Who's Looking Forward to the Release of the 2022 Subaru WRX?

OppositeLocK said:
Exactly, and I think few if any engines are overbuilt today. They're all designed to perform reliability within spec. Just the nature of the game.

It makes more sense to build to a price point that will give as many people as possible the chance to buy it, than overbuild it so tuners can extract more performance out of it.

Gone are the 2JZ days.
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Modern engines are making way more power from the factory. A 3.0L Ecoboost makes 400 hp in an SUV. A 2L WRX motor makes as much HP as a 3.0L 2JZ. Fords 2.3L is making like 350 hp in the Mustang with

I also would not say the modern engines are not overbuilt. It depends on the brand. Ford seems to build some stout motors. 5.0's can push 1000 hp without opening the motor and the 3.0 and 3.5L Ecoboosts are able to get into the 600-700 whp range on the stock bottom end. In fact, a few people have hit 600 rwhp on 3.5L Ecoboosts with stock turbos.

They might not last long, but(despite the internet) I don't think a 2JZ can really do much more than that reliably. sure they are "overbuilt" in the sense that they can double/triple their hp but I think their are modern engines that are equally as stout.
 
OppositeLocK said:
Exactly, and I think few if any engines are overbuilt today. They're all designed to perform reliability within spec. Just the nature of the game.

It makes more sense to build to a price point that will give as many people as possible the chance to buy it, than overbuild it so tuners can extract more performance out of it.

Gone are the 2JZ days.
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Exactly.

Computer design and finite element analysis make it unnecessary to overbuild anything anymore, if it’s not needed. Saves on materials cost. A safe margin is built in, while still allowing for good profit.

If you want upgrades internals, the good news is that the current WRX has some of the best aftermarket support.
 
john_pifer said:
When you make silly statements like this, you’ve lost any credibility you may have had in the discussion.
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Why is that silly? It's true.

You wanna brag about how their AWD is symetrical but it comes at a cost. Arguing that the weight distribution doesnt matter, its the whole package is silly. A car design from the ground up to be a sports car, not a repurposed econobox, doesnt have a 60/40 split.

they have to design around that. Sorry if it offends you.
 
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skrypj said:
Why is that silly? It's true.

You wanna brag about how their AWD is symetrical but it comes at a cost. Arguing that the weight distribution doesnt matter, its the whole package is silly. A car design from the ground up to be a sports car, not a repurposed econobox, doesnt have a 60/40 split.

they have to design around that. Sorry if it offends you.
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It's impossible for one to be offended by someone else's ignorance.

Giving a truck a 50:50 weight distribution doesn't make it a sports car. A lighter 60/40 vehicle will almost always handle better than a heavier 50/50 vehicle.

Your mentality is the same as people who think big brake kits = better braking. When all it usually does is throw the balance off with more unsprung weight, not to mention additional total weight (increasing stopping distance), and at best just gives you more thermal capacity (which depending on your conditions, can also be achieved with appropriate pads and rotors).

In that same way a 60/40 car is not automatically worse.

Stop before you embarrass yourself.
 
1990s was the best for overbuilt stuff:

The engine in my new to me 12 valve dodge, 160 hp out of 5.9 liters of cast iron, gear driven timing cause chains and belts are for little girls. The Ford 7.3L was also absurdly strong. Now every ounce counts, friction, fraction of an MPG. The FA20 short block is like 110 lbs or so, and making good power. Subaru casting these for so many vehicles has got to have the cost down low.
 

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skrypj said:
Why is that silly? It's true.

You wanna brag about how their AWD is symetrical but it comes at a cost. Arguing that the weight distribution doesnt matter, its the whole package is silly. A car design from the ground up to be a sports car, not a repurposed econobox, doesnt have a 60/40 split.

they have to design around that. Sorry if it offends you.
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You seem to like to spout a lot of hyperbole.

I think no one is arguing that this is not a hopped-up econobox. It is exactly that.

But I think they’ve done a great job turning an Impreza into a legit sports sedan, especially with this current generation of WRX, which they’ve dramatically increased chassis rigidity on.

My 2016 WRX was solid, solid, solid.

Yeah, weight distribution is important, everyone knows that. But having 60/40 weight distribution doesn’t mean the WRX’s handling is automatically crap. That’s an on-paper spec that doesn’t tell the full story. One thing that really helps is that the symmetrical boxer powertrain has an inherent low CG.

No, it’s not a purpose-built sports sedan like an M3, that has much closer to 50/50 weight distribution. But, then, a car like the M3‘s design priorities are more focused on performance and being on the bleeding edge of technology. An M3 makes some sacrifices (reliability, cost) in order to be on that bleeding edge of performance and tech. In other words, you’re gonna pay up, big time, to have, arguably, the absolute top of the line sports sedan in the world.

The WRX pulls almost 1G on the skid pad (despite that ”terrible” 60/40 WD) and, when I had mine, I never got too close to its limits when I was out in the mountains. To do so wasn’t safe. But, if you were following behind me, I think I’m safe in saying that you’d probably be fairly entertained :)

Heck, at Deal’s Gap (“Tail of the Dragon”, to non-locals), I routinely embarrassed M3 drivers in my humble, horrible-weight-distribution, econobox, POS 2016 WRX!

