CR Reveals Significant Drop in Toyota Reliability

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Consumer Reports' 2007 "Annual Car Reliability Survey" is out, and Toyota has declined slightly from its established position as unimpeachable quality king, while Ford's domestic brands have improved.

The independent product review think tank, based in Yonkers, N.Y., says the V6 version of Camry, the top-selling mid-sized car in America, and the four-wheel-drive V8 version of the Tundra pickup--both of which were redesigned this year--now rate below average in Consumer Reports' predicted reliability rating. The all-wheel-drive version of the Lexus GS sedan also received a below-average rating, and therefore no longer makes CR's "Recommended" list.

The four-cylinder and hybrid versions of the Camry and rear-drive version of the GS scored above-average in reliability, and will continue to be recommended.

While the consultancy says that Toyota, Lexus and Scion are still third overall in reliability among all automakers, behind only Honda and Subaru, the firm says it will no longer recommend any new or redesigned Toyota-built models without reliability data on a specific design. Until now, says CR, new and redesigned Toyota models were recommended, even if CR didn't have reliability data, because of the automaker's excellent track record.

"If Toyota returns to its previous record of outstanding overall reliability, CR may resume this practice. Typically, CR will only recommend a vehicle if the magazine has at least one year of reliability data for that specific model," says the not-for-profit company.

The survey is also giving kudos to Ford Motor--saying that Ford reliability is the best it has been in years, with 41 of 44 Ford, Lincoln and Mercury models scoring average or better in predicted reliability in the survey. Standouts are Ford Fusion and Mercury Milan sedans, and two-wheel-drive Ford F-150 V6; Ford Edge and Lincoln MKX, as well as the freshened Ford Expedition and Lincoln Navigator, were all average or above.

David Cole, chairman of the University of Michigan's Ann Arbor, Mich.-based Center for Automotive Research, says the results may conceal what he says is a near parity among automakers. "Fifteen years ago there were real measurable differences, but there is not a whole lot of difference in quality between products today."

He points out that the fact of the shrinking difference among competing brands' vehicle quality has led some consultancies to try different approaches. "This is why J.D. Power created its APEAL study," he says. The APEAL product (which stands for automotive performance, execution and layout) measures, generally, what automakers have done right.

"They created APEAL because differentiation between things gone wrong has fallen off the radar. If you are buying a car, and if you have roughly comparable quality and reliability," he says, "the differentiation that determines vehicle choice is between discrete features or lifestyle requirements."

He also argues that the narrowing differences are making CR less relevant to consumers. "They have a lot of influence, but not as much as they did. The danger is that if they put so much continuing emphasis on older factors they will lose sight of what is more important to consumers now: the 'wow' factor."

That said, Cole concedes that the issue may be critical to Toyota, because so much of its brand equity rests on consumer perception of quality. "On a proportional basis, they would be more concerned than other companies because they have had so much historic emphasis on quality. When you have hung your hat on quality as a primary attribute, Consumer Reports' suggesting things are changing--that is a problem."




From: http://publications.mediapost.com/index....p;art_aid=69329

Quote:


Oct. 16 (Bloomberg) -- Toyota Motor Corp.'s vehicle quality declined while Ford Motor Co., passed by the Japanese automaker this year as second in U.S. sales, showed improvement, Consumer Reports said in its annual reliability survey.

Toyota's redesigned V-6 Camry sedan, four-wheel-drive V-8 Tundra pickup truck and all-wheel-drive Lexus GS sedan were rated below average and were dropped from the ``recommended'' list, the Yonkers, New York-based magazine said in a statement today. Toyota fell to third from first among automakers.

Ford was the best among U.S.-based companies, with 41 of 44 Ford, Lincoln and Mercury brand vehicles rated average or better. The results reinforce Ford's efforts to boost quality after glitches with new-vehicle introductions early in this decade. The automaker hasn't increased its U.S. market share since 1995 and posted a record $12.6 billion loss last year.

