Hyundai Motor closes engine development division. All development will focus on EV

[eljefino]

In reality the Feds and state governments are going "all in" to push EVs on the people, who largely don't want it or cannot afford it. I absolutely do not want it. Because I know this is ushering in a "total consumer control and monitoring" ecosystem.

My Toyota has a cellular connection to the mothership. I told them to ignore my car but the connection remains. Removing the fuse for it also removes my ability to do handsfree calls with my own cell phone.

The government had nothing to do with this. Toyota Finance could find and repo my car with this info, though. This is the same toyota that wants to charge eight bucks a month to use your own key fob to start their cars.

 

[IndyFan]

Better hope someone builds nuke plants. Current and projected electric power production won't handle the projected demand.

Companies should be careful putting all eggs in one basket.

There is one other question, though. What's their time frame? If it is even a few years away, it can be a decision that can be reversed.

 

[oilcandave]

I don't have 'sources' just my memory. I don't support taxpayers subsidizing fossil fuel exploration, production and consumption either because I've seen first hand how gov't agencies WASTE money. The attitude is different when you're spending other people's money. I am a fan of smaller government period. It's pretty telling that virtually every Congressperson ans Senator get richer while in office. Unfortunately our media, who should be looking into such things, has joined in the game.

I hope all of us will get richer while we work??

I guess trickle down doesn't work when its tax money trickling down??

Small government needs to keep outa my bedroom also...right to privacy from the government is my first priority...

 

[Mainia]

Hyundai haven't use dual injection yet, will they just stick with GDI till ICE is illegal on the road?
What about their Global Engine Alliance?
Well I guess no more MPG improvement from Hyundai in next gen...

Yes they have, 2 years ago in Asia and 2022 cars in North America on some model engines.

 

[oilcandave]

Better hope someone builds nuke plants. Current and projected electric power production won't handle the projected demand.

Companies should be careful putting all eggs in one basket.

There is one other question, though. What's their time frame? If it is even a few years away, it can be a decision that can be reversed.

Just think of the projected electric power needed way back when it just came online..we got through it. We will again.

 

[nthach]

I think the government should stay out of it. If consumer demand is high enough then we will see the service stations ripping out their car washes and installing charge points. That will also require expansion of the electrical infrastructure including power generation and transmission/distribution. We are not even close to that yet.

Toyota had a pie in the sky dream about hydrogen being the go-to ZEV fuel. It can be reformed from methane or hydrolyzed from water - which would be something Chevron, XOM, Shell, BP, Sinopec, SK, GS and Idemitsu would be all over.

But fuel cells will never go beyond public transit and big rigs and even so, BEV is seen more favorably in buses and trucks.

 

[IndyFan]

Just think of the projected electric power needed way back when it just came online..we got through it. We will again.

When what came online?

 

[CKN]

Hate to say it, but they had trouble building a reliable engine anyway.

C'mon critic you don't own one. The wife's Santa Fe w/the 3.3 is getting ready to hit 50,000 miles. And at 291 horses that things moves! But the thing is-unlike Ford and GM-Hyundai stands behind their products-and replaces those motors and warrants the powertrain for 100,000 miles. Does RAM do that?

 

[oilcandave]

When what came online?

There was this guy...Edison I believe...who worked very hard on electric transmission and other related issues. None before then and after many years of development we have our modern electric grid...I guess modern...

We can start there and improve on it for EV's unless not enough return for investors.

 

[philipp10]

Can you imagine the number of former mechanical engineers that specialized in ICE that will soon be looking to switch to new branches of ME work? I sure wouldn't specialize in ICE anymore, it's days are numbered. Really it's an end to an era, kind of sad to see.

 

[oilcandave]

Can you imagine the number of former mechanical engineers that specialized in ICE that will soon be looking to switch to new branches of ME work? I sure wouldn't specialize in ICE anymore, it's days are numbered. Really it's an end to an era, kind of sad to see.

Funny ya bring that up...I have spent a lot of time as a younger man racing slot cars, rewinding armatures, gearing, more efficient electrical pickups etc. Modding electric is a lot of fun too.

Just imagine the aftermarket stuff that will appear like adjustable current limiters and such.

 

[CharlesInCharge]

...and we have oil subsidies...

Oil/energy independence is a key component of national defense, so it makes sense the government would provide tax breaks to oil companies to keep finding and producing oil domestically. I have no problem with the ~$11 billion annually to retain such an important resource.

Oh, and I'm confident it's made up through heavy state/federal gasoline taxes.

There's a 19 cent federal tax on gasoline, per gallon.
In CA, for example, it's a state 67 cent tax on gasoline, per gallon.
In PA it's 59 cents/gallon.

I'd venture this more than exceeds the $11 billion; in fact in 2016 federal taxes raised >3 times that amount, $36 billion. States raised massive amounts of tax revenue from gasoline too.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_taxes_in_the_United_States

I do have a big problem with propping up EVs for mostly the elite socialites that benefits almost nobody in the middle or lower classes. Investments, tax breaks, charging stations, etc.

 

[Bjornviken]

Do you take everything this literally? Yeah, guy, I understand Toyotas are wildly popular around the globe. These ICE vehicles are easy to maintain, and run for decades. Probably 95% or greater of the world needs ultra reliable rugged gasoline or diesel powered engines, generators, etc.

Guess what's not going to be popular outside your $9 per cup latte drinking friends outside of the 1% in urban population hubs where there's reliable grids with power outlets at every Chevron or McMansion? EVs. There are parts of the world that RUN on gasoline to make electricity. Much of the world does NOT have electricity outside of generators. There is no infrastructure to make it, move it, etc.

