As usual you avoid the question. You are incapable of a logical argument, probably incapable of most things if the truth was known.
any solid proof mmo works in motors?
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Originally Posted By: sprintman
I just go with what Terry Dyson told me about MMO, hence it won't be going in any engine we own.
Please Elaborate! What did Terry Dyson tell you about MMO?
Seems there is a Parallel to the SeaFoam thing. I believe SeaFoam IS effective, IF USED RIGHT and NOT FOR TOO LONG in an Engine! (Fuel = harmless; PCV = Im meek, no thanks for me, YouTube videos are cool but not on mine, not anymore.) And what i mean is:
There are like "80%" people that LOVE it, have had Positive Experiences...
and the other Less than 20% Say "It is the Son of the Spawn of [censored], etc etc etc"... Now this about MMO? PLEASE tell us what he said!
Im willing to bet that he said since its not "Oil" dont put it in the crankcase.. a noble enough point,. but i think that simplifies things a LOT, since we are talking about Cleaning engines that likely have been abused to the point where it needs extra cleaned, even if for peace of mind, but maybe SOME is needed for 1) Owner Satisfaction and 2) ENGINE Satisfaction so it runs for millions of miles...........
I just go with what Terry Dyson told me about MMO, hence it won't be going in any engine we own.
Please Elaborate! What did Terry Dyson tell you about MMO?
Seems there is a Parallel to the SeaFoam thing. I believe SeaFoam IS effective, IF USED RIGHT and NOT FOR TOO LONG in an Engine! (Fuel = harmless; PCV = Im meek, no thanks for me, YouTube videos are cool but not on mine, not anymore.) And what i mean is:
There are like "80%" people that LOVE it, have had Positive Experiences...
and the other Less than 20% Say "It is the Son of the Spawn of [censored], etc etc etc"... Now this about MMO? PLEASE tell us what he said!
Im willing to bet that he said since its not "Oil" dont put it in the crankcase.. a noble enough point,. but i think that simplifies things a LOT, since we are talking about Cleaning engines that likely have been abused to the point where it needs extra cleaned, even if for peace of mind, but maybe SOME is needed for 1) Owner Satisfaction and 2) ENGINE Satisfaction so it runs for millions of miles...........
Originally Posted By: sprintman
I just go with what Terry Dyson told me about MMO, hence it won't be going in any engine we own.
sprintman, why don't you tell us about the oil additive you put into your engine that wiped out your Turbo, I am glad that I am no longer using that oil additive in my engine since all it did was clog up my oil filters like it did to your Turbo.
I just go with what Terry Dyson told me about MMO, hence it won't be going in any engine we own.
sprintman, why don't you tell us about the oil additive you put into your engine that wiped out your Turbo, I am glad that I am no longer using that oil additive in my engine since all it did was clog up my oil filters like it did to your Turbo.
Originally Posted By: sprintman
I just go with what Terry Dyson told me about MMO, hence it won't be going in any engine we own.
MMO has a MIL number and is used by the US military. Must be really dangerous stuff if our soldiers use it.
We're still waiting for that proof about Auto-RX being used by the military...
I just go with what Terry Dyson told me about MMO, hence it won't be going in any engine we own.
MMO has a MIL number and is used by the US military. Must be really dangerous stuff if our soldiers use it.
We're still waiting for that proof about Auto-RX being used by the military...
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Originally Posted By: sprintman
..You are incapable of a logical argument
Logical argument - You stated that Terry Dyson says he wouldn't use MMO.
More logical argument - Terry Dyson manufactures, markets and sales a product that competes head to head with MMO. If you buy MMO to clean your crankcase, then you ain't buying Terry's brew to clean your crankcase.
..You are incapable of a logical argument
Logical argument - You stated that Terry Dyson says he wouldn't use MMO.
More logical argument - Terry Dyson manufactures, markets and sales a product that competes head to head with MMO. If you buy MMO to clean your crankcase, then you ain't buying Terry's brew to clean your crankcase.
Sprintman must be sleeping with Terry... LOL. Get your [censored] straight before you comment on anything.
One more time guys, this site is NOT about personal attacks upon those with whom we disagree. State your case, back it up (if you can, preferably with, ahem, facts...), and move on.
Originally Posted By: JCCADILLACMOBILE
There are like "80%" people that LOVE it, have had Positive Experiences...
and the other Less than 20% Say "It is the Son of the Spawn of [censored], etc etc etc"
Once again, your numbers are backwards. It's clearly more like 10% love it and 90% hate it, especially on this forum which is all that matters. Your simply making stuff up now and arriving at numbers that suit you in order to justify your usage and support of Seafoam.
If you want to go around to various other automotive related forums and make those claims based on feedback from those types that like to make their exhaust smoke, then I'm sure you can arrive with your skewed numbers; however, if you take the opinions of people that actually have a clue as to what they are talking about, such as the people found here on BITOG, then the numbers are clearly in my favor.
