Why is the V-4 so underutilized in motorcycles?

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Ride a Bandit 1250 and you'll also be blown away by the low-end power... and it's an I4. The torquey V4 thing is an urban legend promoted by many who should know better. FWIW, I fell in love with the Sabre and Interceptor 750s when they came out, and would love to get an Aprilia 1100...

I have a friend with one and would say they are similar, but never got to ride the two back to back.

Im super familiar with the gs1100 "family" in general and would say that I consider my 82 gs1100 my favorite all time best all round bike and during its heyday its speed was on par with the starship enterprise.

I ascribe HP and torque curves to bore stroke and tuning more so than layout.

The V65 was mid to back of this pack in that group with several punched out built gs1100's, 2-zx11's a Vmax, and and BMW 1100 twin. On this ride the group pretty much agreed that the v65 pulled hardest off the bottom half of the tach.

the shaft drive left everyone cautious about exploring the bikes limits as clearance would alter based on throttle on off.
 
A few remaining items before signing off from this chronic waster of time thread:
- Jeremy Burgess, former tuner to Mick Doohan and Valentino Rossi (and Wayne Gardner too IIRC) once noted that most tracks have one long stretch where top speed matters, but all tracks have numerous corners, which is where races are generally won and lost (study Fabio Quartararo's top speed and win stats for proof), and the generally superior handling of I4 bikes makes them formidable race bikes
- points are not awarded for trap speeds but for race wins and finishing positions, so the ability to finish the race line ahead of your foes is what wins championships; in this regard I4 bikes have proven more than capable of winning (despite being outnumbered).

On a final note, I really enjoy this site for the technical exchanges and sharing of factual information. I must admit to being at once amused and concerned when I see some raise their appreciation of a particular engine configuration to obviously fanatical proportions.

stay safe everyone!
 
V4 expensive like a v8 but with packaging and harmonic improvements.

It’s unfortunate they don’t use v4’s in the automotive world , could have 5 liter 4 cylinders if they did, engines are much less rattly and fit in the engine bay in either direction.

Car companies hate having 2 heads and 2 head gaskets and all the complexity of a v8 on a 4 banger though
 
back 2 (in-line or transverse mount) are hotter ?
Water cooled ... so if the cooling system is done right there isn't much difference to worry about. Air cooled Harley V-twins run quite a bit hotter on the rear cylinder compared to the front cylinder.
 
I consider myself incredibly privileged to be able to have experienced the big inline and V4's on a variety of machines.

We had lots of insanely fast bikes Patrick racing punched out a and modded a v max that never did run quite run like wed hoped, but Nigel Patrick and " Dave" from Hollywood motorcycles built monster NA Suzuki 1100's
- these leaned on Gs'1100 ran with the big ninjas and busas and in some areas pulled harder and amazed and delighted everyone that swung a leg over them.

We never leaned on a honda 4 partly because we didnt have " a guy for these". These all stayed stock as a rock.

My big bike street experienced peaked at my aftermarket turbo ZX11 by " Mr Turbo" Terry Kizer.
It was a mind expanding religious experience and among a handful of things I ever experienced that are " too" much.
Riders with lifetimes of fast bike experience were reduced to gelatin blobs shaking and stammering " oh my god" repeatedly.
It was as though the throttle were connected to the expanding power of the universe itself and the closest thing to limitless I can describe.
 
Tannus 4 is predicessor to my Essix6 (SAAB is 1 that carred it)
"...V4 expensive like a v8 but with packaging and harmonic improvements.
It’s unfortunate they don’t use v4’s in the automotive world , could have 5 liter 4 cylinders if they did, engines are much less rattly and fit in the engine bay in either direction.
Car companies hate having 2 heads and 2 head gaskets and all the complexity of a v8 on a 4 banger though
..."
Love to have one of those to play with (in car or bike).
 
Proof, which some seemingly struggle with, that the engine is but one part of the COMPLETE package. Most rational people will acknowledge that all engine configuration have their pros and cons. Judging by the results on race circuits around the world, it's a toss-up.
Yeah, a motorcycle (or any other race machine) can only go through a corner as fast as the complete design package will allow it to.
 