At Ford, ``the reliability of their cars has steadily improved over the years, and is showing consistency,'' David Champion, senior director of the magazine's auto test center, said in the statement.

Toyota is ``growing in terms of the number of vehicles they have coming out,'' he said in an interview. ``It may be size.''

The Consumer Reports results cover 1998 through 2007 models and are based on reader surveys done earlier this year. The magazine takes the surveys along with vehicle tests to decide which models to recommend. Consumer Reports' statisticians and engineers use the data to predict reliability of 2008 vehicles.

Toyota in this year's survey was behind Honda Motor Co. and Fuji Heavy Industries Ltd.'s Subaru. Consumer Reports didn't give additional details, such as Ford's ranking.

Toyota Response

Jim Lentz, executive vice president of Toyota's U.S. sales unit, said he will study Consumer Reports' data. Toyota's own information doesn't show deterioration, he said.

``We look at warranty data, and the warranty numbers have actually been falling quite rapidly in the last three or four years,'' he said in an interview. ``Everything we're seeing indicates that quality is in fact getting better.''

Toyota said in a statement that it accounted for 44 percent of the 39 vehicles on the magazine's ``most reliable'' list.

The magazine said it's recommending the four-cylinder and gasoline-electric hybrid versions of Toyota City, Japan-based Toyota's Camry and the rear-drive version of its Lexus GS.

Consumer Reports said it previously recommended redesigned Toyota models even without enough reliability data ``because of the automaker's excellent track record.'' The revamped vehicles now won't be considered until it accumulates sufficient data.

The magazine said 93 percent of Ford models from its Ford, Lincoln and Mercury U.S. brands scored average or better for reliability. That compares to 49 percent for General Motors Corp. and 67 percent for Chrysler LLC.

Customer Feedback

Employees at Ford factories are reviewing feedback from consumers ``to make sure every customer issue is fixed at the plant,'' Mike Hardie, a global quality manager at the Dearborn, Michigan-based company, said in an interview.

Ford has reduced the number of warranty repairs by 50 percent during the past three years, Hardie said. He declined to provide specific figures.

The Ford models rated below average were the V-8 versions of the Explorer and Mountaineer sport-utility vehicles and the Lincoln Mark LT pickup truck.

Consumer Reports presented its findings at an Automotive Press Association meeting in Detroit today.




From: http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601101&sid=azTjZff7A9gA
 
With all the objectivity CR spouts, it really surprised me to read about how up till now, Toyota models got an automatic "gimme" and a high ranking.
 
CR is funny. They always had a hard-on for Toyota, yet perenially found something wrong with Hyundai and Kia, even when that company's products surpassed Toyota in quality and reliability a few years ago.
 
Vehicle reliability

Models with improved reliability

BMW 7 Series

BMW X3

Cadillac STS (V6)

Chrysler 300 (V8)

Dodge Charger

Ford Explorer (V6)

Ford F-150

Ford Mustang

Jaguar S-Type

Jeep Commander

Kia Sportage

Mazda RX-8

Porsche 911

Saab 9-3

VW Jetta (5-cylinder)

Volvo S40 (non-turbo)

Models with declining reliability
BMW 6 Series

Chevrolet Suburban

Chevrolet Tahoe

Chrysler 300 (V6)

Dodge Ram 1500

GMC Yukon

GMC Yukon XL

Hyundai Entourage

Kia Amanti

Kia Sedona

Lexus GS (V6, AWD)

Pontiac G6

Toyota Camry (V6)

Toyota Tundra (V8, 4WD)

VW Passat (V6)

Highlights of the study

• 19 domestic models were added to Consumer Reports' "Newly Recommended" list, including the GMC Acadia and Saturn Outlook, in their first years.

• Of the domestic models Consumer Reports tested, 93% of Ford, 49% of General Motors and 67% of Chrysler models had average or better predicted reliability.

