Valvoline Restore & Protect

[Ayrton]

If it does work, I hope it sells well enough to keep it around.

I can't imagine having it help a bunch of cars with consumption, and then it being taken off the market! It would be too cruel! haha

 

[facility1]

looks like Valvoline maybe on to something ,instead of negative views, it very well maybe what is claimed by Valvoline as they are a reputable company, and of course time will tell, and see what positive results happen.

 

[wsar10]

looks like Valvoline maybe on to something ,instead of negative views, it very well maybe what is claimed by Valvoline as they are a reputable company, and of course time will tell, and see what positive results happen.

I agree, although I too try to trust but verify.

By nature many people are always skeptical when a different use scenario or technology is brought forth. We as humans at the very fundamental level have to see proof before we jump on board, when our hard earned dollars are at stake, and rightfully so.

But to your point, they are a seasoned reputable company that has a reputation and frankly a bottom line to protect. By bottom line I mean something different than what you may be thinking, I mean they cannot afford mass law suits for falsifying claims or data. In this day and age you simply cannot come out and say "this oil WILL do X" and it be the furthest thing from the truth, well I guess if you have billions of dollars to pay out in law suits you could... But again, generally not advantageous for a business. Mistakes can happen in business, but companies of this nature spend billions making sure that does not happen.

 

[buster]

I highly doubt Lake Speed getting a tour of the Valvoline R&D facility and talking with the chief R&D officer about the development and testing of this oil is all baseless smoke and mirrors. "Science instead of speculation" ... so based on the LS video, it sounds like the science was proven in the R&D facility with testing by Valvoline. So time will tell as people get some use of the product and the feedback starts coming in. And I'm sure there will be some people who do one 1000 mile OCI and expect it to do magic, when it's clearly stated that it will take around 4 normal OCIs to get full results.

It's amazing what people will believe based on "trust us" vs a lead engineer in a lab showing them the process is dismissed as marketing. Unreal. This is the world we're living in. Might as well get my medical advice from the Facebook comment section.

 

[Patman]

So I have an important question. What are BITOG members going to abbreviate this oil to for their sig lines? I’m thinking V-R&P

 

[Foxtrot08]

Lake Speed Jr, a 'Certified Lubrication Specialist with over 20 years experience' visited a Valvoline lab and posted this on YT two hours ago. Yeah, I know... YT... but I'm not sure of his credentials.

I have the same credentials. And I actually work (and own a company) in the lubricants distribution world. Actually, one of the top 10 largest.

A company you all heard of, just flew me to Europe, put me up in a top hotel, wined and dined, etc. For their global meeting.

But I’m just a “trust me bro” on here.

 

[cheesepuffs2]

I have the same credentials. And I actually work (and own a company) in the lubricants distribution world. Actually, one of the top 10 largest.

A company you all heard of, just flew me to Europe, put me up in a top hotel, wined and dined, etc. For their global meeting.

But I’m just a “trust me bro” on here.

People here claim to be discerning, yet fall for clickbait monetized YouTube content.

 

[4WD]

So I have an important question. What are BITOG members going to abbreviate this oil to for their sig lines? I’m thinking V-R&P

Not changing

 

[PWMDMD]

I agree, although I too try to trust but verify.

By nature many people are always skeptical when a different use scenario or technology is brought forth. We as humans at the very fundamental level have to see proof before we jump on board, when our hard earned dollars are at stake, and rightfully so.

Yes, it seems en vogue to be overly skeptical of everything and simply poo-poo anything and everything these days. I think it makes people feel like they're superior when everyone else seems interested in something or if there seems to be a consensus with something and THEY are the voice of reason. Doctors, scientists, government officials, or anyone you disagree with can be dismissed these days even when zero contradicting evidence exists. It's lazy and the smart people in the room aren't summarily dismissing everyone, they are trying to figure out who is right and who is wrong based on the evidence available. In this case, the verifiable evidence isn't strong, but Valvoline is a reputable company and the YT video claims all seem perfectly plausible. If I was going to lie about a product the last thing I'd do is memorialize my lies for everyone to see. Again it's lazy to simply dismiss the claims made because it's Valvoline or a YT video or because some pretty awesome claims have been made. This gets filed under I have no reason to suspect that their claims are untrue unless other evidence to the contrary becomes available suggesting it isn't true.

