I know this might be a hard question to answer, but I own two Honda's '10 Civic and '10 Accord 4 cyl, they both recommend the use of 5w20 but I have yet to see a 5w20 that is certified HTO-6. I understand they made this cert. for their more powerful vehicles. If the only oils made for this extreme enviroment are 5w30's, does this mean they are more trusted by Honda engineers to protect engines? Is this 5/20 thing just a CAFE deal? Thanks
Does HTO-6 prove 5w30 is Better than 5w20
- Thread starter chubbs1
- Start date
- Status
The only Honda powered vehicle that I'm aware of is an Acura which is a V6 trubo that requires that spec.
The HT-06 spec is for high temp deposit control in the turbo bearings. It is also a synthetic oil spec you might say, as only a synthetic can meet this high temp test.
So to answer your question, no, 5w30 is not better that 5W-20 in every other Honda/Acura they make.
The HT-06 spec is for high temp deposit control in the turbo bearings. It is also a synthetic oil spec you might say, as only a synthetic can meet this high temp test.
So to answer your question, no, 5w30 is not better that 5W-20 in every other Honda/Acura they make.
Originally Posted By: Johnny
The only Honda powered vehicle that I'm aware of is an Acura which is a V6 trubo that requires that spec.
So don't worry about it unless you drive the RDX.
The only Honda powered vehicle that I'm aware of is an Acura which is a V6 trubo that requires that spec.
So don't worry about it unless you drive the RDX.
Yes and No.
5W-20's main goal is fuel economy, yes. But,'normal' passenger car operation is pretty mild on oil, so most engine run fine on 20-weights, whether it is a 5W-20, OR a 5w30 that has sheared down to a 20-weight.
Extreme operating conditions, whether extreme RPM, extreme loads, or extreme heat, will almost always require a heavier oil to deal with these things - you will likely never see a turbo-approved 20-weight oil.
For your mild, everyday Honda's, 5W-20 is just fine, and is trusted by honda to protect those engines JUST AS MUCH as 5w30 is trusted to protect a turbo engine.....
5W-20's main goal is fuel economy, yes. But,'normal' passenger car operation is pretty mild on oil, so most engine run fine on 20-weights, whether it is a 5W-20, OR a 5w30 that has sheared down to a 20-weight.
Extreme operating conditions, whether extreme RPM, extreme loads, or extreme heat, will almost always require a heavier oil to deal with these things - you will likely never see a turbo-approved 20-weight oil.
For your mild, everyday Honda's, 5W-20 is just fine, and is trusted by honda to protect those engines JUST AS MUCH as 5w30 is trusted to protect a turbo engine.....
JHZR2
Staff member
Does your engine have a set=up that requires HTO-06? If not, then it is irrelevant.
We could argue all day long about this spec, or similarly about ACEA A1 vs. A3, or whatever else folks want to show as a "High performance" oil versus a "standard" variant, and someone will show the more robust version in a benign application doing well, others will show the less robust oil performing really well in one of these more severe applications...
So much of it depends upon use profile, application, etc. Ideally one will use the least viscous oil they can to provide protection from wear of moving parts. However, that is a rather unclear statement, and open to interpretation... Thus the issue.
I dont see this spec as telling anything. It just means that something had to be done to address turbo applications. manufacturers chose 5w30 at this point, likely for a host of reasons, none of which are necessarily relevant to the NA engine variants.
We could argue all day long about this spec, or similarly about ACEA A1 vs. A3, or whatever else folks want to show as a "High performance" oil versus a "standard" variant, and someone will show the more robust version in a benign application doing well, others will show the less robust oil performing really well in one of these more severe applications...
So much of it depends upon use profile, application, etc. Ideally one will use the least viscous oil they can to provide protection from wear of moving parts. However, that is a rather unclear statement, and open to interpretation... Thus the issue.
I dont see this spec as telling anything. It just means that something had to be done to address turbo applications. manufacturers chose 5w30 at this point, likely for a host of reasons, none of which are necessarily relevant to the NA engine variants.