Ill repeat what I already said in the first post of this thread: The WRX, IMHO, is the best sports sedan value on the market today.

And this new 2022 model has the potential to be even MORE sports car for the money!
 
john_pifer said:
having 60/40 weight distribution doesn’t mean the WRX’s handling is automatically crap. That’s an on-paper spec that doesn’t tell the full story. One thing that really helps is that the symmetrical boxer powertrain has an inherent low CG.
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So what you're saying is a vehicle isn't just a rectangular box with four circles under it??

Are you sure?

Because that's how I always drew it in grade school.
 
Never once have I driven my WRX thinking it's a Mclaren. But there's something endearing about an economy vehicle turned $30K sports sedan with a long history.

It's the perfect vehicle for someone who is a driving enthusiast, but has to drive year-round, in snow, and who doesn't want to spend lots of money to get performance that can never be fully used on the street.

For the record an M3 gets 0.98g on the skidpad, the WRX gets 0.92g. And you know what that means? Absolutely nothing without context.

Luckily I understand that driving a WRX at 8, 9, or 10/10 is more rewarding than driving an M3 at 5/10 because 8/10 would put you in jail, and at 10/10 there's a good chance you're going to crash it. One gets to have as much or more fun and bank the difference between the two (especially if they don't value the luxury or tech features) while having easier ownership (maintenance, depreciation, insurance...).

Do I have status with the WRX? No, but thankfully I don't value and/or buy vehicles on their ability to impress others. I'd also enjoy and appreciate the new 2.0 NA Corolla with a manual tranny.

As the other poster who drives an Alltrack because it was the best package for him, the WRX is the best package for others.

And make no mistake, that's what vehicles are: packages, and should be assessed as such. An F150 is not criticized for not being able to haul as much as an F450, the same way vehicles like the Civic Type R, Golf R, S4, etc. are not inferior to an F150 in driving ability because they aren't 50/50.
 
would be cool if they brought back a smaller H6 and turboed it for the american market but no way they would offer something better than their home market even though they would avoid displacement tax
 
OppositeLocK said:
Never once have I driven my WRX thinking it's a Mclaren. But there's something endearing about an economy vehicle turned $30K sports sedan with a long history.

It's the perfect vehicle for someone who is a driving enthusiast, but has to drive year-round, in snow, and who doesn't want to spend lots of money to get performance that can never be fully used on the street.

For the record an M3 gets 0.98g on the skidpad, the WRX gets 0.92g. And you know what that means? Absolutely nothing without context.

Luckily I understand that driving a WRX at 8, 9, or 10/10 is more rewarding than driving an M3 at 5/10 because 8/10 would put you in jail, and at 10/10 there's a good chance you're going to crash it. One gets to have as much or more fun and bank the difference between the two (especially if they don't value the luxury or tech features) while having easier ownership (maintenance, depreciation, insurance...).

Do I have status with the WRX? No, but thankfully I don't value and/or buy vehicles on their ability to impress others. I'd also enjoy and appreciate the new 2.0 NA Corolla with a manual tranny.

As the other poster who drives an Alltrack because it was the best package for him, the WRX is the best package for others.

And make no mistake, that's what vehicles are: packages, and should be assessed as such. An F150 is not criticized for not being able to haul as much as an F450, the same way vehicles like the Civic Type R, Golf R, S4, etc. are not inferior to an F150 in driving ability because they aren't 50/50.
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Does that mean that anyone who has bought a more expensive vehicle than you would, did so solely for the perceived status?

If so, I submit that maybe others also simply buy what they like, without caring what others think.
 
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02SE said:
Does that mean that anyone who has bought a more expensive vehicle than you would, did so solely for the perceived status?

If so, I submit that maybe others also simply buy what they like, without caring what others think.
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You're reading way too much into that.

But if you want to go there, yes, I would say that someone buying an entry level "luxury" German vehicle is doing so for status and not because the vehicle is anything special or good value for the money. They would be better served with a similar Toyota or Hyundai product.

I also think buying a purebred track animal like a GT4, Viper ACR, ZR1, M2 CS to drive casually on the street is a major waste of money but to each their own like you said. But there's plenty of people who compare higher end cars based on their "road presence", so yes, they're buying based on status and not performance or the drive.

After a certain price point, there's almost nothing gained ON THE STREET. That's why something like an ND2 Miata is held in higher regard than a Mustang GT for example. You can throw the whole buy what you like argument, but there is an objective way to compare things.
 
A Mustang GT and a Miata are two completely different vehicles with completely different missions as designed and don't work as a direct comparison.
 
tbm5690 said:
A Mustang GT and a Miata are two completely different vehicles with completely different missions as designed and don't work as a direct comparison.
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I disagree, both are affordable sports cars and if you are searching for a secondary "fun" vehicle you'll definitely be cross-shopping them. Even Corvettes are cross-shopped with Miatas. You might go with one for raw power, and the other for a more purist driving experience. They're absolutely comparable.
 
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