 

[bbhero]

Yes, it seems en vogue to be overly skeptical of everything and simply poo-poo anything and everything these days. I think it makes people feel like they're superior when everyone else seems interested in something or if there seems to be a consensus with something and THEY are the voice of reason. Doctors, scientists, government officials, or anyone you disagree with can be dismissed these days even when zero contradicting evidence exists. It's lazy and the smart people in the room aren't summarily dismissing everyone, they are trying to figure out who is right and who is wrong based on the evidence available. In this case, the verifiable evidence isn't strong, but Valvoline is a reputable company and the YT video claims all seem perfectly plausible. If I was going to lie about a product the last thing I'd do is memorialize my lies for everyone to see. Again it's lazy to simply dismiss the claims made because it's Valvoline or a YT video or because some pretty awesome claims have been made. This gets filed under I have no reason to suspect that their claims are untrue unless other evidence to the contrary becomes available suggesting it isn't true.

While I sincerely tend to agree with your overall theme in this post…I think this is a very good and well stated post.

I lean towards the possibility that Valvoline has created a unique oil that possibly can do what they say it can do. Playing the percentage game right now I’d say there’s a 65 percent chance that it may possibly turn out to be rather legitimate.


People have good reason at times to be highly skeptical of their government, doctors, and scientists and big corporations…

The second Gulf war…. Led people to be far more skeptical of their government…

JFK files … still won’t be let out for the public to see… How many decades later ?

I have seen first blanking hand doctors miss very OBVIOUS huge problems with patients… In cases where there was obvious evidence to suggest something was terribly wrong.

And scientists are worthy of skepticism too… And when one research scientist had huge questions about a particular treatment shall we say.. And the fact was he had received a number of government patents that established that certain treatment… He gets banned on certain platforms.. When he had big questions about that treatment when it got magically rush approval.


So… good, bad or indifferent…

Sometimes questions, skepticism and deeper level thinking is actually needed.

Not just blind faith or belief in others.

David Koresh, Jim Jones… A certain chancellor from a country in Europe… Amother leader from a big country with millions killed in isolated camps scattered throughout that very vast nation…

All of these types of people loved people who just believed in them… Without hesitation or asking questions or being skeptical about things.

Interesting to read about how “ science “ and scientists were captured by the government in that country in Europe with that lovely chancellor… That’s extremely interesting to read and learn about.
.

 

[PWMDMD]

While I sincerely tend to agree with your overall theme in this post…I think this is a very good and well stated post.

I lean towards the possibility that Valvoline has created a unique oil that possibly can do what they say it can do. Playing the percentage game right now I’d say there’s a 65 percent chance that it may possibly turn out to be rather legitimate.


People have good reason at times to be highly skeptical of their government, doctors, and scientists and big corporations…

The second Gulf war…. Led people to be far more skeptical of their government…

JFK files … still won’t be let out for the public to see… How many decades later ?

I have seen first blanking hand doctors miss very OBVIOUS huge problems with patients… In cases where there was obvious evidence to suggest something was terribly wrong.

And scientists are worthy of skepticism too… And when one research scientist had huge questions about a particular treatment shall we say.. And the fact was he had received a number of government patents that established that certain treatment… He gets banned on certain platforms.. When he had big questions about that treatment when it got magically rush approval.


So… good, bad or indifferent…

Sometimes questions, skepticism and deeper level thinking is actually needed.

Not just blind faith or belief in others.

David Koresh, Jim Jones… A certain chancellor from a country in Europe… Amother leader from a big country with millions killed in isolated camps scattered throughout that very vast nation…

All of these types of people loved people who just believed in them… Without hesitation or asking questions or being skeptical about things.

