

 
Last edited:

schwinney

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Talk about the "supermaneuverability" of the 5th gen fighter scene near the end! When the F-14 shot a missile at it @Astro14 😀
 

schwinney

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I haven't pulled 9 G in 25 years, so, I don't know how realistic that is, however, guys in their 60s are still doing aerobatic competitions, which require high G - so I don't see that as unrealistic.

Are you certain that an F-14 maintained by a different country is going to have any serious differences?

They (both the real country, and in the movie, the fictional country) haven't replaced the engines, or flight controls, or most of the weapon system. Sure, a few components might be updated, like radios, and missiles, but fundamentally, the jet, as it exists in the real world, and in the movie, is the same as when it rolled off the Grumman assembly line.

I could get in a Boeing 757, not much newer than the F-14, owned by any nation, and still fly it. I don't see what happened in the movie, starting up and flying an old airplane, as a stretch at all.

I sat in an F-14 cockpit a few years ago, in the Naval Aviation Museum in Pensacola. I closed my eyes, reached out and put my hands on every single switch and control, just as I remembered them.

I don't think anyone who isn't a fighter pilot can understand how connected you are to the machine.

I didn't get 2,000 hours by flying long, boring, multi hour missions. Flights were short, intense, and I had to know the airplane inside and out. I started the engines thousands of times. I reached for every switch and control thousands of time. I could walk you through the start sequence (greatly abbreviated in the movie) because I still remember exactly how I did it back then.

I even remember every single memory item from the emergency procedures. I had to know them, by heart, years ago, my life depended on that. So, yeah, I remember every single word, every single step, of those procedures.

Sitting in that airplane recently, it was all still muscle memory for me.

I have no doubt, that given a chance, I could fly the airplane again.

On a moment's notice.

I was thinking about you that whole scene.

Look for, what is it, Circuit breaker 2.. or is it Channel 2..
 

schwinney

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Military personnel must use helmets whenever riding a motorcycle, even in jurisdictions that don't require them, even while off duty.

Any civilian riding on a military base for any reason must also use a helmet.

Provided by the Navy...

I guess it makes sense. Snap-On must be the very best.



On Federal land?

Looks like so.

Thanks @mk378
 
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I haven't pulled 9 G in 25 years, so, I don't know how realistic that is, however, guys in their 60s are still doing aerobatic competitions, which require high G - so I don't see that as unrealistic.

Are you certain that an F-14 maintained by a different country is going to have any serious differences?

They (both the real country, and in the movie, the fictional country) haven't replaced the engines, or flight controls, or most of the weapon system. Sure, a few components might be updated, like radios, and missiles, but fundamentally, the jet, as it exists in the real world, and in the movie, is the same as when it rolled off the Grumman assembly line.

I could get in a Boeing 757, not much newer than the F-14, owned by any nation, and still fly it. I don't see what happened in the movie, starting up and flying an old airplane, as a stretch at all.

I sat in an F-14 cockpit a few years ago, in the Naval Aviation Museum in Pensacola. I closed my eyes, reached out and put my hands on every single switch and control, just as I remembered them.

I don't think anyone who isn't a fighter pilot can understand how connected you are to the machine.

I didn't get 2,000 hours by flying long, boring, multi hour missions. Flights were short, intense, and I had to know the airplane inside and out. I started the engines thousands of times. I reached for every switch and control thousands of time. I could walk you through the start sequence (greatly abbreviated in the movie) because I still remember exactly how I did it back then.

I even remember every single memory item from the emergency procedures. I had to know them, by heart, years ago, my life depended on that. So, yeah, I remember every single word, every single step, of those procedures.

Sitting in that airplane recently, it was all still muscle memory for me.

I have no doubt, that given a chance, I could fly the airplane again.

On a moment's notice.
So what was Tom doing in that start sequence where he had to wait for the gauge to hit a certain number? I just figured that Iran did whatever it could to keep them flying and the original factory parts were no longer made so they might have made some of their own parts for various systems so it'd be a slightly different variant of the plane like an F14A vs F14D. But I guess for a short flight like that, it doesn't really matter.
 

schwinney

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Not the same plane but... Wowzers



Yeah I was watching and I was like 😮😮😮I almost want to see it again just to see that.

The airplane almost did like Bumblebee did in Transformers 1 off the rockets at the end just not really... it looked like it stayed in one spot and shapeshifted....
 
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