why different oil for U.S. and Europe?

[jocktheglide]

Im curious as to why in the U.S. vs Europe why they spec different oils for the same car??? Do europeans stress their car greater than U.S. folks? For example based on what someone told:

you can have a toyota prius in the U.S. and it speced at 5w-20 I believe, but in europe they spec it at 5w-40???

I noticed reading on the net this is the same for all cars it can be the same car, but each continent use different grade oil? Reading over at the bimmer forums in euriope they use a 10w-60 grade I believe, but here in U.S. they use a 5w-30?

 

[simple_gifts]

US cars have the CAFE standard to meet.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_Average_Fuel_Economy

 

[tig1]

It's all about CAFE. Same thing with my Ford Duratech engines. Other parts of the world use heavier oil than 5-20.

 

[prax]

If it was all about CAFE, then Toyota and Honda wouldn't bother using 20 weights.

 

[tig1]

Originally Posted By: prax
If it was all about CAFE, then Toyota and Honda wouldn't bother using 20 weights.


It's my understanding that only the US has CAFE. Since T and H sell cars in the US seems logical they to would use a lighter oil to gain 2-4 tents MPG on their fleet.That's why in EU they use heavier oil in the Prius.

 

[jocktheglide]

WOW so its true its all POLITICAL then it seems...so final questions:

what provides better protection the european standard higher weight or the U.S. (CAFE)???


I dont care about my MPG since i bought my fj cruiser and supercharged it and get only 14.5 highway and 13.5 on city driving I have a minivan that gives me MPG and for fun comes the FJ cruiser.
Originally Posted By: simple_gifts
US cars have the CAFE standard to meet.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_Average_Fuel_Economy

 

[prax]

Originally Posted By: tig1
Originally Posted By: prax
If it was all about CAFE, then Toyota and Honda wouldn't bother using 20 weights.


It's my understanding that only the US has CAFE. Since T and H sell cars in the US seems logical they to would use a lighter oil to gain 2-4 tents MPG on their fleet.


And what would they gain from that? Toyota/honda have the highest CAFE ratings. They pass it by at least 1.5 mpg. The CAFE credits don't translate into cash.

 

[jocktheglide]

except the FJ cruiser lol....ok I take that back only my FJ I get only 14.5 on highway and 13.5 in city with preimium gas.....

 

[tig1]

Originally Posted By: prax
Originally Posted By: tig1
Originally Posted By: prax
If it was all about CAFE, then Toyota and Honda wouldn't bother using 20 weights.


It's my understanding that only the US has CAFE. Since T and H sell cars in the US seems logical they to would use a lighter oil to gain 2-4 tents MPG on their fleet.


And what would they gain from that? Toyota/honda have the highest CAFE ratings. They pass it by at least 1.5 mpg. The CAFE credits don't translate into cash.


They don't have the large vechicle fleet that us companies have which drags down the US average. T&H cars don't get any better MPG than Ford cars with the same parameters. That's why they use 5-20. CAFE.

 

[bepperb]

There is no way Honda wouldn't meet the CAFE standard on 5w-30. They have no CAFE related reason to use 5w-20. None. They get nothing for beating the standard. So, at least for Honda, CAFE is not the reason for the lighter weight oil.

Could it be for EPA window sticker ratings? Maybe.
Could it be for magazine reviews that publish mileage to the decimal? Maybe.
Could their cars go 300,000 miles on either, so why not use the oil that give the greatest efficiency? Probably.

Toyota, maybe. Probably not with the way the Tundra (or any large trucks) are selling. If you want to use the heaviest oil you can find, great. And perhaps for some the reasons are CAFE. But not with all manufacturers.

The Prius gets 5w-20 or 0w-20 in the US and Japan. To me, the reasons for alternate requirements elsewhere probably have more to do with availability of x-20 oils. They still get the x-20 factory fill there. Europeans also have a reputation for longer OCI's, I'm not sure how that plays in but it could.

JockTheGlide, you can certainly use a 30 or 40 weight in the FJ, and I probably would as well.

 

[jocktheglide]

oh boy I guess in the end its all confusion about oil it seems????

 

[prax]

Originally Posted By: tig1
They don't have the large vechicle fleet that us companies have which drags down the US average. T&H cars don't get any better MPG than Ford cars with the same parameters. That's why they use 5-20. CAFE.


In the past, Honda had nothing to gain in going to 20 weight. Can't trade your extra mpg for money and it only lasted 3 years.

CAFE is a good reason now with higher standards and credit trading, but the standards are so much higher that a lower viscosity is of little benefit. You acknowledged it yourself when you said you can only get an extra .2-.4 mpg.

 

[bepperb]

Originally Posted By: jocktheglide
oh boy I guess in the end its all confusion about oil it seems????


No, it's nitpicking. And it's contagious.

 

[Nederlander75]

CAFE credits can be sold to other companies not making the grade, not necessarily car companies as well. This has been the case since the mid or early 90s.

 

[prax]

Originally Posted By: Nederlander75
CAFE credits can be sold to other companies not making the grade, not necessarily car companies as well. This has been the case since the mid or early 90s.


Source? Everything I've read indicates that you can't sell your credits. This link for example.

http://www.edmunds.com/advice/fueleconomy/articles/124469/article.html

 

[Nederlander75]

Read numerous balance sheets. Unused credits are held as assets. I first learned abuot it my econ classes.

 

[prax]

Maybe you're talking about fuel economy standards for another country? CAFE is particular to the US and you couldn't trade CAFE credits in the 90s.

Here's a paper that proposes that the law be changed to allow credit trading. This was back in 2001. The law has been changed so trading is now allowed.

http://www.stanford.edu/~jsweeney/paper/trading.pdf

 

[Eddie]

In part because EU oil is so expensive and because the recomended OCI is 10-15,000 miles instead of 5,000-7,500 miles.

 

[fdcg27]

Sir, I think you've nailed it.
Along with that, there aren't too many places in our country where you can really max out a car for any length of time.
The only places in the US where I have driven really fast for very long were West Texas after Midland and Odessa, South Dakota and Montana. In Ohio, the state cops will nail you using a Cessna working with cars on the ground and traffic is usually too heavy to go fast for very long anyway.
HTHS matters when you can leave your foot down for twenty or more minutes without fear of unwelcome attention from the guardians of public order.
I have often wondered how a US spec Accord running a 20W would do used hard in Europe?

 

[Mitch Alsup]

One reason is that people in Europe have access to public roads that allow them to drive as fast as the car will go (traffic permitting) with Ferraris, Lamborghinis, Porsches going 180+, BMW and Mercs going 155. We have no such counterparts here excepting race tracks.