Interesting to read about how “ science “ and scientists were captured by the government in that country in Europe with that lovely chancellor… That’s extremely interesting to read and learn about.
.

There's a difference between healthy skepticism and summarily and categorically dismissing all claims made by everyone in an authority position that can not be immediately verified. Has the government lied? Yes! Does the government lie about everything? No. Do doctors make mistakes and miss diagnoses? Yes! Do doctors miss all diagnoses? No. Do scientists get it wrong and/or lie? Yes! Do all scientists do this? No.

Each and every case has to be evaluated independently based on its own merits - who is saying it, what they are saying, and what information is available to corroborate or discredit what they are saying. We don't do this anymore as a society and instead we say because government, doctors, or scientists could be or have lied or they have been wrong, we should automatically discredit everything they say, even if what they say is plausible and there is no evidence to support they are wrong. It's another form of apathy - it's easier to just discredit all claims instead of doing the hard work of actually considered individual ideas and evidence. We've gone well past healthy skepticism to automatic disbelief of even everyday plausible claims.

In this case, could Valvoline be lying? Sure. Is there any evidence or history of Valvoline lying? Not to my knowledge. Does this mean I'm 100% certain they are telling 100% truth? Of course not, and if someone presents credible evidence to suggest otherwise, I'll consider that evidence, but many here have just defaulted to Valvoline must be lying, and that's not a sensible conclusion based on what we know.

 

[malibuguy79]

After watching the video I do feel like its more legit.

And you got to think about the 4 OCIs to work. Like they said they do not want to overload the filters and send them into bypass. This is a mass market product.

The typical consumer buying HPL know what they are buying and know that especially on first initial use they need to change and inspect the filter a few times on short intervals. Then eventually once the motor is cleaned out or the bulk of it is...then the filter can go longer.

Your typical off the shelf consumer that will likely use VRP at best will change their oil when they are suppost to lol and at worst it runs for double or triple interval

 

[Patman]

The only thing I’m curious about is why they say 4 OCIs without giving an actual mileage? Are they assuming everyone is going to do 3000 mile intervals? 5000 miles? They must have a rough estimate of how many miles it would take to clean.

And as a side note, why even bother with 4 OCIs? Why not a couple of longer runs but then change the filter halfway through each. Wouldn’t that achieve the same thing?

 

[cheesepuffs2]

The only thing I’m curious about is why they say 4 OCIs without giving an actual mileage? Are they assuming everyone is going to do 3000 mile intervals? 5000 miles? They must have a rough estimate of how many miles it would take to clean.

And as a side note, why even bother with 4 OCIs? Why not a couple of longer runs but then change the filter halfway through each. Wouldn’t that achieve the same thing?

The mass market DIYer isn't going to do that.

 

[buster]

The only thing I’m curious about is why they say 4 OCIs without giving an actual mileage? Are they assuming everyone is going to do 3000 mile intervals? 5000 miles? They must have a rough estimate of how many miles it would take to clean.

And as a side note, why even bother with 4 OCIs? Why not a couple of longer runs but then change the filter halfway through each. Wouldn’t that achieve the same thing?

Valvoline historically has always been about the OEM drain interval.

Roger England said they have all the engine testing capability, the chemical lab, chemical analytics. Working with the lab in India, it's synthesized and scaled up to production.

I wish people applied the same level of skepticism to other brands. It's interesting how selective people are in their criticism. You can clearly see the bias and selective criticism on display.

The before/after shot of the piston was only 4k miles and it cleaned up quite well for just one OCI IMO.

 

[dumkid]

probably 20,000 miles is the shortest run that you would see good cleaning in

sorry i meant 20,000 miles of running r&p, (2-4 changes) not a 20k oil change interval

 

[cheesepuffs2]

I suspect that some of you have missed the huge marketing push for this oil on special media. This LSJ video is just another social media engagement point for Valvoline and nothing else.

In this video, their sponsored ambassador Rob Dahm (a well known Mazda rotary builder) goes through almost the same exact motions that LSJ was guided through at the engine lab.