I've been to MANY 1st, 2nd and 3rd world nations where there simply IS NO electrical outlet within miles. Probably 75% of Australia is barren with no outlets, for instance. Probably 90% of Africa. Probably 75% of the Middle East. How are you going to charge an EV? A gas generator? lol.

Then look at Europe. Most people live in apartments or flats without the capability to charge their cars which are parked in lots or on streets... how do you solve that problem?

Agree with you, here in northern Europe owning a ev car is a Nightmare in wintertimes. Image to charge your car in -20C -30C and while your on a trip to your relatives on Christmas day. I still prefere Diesel Hilux on snowing days.

 

[CharlesInCharge]

Just think of the projected electric power needed way back when it just came online..we got through it. We will again.

Eh, just disregard the 59 people whose deaths in Texas were attributed to the grid failure.

No, we won't just "get thru it." The US power grid is flirting with collapse already in many states, including CA. The amount of money to upgrade it will continue to financially cripple the nation.

But it's worth it so the elite can have their $15 lattes while surfing Google hands free driving in CA gridlock traffic.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Oil/energy independence is a key component of national defense, so it makes sense the government would provide tax breaks to oil companies to keep finding and producing oil domestically. I have no problem with the ~$11 billion annually to retain such an important resource.

Oh, and I'm confident it's made up through heavy state/federal gasoline taxes.

There's a 19 cent federal tax on gasoline, per gallon.
In CA, for example, it's a state 67 cent tax on gasoline, per gallon.
In PA it's 59 cents/gallon.

I'd venture this more than exceeds the $11 billion; in fact in 2016 federal taxes raised >3 times that amount, $36 billion. States raised massive amounts of tax revenue from gasoline too.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_taxes_in_the_United_States

I do have a big problem with propping up EVs for mostly the elite socialites that benefits almost nobody in the middle or lower classes. Investments, tax breaks, charging stations, etc.

Charles, the oil companies are enjoying insane profits; they don't need my tax dollars!
CA wannabe 91* premium is $5 per gallon, plus 10 cents if you use a credit card.
Subsidies and taxation at the pump both?

You are not in favor of subsidies that benefit the elite socialites but you are in favor of subsidies for the elite socialites?
Personally, I am not in favor of either.

 

[philipp10]

Charles, the oil companies are enjoying insane profits; they don't need my tax dollars!
CA wannabe 91* premium is $5 per gallon, plus 10 cents if you use a credit card.
Subsidies and taxation at the pump both?

You are not in favor of subsidies that benefit the elite socialites but you are in favor of subsidies for the elite socialites?
Personally, I am not in favor of either.

And with EV's, we are WAY beyond usage by just wealthy socialites. The EV revelution is here....just not for the older dinosaurs like me and on this site. But talk to the young kids and they are on board big time.

 

[PandaBear]

I'll give you 1 guess... It's ALWAYS the government's fault, doncha know?

No, it is alway the urban elite's fault when their downtown residents have asthma and ruin the rural lifestyle of towing a boat and a trailer uphill once a year, while rolling coal when they are not.

 

[PandaBear]

We would still have states with slavery if we left that decision "organic".

Not to be political, the slavery thing is really the owners trying to cut cost when competing with an industrial economy. Same for minimum wage, owning a slave is not free (you need to feed them, house them, secure them, etc) and when electricity and assembly line became popular there will eventually be an incentive to obsolete slavery.

We are seeing a lot of this in all sorts of industry today "disrupting" old ones. Do you still walk to a physical travel agent and pay more than 25% to book a hotel or plane ticket? I think the margin of online agent is about 10% for plane tickets and 20% for hotels, you need to pay a lot more for a physical travel agent to survive.

 

[PandaBear]

Perhaps check your sources. The Energy bill that supported Solyndra has made huge profits due to interest payments. Yes, Solyndra and other companies failed and defaulted on loans.
The US taxpayers subsidize tens of billions of dollars annually for fossil fuel exploration, production and consumption.

Interestingly, the old Solyndra buildings (500,000 sq ft) have been leased and are used by Tesla, as they are close to the Fremont plant. Over 10,000 employees work at the various buildings, including 1,000 at Solyndra, along interstate 880.

Solyndra is a casualty of competition, not that they are trying to scam people, IMO. I know a guy who works in solar panel production equipment (laser), and basically what he said was they were selling so many equipment to China that they know the price of solar panels will come down, making the advantage of thin film tube based solar like Solyndra obsolete.

This kind of casualty happens in every single field that grow very rapidly, sometimes they are lucky that they merge, and others when they lose until they are 1 of the 3-5 sources and the market stablized.

Should US go without solar incentive? Maybe, but that incentive start a few years after we had Enron monopolized our grid and after we have $120/barrel oil price. Voters are there to do anything to stick it back to the oil man and companies who manipulated their grids. People weren't going to be complaining about solar cost when oil was $120/barrel, and if it weren't because we got lucky with fracking and horizontal drilling boom until recently, we would have been doing $5/gal gas for the last decade. Of course now Chesapeake went bankrupt and fracking slowed down, oil price shot back up and people started complaining again.

 

[PandaBear]

I don't have 'sources' just my memory. I don't support taxpayers subsidizing fossil fuel exploration, production and consumption either because I've seen first hand how gov't agencies WASTE money. The attitude is different when you're spending other people's money. I am a fan of smaller government period. It's pretty telling that virtually every Congressperson ans Senator get richer while in office. Unfortunately our media, who should be looking into such things, has joined in the game.

The military budget to dominate the entire world is the biggest subsidies to the energy sector. Sadly, there is no way energy can be decoupled from international politics, no freaking way. So we are stuck with paying our share of defense budget regardless of how many gals we use per month and how much we don't want to get messy with wars and casualties.