Viscosity is not a "one size fits all" category and the OE does a pretty good job of determining requirements based on their predictions of "normal" service. The viscosity recommendations of any manufacturer do not necessarily reflect "good" vs "bad." Just "right" or "wrong" according to the application. Generally, 5W20 is not recommended for high performance engines... but that doesn't mean that the oil recommended for the HO engine is "better" for your ordinary engine or that it will make it last longer. If you run the mucas out of your Honda, or live in a very hot climate, maybe so.
It's basically about oil temp (and the required HTHS) and ordinary engines generally don't need the extra viscosity because they are not running high oil temps. Look at a temperature/viscosity chart and compare a 5W20 and a 5W30. Most engines run oil temps in the 190-212 range when they get fully warmed up. It usually takes about 15+ miles of driving to get the oil temp up to whatever is the normal max. If your engine runs only 10 of those minutes, the oil temp might be only at 180. Compare the viscosities at that temp and you'll see the potential for energy wasteage. In general, 5W20s are more shear stable than 5W30s.
We get pretty pedantic here about the 5W20 vs 5W30 thing but IMO, there isn't enough difference for the average car to matter much either way. The 30 grade won't gain you anything tangible in the wear department, though you might lose a fraction of fuel economy (more pronounced on a short hopper). The 5W20 doesn't cost you any wear and tear, unless you run really hard and really hot. Even then, Honda may stand by it.
After many years second guessing the OE, I've come to the conclusion they do a pretty good job recommending the right viscosity. Exceptions exist, so it pays to know your stuff. Also, attention to the caveats listed in the oil recommendations in your manual.
It's basically about oil temp (and the required HTHS) and ordinary engines generally don't need the extra viscosity because they are not running high oil temps. Look at a temperature/viscosity chart and compare a 5W20 and a 5W30. Most engines run oil temps in the 190-212 range when they get fully warmed up. It usually takes about 15+ miles of driving to get the oil temp up to whatever is the normal max. If your engine runs only 10 of those minutes, the oil temp might be only at 180. Compare the viscosities at that temp and you'll see the potential for energy wasteage. In general, 5W20s are more shear stable than 5W30s.
We get pretty pedantic here about the 5W20 vs 5W30 thing but IMO, there isn't enough difference for the average car to matter much either way. The 30 grade won't gain you anything tangible in the wear department, though you might lose a fraction of fuel economy (more pronounced on a short hopper). The 5W20 doesn't cost you any wear and tear, unless you run really hard and really hot. Even then, Honda may stand by it.
After many years second guessing the OE, I've come to the conclusion they do a pretty good job recommending the right viscosity. Exceptions exist, so it pays to know your stuff. Also, attention to the caveats listed in the oil recommendations in your manual.
HT-06 likely requires an HT/HS of >/= 2.9cP.
End of story.
End of story.
Originally Posted By: Johnny
The only Honda powered vehicle that I'm aware of is an Acura which is a V6 trubo(sic) that requires that spec.
...
I thought that the RDX was a 4 cyl turbo. Those Ford Taurus V6 TT ads must be burnt into the ole gray matter
The only Honda powered vehicle that I'm aware of is an Acura which is a V6 trubo(sic) that requires that spec.
...
I thought that the RDX was a 4 cyl turbo. Those Ford Taurus V6 TT ads must be burnt into the ole gray matter
Last edited:
5 20 is a MUCH more stable oil than a 5w30 and prob would leave less deposits than the fauxsyn M1 if it had adequate viscosity.
Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
Originally Posted By: Johnny
The only Honda powered vehicle that I'm aware of is an Acura which is a V6 trubo(sic) that requires that spec.
...
I thought that the RDX was a 4 cyl turbo. Those Ford Taurus V6 TT ads must be burnt into the ole gray matter
It is a 2.3L 4 cyl turbo.
Originally Posted By: Johnny
The only Honda powered vehicle that I'm aware of is an Acura which is a V6 trubo(sic) that requires that spec.