At the 2:24 mark he even says, "What's impressive is Valvoline is the only motor oil company that has an engine lab like this, to test and push the quality of oil further than anyone else".

 

[OVERKILL]

Valvoline historically has always been about the OEM drain interval.

Roger England said they have all the engine testing capability, the chemical lab, chemical analytics. Working with the lab in India, it's synthesized and scaled up to production.

I wish people applied the same level of skepticism to other brands. It's interesting how selective people are in their criticism. You can clearly see the bias and selective criticism on display.

The before/after shot of the piston was only 4k miles and it cleaned up quite well for just one OCI IMO.

View attachment 221552

The "chemical" could just be an AN compound though. Remember, nothing precludes a base oil from being an additive at lower levels. POE is often an additive when used for solubility.

I don't doubt the efficacy of the product, given my results with HPL, I'm acutely aware that cleaning can be done when the right components are included. I do have my doubts that they've discovered something novel that has escaped the chemists at XOM, SOPUS, Chevron/Oronite...etc however. Rudnick would have been well aware of the cleaning capabilities of the tri-syn combo for example, and that's back before many of the folks in that lab were born.

I think it's good that a lower priced product capable of cleaning has entered the market though. Lots of Toyota products that could likely benefit. Would love to see the results on the Honda VCM V6, which is another famous for ring coking. Another would be an old Saturn! Though suitable specimens are obviously rare.

 

[buster]

The "chemical" could just be an AN compound though. Remember, nothing precludes a base oil from being an additive at lower levels. POE is often an additive when used for solubility.

I don't doubt the efficacy of the product, given my results with HPL, I'm acutely aware that cleaning can be done when the right components are included. I do have my doubts that they've discovered something novel that has escaped the chemists at XOM, SOPUS, Chevron/Oronite...etc however. Rudnick would have been well aware of the cleaning capabilities of the tri-syn combo for example, and that's back before many of the folks in that lab were born.

I think it's good that a lower priced product capable of cleaning has entered the market though. Lots of Toyota products that could likely benefit. Would love to see the results on the Honda VCM V6, which is another famous for ring coking. Another would be an old Saturn! Though suitable specimens are obviously rare.

I'm pretty sure it's not AN.

Remember, there are hundreds and hundreds of chemists with PhD's that work in this industry. And many bounce around. So it's not as if one entity has all the knowledge and ability. It's just not like that. Rudnick also consults with other brands. He's also not the only guy that is capable of creating and knowing about synthetic oils.

The carbon from HPL could be just from other parts of the engine. Keep in mind for the first Restore it was loaded with 50% ester, far greater than HPL or Amsoil SS to achieve deep cleaning.

In Roger's own words, this technology goes beyond "keeping" things clean and actually takes it back to factory clean levels. I think many are confusing keeping clean with actually deep cleaning.

You'd have to run HPL in a similar test to see if it could remove and clean piston deposits. Until then I'm assuming it's from other typical areas we often seen within an engine.

 

[OVERKILL]

I'm pretty sure it's not AN.

Based on what information?

Remember, there are hundreds and hundreds of chemists with PhD's that work in this industry. And many bounce around. So it's not as if one entity has all the knowledge and ability. It's just not like that.

Sure, but have you found a patent for a novel chemical that would indicate that this compound isn't one that has previously existed or been used?

The carbon from HPL could be just from other parts of the engine. Keep in mind for the first Restore it was loaded with 50% ester, far greater than HPL or Amsoil SS to achieve deep cleaning.

In an engine run on M1 EP 0W-20 its entire life?

Per our previous discussion about the massive cleaning done by AN's on that belt covered in varnish (which was totally unexpected) in an industrial application, my position is that while esters can be used to clean, as Restore demonstrated, AN's are also capable of the same. This is because they have very high solvency. They do NOT however, have high polarity, so you don't have the issue with surface competition that you do with esters (see: Redline).

I'm sure Dave and company at @High Performance Lubricants have torn down hundreds of engines in their race and fleet testing programs. Maybe they have some before/after piston pictures?