Seriously, prove it to yourself already. Do what I requested earlier. Perform an advanced search for threads here with Seafoam found in the subject line and read them. There are easily 5-6 people that wouldn't touch the product for every 1 person that would. It's painfully obvious to anyone that doesn't have a vested interest in using and pushing the product.
There are like "80%" people that LOVE it, have had Positive Experiences...
and the other Less than 20% Say "It is the Son of the Spawn of [censored], etc etc etc"
Once again, your numbers are backwards. It's clearly more like 10% love it and 90% hate it, especially on this forum which is all that matters. Your simply making stuff up now and arriving at numbers that suit you in order to justify your usage and support of Seafoam.
If you want to go around to various other automotive related forums and make those claims based on feedback from those types that like to make their exhaust smoke, then I'm sure you can arrive with your skewed numbers; however, if you take the opinions of people that actually have a clue as to what they are talking about, such as the people found here on BITOG, then the numbers are clearly in my favor.
Seriously, prove it to yourself already. Do what I requested earlier. Perform an advanced search for threads here with Seafoam found in the subject line and read them. There are easily 5-6 people that wouldn't touch the product for every 1 person that would. It's painfully obvious to anyone that doesn't have a vested interest in using and pushing the product.
Originally Posted By: ericthepig
Logical argument - You stated that Terry Dyson says he wouldn't use MMO.
More logical argument - Terry Dyson manufactures, markets and sales a product that competes head to head with MMO. If you buy MMO to clean your crankcase, then you ain't buying Terry's brew to clean your crankcase.
Terry doesn't own, produce nor is on the payroll for any oil additive manufacturer. Terry is purely a professional oil analyzer. He only cares about his customer's results and chemistries, not brand names.
Terry has openly recommended Lube Control and AutoRX. Odd that he would be on the payroll for two competing products or produce one while recommending another. Terry doesn't recommend those products for everyone, either, so don't pretend he forces those upon anyone who asks him.
I don't know why you have a personal bias against Terry but the guy is as professional as it gets and can tell you more about oil, additives and associated chemical properties than just about anyone else in the country with regards to what it does inside an engine.
Logical argument - You stated that Terry Dyson says he wouldn't use MMO.
More logical argument - Terry Dyson manufactures, markets and sales a product that competes head to head with MMO. If you buy MMO to clean your crankcase, then you ain't buying Terry's brew to clean your crankcase.
Terry doesn't own, produce nor is on the payroll for any oil additive manufacturer. Terry is purely a professional oil analyzer. He only cares about his customer's results and chemistries, not brand names.
Terry has openly recommended Lube Control and AutoRX. Odd that he would be on the payroll for two competing products or produce one while recommending another. Terry doesn't recommend those products for everyone, either, so don't pretend he forces those upon anyone who asks him.
I don't know why you have a personal bias against Terry but the guy is as professional as it gets and can tell you more about oil, additives and associated chemical properties than just about anyone else in the country with regards to what it does inside an engine.
Jimmy, you state that most of the people that make negative comments about MMO have never tried it. I don't know how you can even verify this. There's no question that MMO works for a lot of people, but there are many as well who have stated on this forum that it did nothing for them. I am part of that latter group who tried it in my two vehicles with no results (both in the fuel and oil). My brother also tried it and has switched to Seafoam. If it works for you, great!, keep using it. But don't turn around and deny that there are those of us out there for whom MMO hasn't done a thing but make our wallets smaller.
Originally Posted By: sprintman
As usual you avoid the question. You are incapable of a logical argument, probably incapable of most things if the truth was known.
Avoid the question? I corrected myself, I said I wasn't sure what the #1 engine cleaner flush was. Maybe it's Gunk, I'll bet it sure isn't A-Rx, in fact A-Rx is nowhere near the top. Sorry my bad, I should have checked, but honestly don't care. I use what works, a lot of trial, error, and wasted money got me knowing what works and what doesn't.
Try to keep your attacks against me on hold, I never attacked you. A smart business man once told me, attacking people who use certain products that you don't use won't sell your product.
As usual you avoid the question. You are incapable of a logical argument, probably incapable of most things if the truth was known.
Avoid the question? I corrected myself, I said I wasn't sure what the #1 engine cleaner flush was. Maybe it's Gunk, I'll bet it sure isn't A-Rx, in fact A-Rx is nowhere near the top. Sorry my bad, I should have checked, but honestly don't care. I use what works, a lot of trial, error, and wasted money got me knowing what works and what doesn't.
Try to keep your attacks against me on hold, I never attacked you. A smart business man once told me, attacking people who use certain products that you don't use won't sell your product.