...
I thought that the RDX was a 4 cyl turbo. Those Ford Taurus V6 TT ads must be burnt into the ole gray matter
It is a 2.3L 4 cyl turbo.
The HTO-06 is for one engine that specs 5-30. It would be worthless to market a 5-20 that passes that spec, as it would be to make a 15-40 and add that spec. Who would be looking for it?
It's also a high temp deposit test, not really relevant to non-turbo applications.
It's also a high temp deposit test, not really relevant to non-turbo applications.
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Johnny
The only Honda powered vehicle that I'm aware of is an Acura which is a V6 trubo that requires that spec. . . .
And the current Civic Si's with their 8K rpm motors.
The only Honda powered vehicle that I'm aware of is an Acura which is a V6 trubo that requires that spec. . . .
And the current Civic Si's with their 8K rpm motors.
Thank you all for the answers
Originally Posted By: Gurney
Originally Posted By: Johnny
The only Honda powered vehicle that I'm aware of is an Acura which is a V6 trubo that requires that spec. . . .
And the current Civic Si's with their 8K rpm motors.
I should have said that Honda also specifies 5w30 weight motor oil (but not HTO-06) for its current Civic Si's (and, previously, the Acura RSX Type S). As others have noted, HTO-06 is a high temperature/high shear specification unique to Acura's four-cylinder turbocharged engine.
Originally Posted By: Johnny
The only Honda powered vehicle that I'm aware of is an Acura which is a V6 trubo that requires that spec. . . .
And the current Civic Si's with their 8K rpm motors.
I should have said that Honda also specifies 5w30 weight motor oil (but not HTO-06) for its current Civic Si's (and, previously, the Acura RSX Type S). As others have noted, HTO-06 is a high temperature/high shear specification unique to Acura's four-cylinder turbocharged engine.
Originally Posted By: FZ1
Best to stay with the OEM spec oil for warranty purposes. If you want a "thicker" 5-20 just look at the specs and pick one. Just stay within the 5-20 spec.
The owners manual is usually written as a "recommendation" not a spec and most all manufacturers (with a couple exceptions) caution the owner to use " ... higher viscosity oil to provide adequate lubrication ..." in towing, high speed operation or> high temperature climates. They say "5w30 (or 5w-20) preferred" as this is a federal requirement for CAFE.
Best to stay with the OEM spec oil for warranty purposes. If you want a "thicker" 5-20 just look at the specs and pick one. Just stay within the 5-20 spec.
The owners manual is usually written as a "recommendation" not a spec and most all manufacturers (with a couple exceptions) caution the owner to use " ... higher viscosity oil to provide adequate lubrication ..." in towing, high speed operation or> high temperature climates. They say "5w30 (or 5w-20) preferred" as this is a federal requirement for CAFE.
I have 06 Acura RSX base which calls for 5W-20. Previous owner used dealership for the oil changes. From the receipts I can see that in the beginning they were using Quaker State 5w30 for 2 oil changes, and then switched to Acura 5W-20. I put M1 EP 5w30 in it and noticed a significant reduction in valvetrain noise. Engine seems to run smoother and quieter with it. Needless to say I'll be sticking to 5w30 or 0W-30. The only 2 5W-20 oils I *might* try would be Pennzoil Ultra or M1 EP since they seem to have higher HTHS numbers than the rest.
Otherwise I'll be using 5w30 Pennzoil Ultra, Castrol Edge, or M1 EP. I live in relatively mild climate of Northern CA, so I don't experience too many cold startup issues though.
Just my 2 cents
Otherwise I'll be using 5w30 Pennzoil Ultra, Castrol Edge, or M1 EP. I live in relatively mild climate of Northern CA, so I don't experience too many cold startup issues though.
Just my 2 cents
Unigaru: Not to open a can of worms, but eighty bazillion EP3 owners also realized that M1's HTO-06 5w30 offered a world of upside HT/HS "insurance" at no additional expense.
- Status
Similar threads
- Sticky
- Locked