And former Yamaha engineer and MotoGP team manager Masao Furusawa preferred the inline-4 and Yamaha went on to win multiple MotoGP titles as a result. This success continues to this day, with the 2020 and 2021 MotoGP titles going to I4 bikes. Suzuki, upon coming to MotoGP, initially went the V4 route, finally pulling the plug due to a lack of success. They returned years later with an I4 and proceeded to win their first MotoGP title since 2000 (in 2020)... Also, every WSBK title since 2015 has been won by an I4-powered bike... carry on...
true. & Suzuki's GSXR.
And Suzuki's Hayabusa.
Nobody has ever complained about inline four being 'too wide' to ride.
Seems the only question is Yamaha's droning flat-plane crankshaft.
 
Ride a Bandit 1250 and you'll also be blown away by the low-end power... and it's an I4. The torque V4 thing is an urban legend promoted by many who should know better.
I rode Griff's Bandit (MaxiumSuzuki.com) it was OK power but I wasn't blown away... it didn't have the bottom end plod or the mid range push or the top end rush of my race bred V4 and the B12's handling felt like a wheel barrow full of bowling balls compared to my HRC flick machine however Griff was really blown away with the torque and handling of my RC45...

Quote Griff
Went on a rather lengthy tour today with Rick (Coin', and a
couple of guys Rick knows. We headed up through Foresthill, and all the
way up through Mosquito Ridge Rd to the French Meadow Res' area. This is
a fantastic ride, with some great hardcore twisties.

One of the guys, Larry, has a beautiful RC45, a rarity to say
the least! A truly amazing bike, and unbelievably fast. Larry took off
ahead of us, and just RIPPED through the twisties. He was way gone most
of the time. Rick and I were riding at a pretty decent pace too, and we
had no chance of catching the little monster.

One the way back down, we came back into the Foresthill area,
which has some long sweepers, and Larry took off again. Not being in
such tight quarters anymore, I blazed off after him. The B12 was better
suited for this kind of pavement (somewhere I could better utilize the
power), and I was able to maintain my distance reasonably well. I was
pushing it pretty hard, but I know the RC45 could have easily left me if
Larry pushed it some more.

Rick and I both got an opportunity to take it for a spin! The V4
in the bike is SWEET (its NOT of the same line of V4's that Honda uses
in its VFR's), it **** smooth everywhere, and has more fn power than
most would know what to do with. One thing that surprised me was the
amount of mid-range torque it had. The fuel injection is flawless, and
didn't present any surprises or quirks, just a **** smooth response.

One of the funny things about the bike is the WAY tall 1st
gear, takes a little bit to get used to. Red-lining it in 1st gear puts
you WELL into illegal speeds territory.

The handling is incredible. A total flick-machine, and on
rails all the time. Its very lightweight, and the bike itself is TINY. I
felt like a circus clown riding a kids bike.
Theres no way to use the bikes total potential on the street.
But ****! Its fun as hell trying to!

Hopefully there will be a next time

--------------
Griff
Administrator, Maximum-Suzuki.com
W.W.B.O.C. #137

Rick's response to Griff

I forgot to tell you Griff, I wicked it up a bit and ran down the ol'
RC45 on the way back to Foresthill, stuck there behind him for a long
time just checking out the way he rides that V-four. As I perched my
B12 back there to view the exotica in action, I noticed he was
late-apexing all the corners, rarely using the brakes, and letting the
V-four torque drive out of the turns nicely without needing any
super-high revs.

It was a joy to watch a nice smooth rider on an EXTREMELY rare
bike. how many bikes do you know with a VIN like "00000002?"

The best thing is, his RC45 is WAYYY better than a stock RC45.
he built his own custom billet rearsets with ribs to help keep your
boots on the solid-mount pegs, magnesium wheels sporting ultra-sticky
Metzeler Rennsport street tires, oversized brake rotors, modified
triple-clamp offset (pays to own your own machine shop eh?),
quarter-turn throttle, he fabricated the exhaust system too, etc etc.

So what we have here is a very rare bike that is NOT a garage
queen, he rides and mods it properly, like any self-respecting bike
owner. I think it has over 35,000 miles on the clock.

When I rode the RC45 we were still in the twisties, holy ****e
that bike drops onto its side quite fast thanks to the magnesium
wheels.Shaving 7-10 lbs of unsprung weight pays huge dividends in
handling.That bike rails around corners, no other way to put it.

Fantastic day of riding! We even had a first-generation GSXR750

along, so the RC45 was the only bike in our group with a radiator.