I still have two bottles of Auto-RX so I will eventually use them (or give them to somebody) but after everything that happened here in the near past I am not the Auto-RX supporter that I used to be. On the other hand, if we somehow had proof positive that Auto-RX works great in engines I would certainly use it. I think questions have come up on how effective Auto-RX is in aluminum engines.
Right now I am using Pennzoil Ultra in my can engine and Ultra is supposed to keep an engine very clean. I will see how the Pennzoil Ultra works out. I might give that Valvoline engine flush a try-I would assume that something that Valvoline makes will meet requirements.
There are people here that I respect (like demarpaint for example) who are using MMO and say that they are getting good results. All of my experience with demparpaint leads me to believe that he is an honest person.
But personally I still do not like the idea of solvents in engine oil. If just using an oil that is supposed to clean (like Pennzoil Ultra) will get the job done I would rather go that way. I am going to wait and see how this discussion on MMO goes.
If MMO meets a MIL specification than maybe it is good stuff. I don't think the military would use something that does not work. But which MIL spec did it meet?
Right now I am using Pennzoil Ultra in my can engine and Ultra is supposed to keep an engine very clean. I will see how the Pennzoil Ultra works out. I might give that Valvoline engine flush a try-I would assume that something that Valvoline makes will meet requirements.
There are people here that I respect (like demarpaint for example) who are using MMO and say that they are getting good results. All of my experience with demparpaint leads me to believe that he is an honest person.
But personally I still do not like the idea of solvents in engine oil. If just using an oil that is supposed to clean (like Pennzoil Ultra) will get the job done I would rather go that way. I am going to wait and see how this discussion on MMO goes.
If MMO meets a MIL specification than maybe it is good stuff. I don't think the military would use something that does not work. But which MIL spec did it meet?
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Mystic thanks for the kind words. This is unfortunately the internet, many people think they are experts, if not they are trying to sell product, or there are guys like myself that like to share and learn. I'm not selling product, and I'm far from an authority. I have been around the block a few times, and know when product works, because I've tried it. Then we have real hard working people without an agenda that are posting favorably about it. You can also see who is posting that hasn't tried the product and is clueless. I try and ignore them.
Jax_RX8 did a pretty good breakdown of MMO and explained what exactly each chemical did in it. I respect him, and can see from his writing skills he is an educated man. I am certain he was not planted by Turtle Wax here to push MMO. Search for him in the additive section and see what he has to say.
Then we have a few UOA's that showed MMO did well in engines too, although TBN was questioned. If you are a short OCI guy like me, or someone trying to clean an engine then you shouldn't worry.
People who want to try it that "fear" it will thin their oil, I have a few suggestions. Add a qt or two of a "thicker" oil, EG: engine calls for 5W30,use 2 qts 5W30, with some 5W40 or 10W40 and a qt of MMO. Or wait until winter, and reap the benefits of easier starting and a cleaner engine, You could also add a pint for the last 1000 miles of your OCI. The last suggestion will do some cleaning, but that was not how the product was intended to be used.
One last suggestion for people who are really in doubt, or afraid, DON'T USE IT!
One last thought, if your engine is clean, and in perfect running order, don't fret if you don't notice an improvement. OTOH if you live in a very cold climate you will notice easier winter starts no matter what condition your engine is in, at least that has always been my experience.
Good luck!
Jax_RX8 did a pretty good breakdown of MMO and explained what exactly each chemical did in it. I respect him, and can see from his writing skills he is an educated man. I am certain he was not planted by Turtle Wax here to push MMO. Search for him in the additive section and see what he has to say.
Then we have a few UOA's that showed MMO did well in engines too, although TBN was questioned. If you are a short OCI guy like me, or someone trying to clean an engine then you shouldn't worry.
People who want to try it that "fear" it will thin their oil, I have a few suggestions. Add a qt or two of a "thicker" oil, EG: engine calls for 5W30,use 2 qts 5W30, with some 5W40 or 10W40 and a qt of MMO. Or wait until winter, and reap the benefits of easier starting and a cleaner engine, You could also add a pint for the last 1000 miles of your OCI. The last suggestion will do some cleaning, but that was not how the product was intended to be used.
One last suggestion for people who are really in doubt, or afraid, DON'T USE IT!
One last thought, if your engine is clean, and in perfect running order, don't fret if you don't notice an improvement. OTOH if you live in a very cold climate you will notice easier winter starts no matter what condition your engine is in, at least that has always been my experience.
Good luck!
I am not in the "Run with every oil change" crowd, but it does work well as an engine cleaner when in the oil.
Here are some pics of the oil filter off my 93 chevy p/u
Had a quart of MMo in the oil for the last 500 miles.
I think it would be safe to say it did some cleaning!
Here are some pics of the oil filter off my 93 chevy p/u
Had a quart of MMo in the oil for the last 500 miles.
I think it would be safe to say it did some cleaning!