• 34 of the 39 models in the "Most Reliable" list are Asian: 17 from Toyota; 7 from Honda; 3 each from Hyundai and Nissan; 2 from Subaru, and 1 each from Mitsubishi and Mazda.

• The Pontiac Solstice received the worst new-car prediction score in the 2007 survey.

• Among the 36 makes, Land Rover is the least reliable, on average.

Consumer Reports' list of most reliable vehicles

(NOTES: Models marked with * use data based on one model year only; Models marked with 2007 have been redesigned for 2008)


SMALL CARS
• Toyota Yaris*
• Honda Fit*
• Toyota Corolla
• Honda Civic
• Scion xA(2007)
• Mazda3
• Suburu Impreza (2007)
• Hyundai elantra*


FAMILY CARS
• Toyota Prius
• Honda Accord (2007)
• Hyundai Sonata (4 cyl)
• Toyota Camry Hybrid*
• Ford Fusion
• Mercury Milan


UPSCALE/LUXURY
• Lexus G5450h (Hybrid)*
• Acura TSX
• Infiniti M
• Lexus IS (RWD)
• Volvo S60 (FWD)


SMALL SUVs
• Honda Element
• Mitsubishi Outlander
• Toyota RAV4 (4 Cyl)
• Hyundai Tuscon (FWD)
• Subaru Forester
• Honda CR-V*
• Nissan Xterra


MIDSIZE SUVs
Toyota Highlander (2007)
Honda Pilot
Toyota 4Runner
Infinita FX35
Lexus RX


LARGE SUVs
• Toyota Land Cruiser (2007)*


WAGONS/MINIVANS
• Pontiac Vibe
• Scion xB(2007)
• Toyota Matrix
• Toyota Sienna


PICKUP TRUCKS
• Toyota Tundra (V8, 2WD)*
• Toyota Tacoma (4cyl)
• Ford F-150 (V6, 2WD)
 
FWIW:

GM:

Quote:


Buick Enclave/ no data new model
Buick LaCrosse/ above average
Buick Lucerne/ above average

Cadillac CTS/ new
Cadillac DTS/ average
Cadillac Escalade/ well below average
Cadillac SRX/ below average
Cadillac STS/ average
Cadillac XLR / n/a

Chevrolet Avalanche/ below average
Chevrolet Aveo/ below average
Chevrolet Cobalt/ average
Chevrolet Colorado/ below average
Chevrolet Corvette / well below average
Chevrolet Equinox / below average
Chevrolet HHR / average
Chevrolet Impala / average
Chevrolet Mailibu / new
Chevrolet Silverado 1500 / average
Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD / above average
Chevrolet Suburban / below average
Chevrolet Tahoe / well below average
Chevrolet TrailBlazer / average
Chevrolet Uplander / well below average

GMC Acadia / average
GMC Canyon / below average
GMC Envoy / average
GMC Sierra 1500 / average
GMC Sierra 2500HD / above average
GMC Yukon / well below average
GMC Yukon XL / below average

Hummer / well below average
Hummer H3 / well below average

Pontiac G5 / new
Pontiac G6 / well below average
Pontiac G8 / new
Pontiac Grand Prix / average
Pontiac Solstice / well below average
Pontiac Torrent / average
Pontiac Vibe / well above

Saturn Astra / new
Saturn Aura / above average
Saturn Outlook / average
Saturn Sky / well below average
Saturn Vue / new




Ford:

Quote:


Ford Edge / above average
Ford Escape / average
Ford Expedition / above average
Ford Explorer / average
Ford Explorer Sport Trac / above average
Ford F-150 average
Ford F-250 / not available
Ford Flex / new
Ford Focus / new
Ford Fusion / above average
Ford Mustang / average
Ford Ranger / average
Ford Taurus / average
Ford Taurus X / average


Lincoln MKS / new
Lincoln MKX / above average
Lincoln MKZ / above average
Lincoln Mark LT / well below average
Lincoln Navigator / above average
Lincoln Town Car / above average