MosquitoRidgeRoad1.JPG
 
A few remaining items before signing off from this chronic waster of time thread:
- Jeremy Burgess, former tuner to Mick Doohan and Valentino Rossi (and Wayne Gardner too IIRC) once noted that most tracks have one long stretch where top speed matters, but all tracks have numerous corners, which is where races are generally won and lost (study Fabio Quartararo's top speed and win stats for proof), and the generally superior handling of I4 bikes makes them formidable race bikes
- points are not awarded for trap speeds but for race wins and finishing positions, so the ability to finish the race line ahead of your foes is what wins championships; in this regard I4 bikes have proven more than capable of winning (despite being outnumbered).

On a final note, I really enjoy this site for the technical exchanges and sharing of factual information. I must admit to being at once amused and concerned when I see some raise their appreciation of a particular engine configuration to obviously fanatical proportions.

stay safe everyone!
look who is talking about being fanatical. the irony. most people here share their love of v4 motorcycle engines. i get it you d'ont like them. i also get it that your dad is stronger than mine.
 
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BTW, quoting an ill-informed article lends no credibility or proof to your musings...
Yamaha labor in the shadow of HRC ... their cammy hit I4 proved no credible way to win a championship... it was only after Yamaha retired the old I4 work horse and designed the brilliant "Virtual V4" that they became competitive...

2001 Yamaha I4 wins 3 Honda V5 wins 12

2002 Yamaha I4 wins 2 Honda V5 wins 14

2003 Yamaha I4 wins 1 Honda V5 wins 13

2004 Yamaha "Virtual V4" wins 9 Honda V5 wins 6

Quote MASAMO FURUSAWA:

I was in charge of Yamaha MotoGp starting 2003 and it was a terrible year, almost like I was in
hell and I wanted to make the YZR M1 a better bike but more and more I
investigate the bike I needed something else more than the bike. So I
found Valentino Rossi pretty close to me but the first time I did not
believe Valentino would come to Yamaha because Yamaha was a terrible
bike and Honda was a fantastic bike.
 
- Jeremy Burgess, former tuner to Mick Doohan and Valentino Rossi (and Wayne Gardner too IIRC) once noted that most tracks have one long stretch where top speed matters,
My friend Jeremy joined Yamaha in 2004 and employed his Honda HRC knowledge to fix Yamaha's "Virtual V4" handling problems...

Quote Jeremy Burgess on Frame Flex:

"We identified fairly early what the problems were. The Yamaha was
developed by two very good 250 riders. No slur on them, but what you
want for a big bike, a 500 or a four stroke, is something different.
All bikes operate within a circle, and the circle wasn't anywhere near
where I felt it should be... To ride one of these things, you need to
have enough feel to get the bike to slide; you must be able to feel
your way into a slide and then back out again safely. The chassis
set-up was radically changed - the bike being made longer and higher,
the forks extended by nearly 25mm and the swingarm stretched by the
same amount. These modifications were made to a chassis that had even
more radical front engine mounts than the prototypes seen at the end
of 2003 at Valencia. Front forks don't work so well when leaned over,
and to try to maintain grip the new chassis allowed the whole head
stock to flex a little when the bike was deep into a corner and leaned
right over."


Quote Jeremy Burgess on Brake Pitch:

"Valentino could never understand why he could outbrake the Yamaha
when he was on the Honda, both bikes have the same basic braking
system, and the same tyres. But then we realised the Yamaha was too
low, it couldn't pitch its weight forward on braking like the Honda
could.' Honda were using the tendency of a bike to pitch forward under
braking to load up the front tyre more, squashing it onto the track
and increasing the size of the contact patch. This allowed the rider
to further increase the braking forces, further increasing the contact
patch."
LarryJermeyBurgess001.JPG
 
2020 yamaha vmax. all black. last year of production.

1,679cc, DOHC, liquid-cooled, 65° V-4; 16-valve, 200 crankshaft hp. 123 foot pounds of torque. 170 rwhp as measured by cycle world dyno. there was nothing like it.

2020-yamaha-vmax-buyers-guide-1.webp
 
not that much a fan of the look, but ducati worked hard to make a durable v4 engine. 15 000km oil change intervals and valve check at 60 000km. 170hp 1158cc v4 engine. 2022 ducati multistrada v4 s sport.
2022-Ducati-Multistrada-V4S-Sport2.webp
 
2022 aprilia rsv4 factory. aprilia top specs sport bike. 217 crankshaft hp. a 2019 model recorded 190 rwhp on the cycle world dyno.
2022-Aprilia-RSV4-Factory1.webp
 
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