Thanks demarpaint. One thing I would like to see here is for people to be able to discuss stuff without having to be afraid that they will suffer personal attacks. I hate to bring up the Synlube people who were here, but they seemed to love the personal attack technique on anybody who disagreed with them. I have said this before but I will say it again-attack the message (if you do not believe what the message is about), not the messenger!
I became pretty discouraged about using Auto-RX when stuff came out here about at least one individual who was apparently getting product under the table, or so he said. But I am not anti-Auto-RX. If we had some sort of conclusive proof that Auto-RX worked I would certainly continue using it. But all of the stuff that has happened has had a negative effect on me.
I am not anti-MMO either. I will not start using MMO as fast as I started using Auto-RX, but if after all of these MMO discussions we have pretty good proof that MMO works then I will use it. What is not to like? MMO is readily available at low cost locally (Wal-Mart).
I do agree with a lot that was in that Powerpoint Presentation on Oil that jeepman talked about. I agree that most oil supplements are probably worthless but not necessarily all. MMO might be an exception and there may be other exceptions. I agree that a person needs to use the correct viscosity of oil for their vehicle and the correct quality of oil. Actually in that presentation one additive did receive approval. It was admitted there may be a need for a ZDDP additive for some older vehicles-ot else a person could use a oil like Rotella.
There was even discussion in that presentation about sludge-prone Toyota engines in various Toyota cars, vans, and SUVs. For someone who owns one of those vehicles there needs to be something to clean the engine.
I became pretty discouraged about using Auto-RX when stuff came out here about at least one individual who was apparently getting product under the table, or so he said. But I am not anti-Auto-RX. If we had some sort of conclusive proof that Auto-RX worked I would certainly continue using it. But all of the stuff that has happened has had a negative effect on me.
I am not anti-MMO either. I will not start using MMO as fast as I started using Auto-RX, but if after all of these MMO discussions we have pretty good proof that MMO works then I will use it. What is not to like? MMO is readily available at low cost locally (Wal-Mart).
I do agree with a lot that was in that Powerpoint Presentation on Oil that jeepman talked about. I agree that most oil supplements are probably worthless but not necessarily all. MMO might be an exception and there may be other exceptions. I agree that a person needs to use the correct viscosity of oil for their vehicle and the correct quality of oil. Actually in that presentation one additive did receive approval. It was admitted there may be a need for a ZDDP additive for some older vehicles-ot else a person could use a oil like Rotella.
There was even discussion in that presentation about sludge-prone Toyota engines in various Toyota cars, vans, and SUVs. For someone who owns one of those vehicles there needs to be something to clean the engine.
That was after 500 miles, had you done a short 3000 mile OCI that filter would have collected a lot more junk. Thanks for posting.
Originally Posted By: Mystic
Thanks demarpaint. One thing I would like to see here is for people to be able to discuss stuff without having to be afraid that they will suffer personal attacks. I hate to bring up the Synlube people who were here, but they seemed to love the personal attack technique on anybody who disagreed with them. I have said this before but I will say it again-attack the message (if you do not believe what the message is about), not the messenger!
I became pretty discouraged about using Auto-RX when stuff came out here about at least one individual who was apparently getting product under the table, or so he said. But I am not anti-Auto-RX. If we had some sort of conclusive proof that Auto-RX worked I would certainly continue using it. But all of the stuff that has happened has had a negative effect on me.
I have to be honest I'm not afraid of the personal attacks, in fact I find them entertaining. The people attacking aren't too swift and it shows. I do from time to time stop myself from giving the responses I'd really like to give, but after all we do have rules to follow.
Thanks demarpaint. One thing I would like to see here is for people to be able to discuss stuff without having to be afraid that they will suffer personal attacks. I hate to bring up the Synlube people who were here, but they seemed to love the personal attack technique on anybody who disagreed with them. I have said this before but I will say it again-attack the message (if you do not believe what the message is about), not the messenger!
I became pretty discouraged about using Auto-RX when stuff came out here about at least one individual who was apparently getting product under the table, or so he said. But I am not anti-Auto-RX. If we had some sort of conclusive proof that Auto-RX worked I would certainly continue using it. But all of the stuff that has happened has had a negative effect on me.
I have to be honest I'm not afraid of the personal attacks, in fact I find them entertaining. The people attacking aren't too swift and it shows. I do from time to time stop myself from giving the responses I'd really like to give, but after all we do have rules to follow.
cronk, definately some cleaning going on. I don't believe I've seen MMO filter pics before, thank you.
I do have a filter in my garage that had 7,000 miles w/ MMO in the sump(Supertech). My brother is terrible about changing oil! I should cut it open. Anything I can use around the house to do it?
I do have a filter in my garage that had 7,000 miles w/ MMO in the sump(Supertech). My brother is terrible about changing oil! I should cut it open. Anything I can use around the house to do it?
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