Mercury Grand Marquis / above average
Mercury Mariner / average
Mercury Milan / Well above average
Mercury Mountaineer / average
Mercury Sable / average




DC:
Quote:


Chrysler 300 / average
Chrysler Aspen / above average
Chrysler Crossfire / well above average
Chrysler PT Cruiser / average
Chrysler Pacifica / below average
Chrysler Sebring/ not available
Chrysler Town & Country / new

Dodge Avenger / new
Dodge Caliber / above average
Dodge Challenger / new
Dodge Charger / above average
Dodge Dakota / well below average
Dodge Durango / average
Dodge Grand Caravan / new
Dodge Magnum / well below average
Dodge Nitro / well below average
Dodge Ram 1500 / below average
Dodge Ram 2500 / average
Dodge Viper / not available

Jeep Commander / average
Jeep Compass / above average
Jeep Grand Cherokee / well below average
Jeep Liberty / new
Jeep Patriot / not available
Jeep Wrangler / well below average


 
Expected. I never had good reliability with the Toyota I had nor did my brother. The most reliable vehicles I have owned are Ford. For my broter it's been Ford and Chevy.
 
My dad told me he owned a 1979 Toyota Corolla and something caused the catalytic converter to glow cherry red, when the car only had a few months on it. He had it taken to the nearest Toyota dealer, and they promptly fixed his car without any arguing.

I remember the argument at Clearwater Toyota when the 2002 Solara leaked oil, and needed warranty repair. What a pain.

Toyota has gotten to the point where it thinks it doesn't have to earn loyalty, IMO. They are going to get bitten in the butt someday.
 
I think it's obvious that CR was correct when they extolled the virtues of Toyota vehicles, but they are now sadly mistaken.
See your local authorized Toyota retailer. I'm sure they can help potential buyers to understand why CR was right when they said Toyotas were flawless, and why CR must now be wrong.
 
I have been saying this for about 10 years now. They still make a better product then most of the industry but they are not what they once were that is for sure!!!
 
The Japanese-made Toyota and Lexus models are the ones that are still worth buying. The American made and American parts-sourced models are the ones that are having issues.
 
Quote:


The Japanese-made Toyota and Lexus models are the ones that are still worth buying. The American made and American parts-sourced models are the ones that are having issues.




So they are building Japanese vehicles from american parts?

Are you sure?
 
Quote:


Quote:


The Japanese-made Toyota and Lexus models are the ones that are still worth buying. The American made and American parts-sourced models are the ones that are having issues.




So they are building Japanese vehicles from american parts?

Are you sure?




Hey, I already posted that!
mad.gif
JK
cheers2.gif
 
Quote:


Quote:


Quote:


The Japanese-made Toyota and Lexus models are the ones that are still worth buying. The American made and American parts-sourced models are the ones that are having issues.




So they are building Japanese vehicles from american parts?

Are you sure?




Hey, I already posted that!
mad.gif
JK
cheers2.gif





Yeah, I know. Sorry about that but he apparently missed it and definitely needed to see it.
 
Quote:


My dad told me he owned a 1979 Toyota Corolla and something caused the catalytic converter to glow cherry red, when the car only had a few months on it. He had it taken to the nearest Toyota dealer, and they promptly fixed his car without any arguing.

I remember the argument at Clearwater Toyota when the 2002 Solara leaked oil, and needed warranty repair. What a pain.

Toyota has gotten to the point where it thinks it doesn't have to earn loyalty, IMO. They are going to get bitten in the butt someday.




I agree, but it's not just Toyota. I remember reading a story about someone's 70's Honda Accord having a rust issue and they came out with a redesigned fender. Nowadays almost every Honda will rust, if it's in an area with salt, prematurely in the quarter panel right beneath the rubber weather strip. Think they'd do anything about it today? Nope
laugh.gif
Here's a link to the story: http://thisoldhonda.org/articles_detail.php?ID=63
 
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