Using 0W-20 in a 2025 Corolla?

Pennzoil motor oil
HighHy21 said:
You can use 0w-16 if 0w-8 is not available, but 0w-8 must be used at the next oil change.

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Gee, where have I seen that verbiage before?

1762536810092.webp



So the other oil is acceptable or isn't it acceptable?

Meanwhile, the same engine and vehicle in Australia....

1762537054027.webp
 
"TGMO" is defined by Toyota Motor Corp U.S. (ref TGEO TSB) as the recommended contemporary ILSAC grade.
Was I sleeping when ILSAC folded certain 40 grade formulations into approvals?
 
Hohn said:
It's always amusing to see the confidence people have in asserting things they cannot possibly know to be true. A thicker oil than what is recommend almost certainly will not void your warranty, but it would be childish to say that it's impossible for it to happen. But it's also childish to assert that it 100% will void you warranty. You can't possibly know this, so stop asserting that you do. There's no certainty in either direction.

What we do know is that manufacturers are scraping every last fraction of a mile per gallon out of the engine to try to please the government. And of course, the government has no durability requirement for the engine nor any rules around oil consumption. So, if you are the OEM and have to choose between placating a government that holds the power of life and death over your business and placating a corner case customer whose engine is an oil burning disaster in only 80k miles, guess who wins? It's not even a contest.

SO not only are we getting thinner and thinner oils, but then we get all the bandaids required to make them work acceptably in an engine. Clearances must be tighter than ever, with surface finishes that are smoother and flatter using materials that are often harder. Since you need more oil pump to pump that thin oil, you have to go to a larger oil pump, which would offset the tiny fuel economy advantages if you don't make it a variable displacement pump.

So a modern engine that is more robust to thin oil (note carefully the phrasing here) can often use a thin oil and produce acceptable life for the majority of customers. Obviously this is true or Toyota wouldn't wager their warranty spend on it.

But being robust to thin oils is one thing. Requiring them is quite another. Now I ask how the same engine can have such wildly different viscosity grades recommend in different countries. It seems likely that the engines are all the same and that they don't tailor clearances for different regions. It seems likely too that the thicker oils allowed in the absence of CAFE coercion are closer to the true ideal for the engine in terms of wear performance.

If your emotional needs are such that you must slavishly follow the country-specific recommendations for your manual, then follow those recommendations. But it is indeed an emotional choice, not a logical one. So don't be surprised when those who are less emotional and a bit more clear-eyed point out that thicker oils--within reason- are perfectly safe and may even often protection advantages over the thin oil that is your Warranty Woobie.
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Huh??
 
CleanSump said:
We have better oils in the US and Canada than ROW. So we can use more thinerer oil.
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Yeah certainly, that is probably why Toyota North America insist you use Japanese developed ultra-low viscosity engine oils. 🤣

The contention about Toyota U.S CAFE manuals have already been discussed hundred of times already.
 
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TijY_ said:
The contention about Toyota U.S CAFE manuals have already been discussed hundred of times already.
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It has, but there are many who still don't "get it." The industry didn't freely choose to see just how thin they could make an oil and still have it work. They had no incentive to do so when 30 grades had proven sufficient in protection for many years.

We know that the auto industry doesn't really move on things unless forced to. There are few competitors and a breakthrough by one is slow to be adopted by others.

Mercedes put ABS brakes into production in 1978. They were still novel among US makers in the 1990s. And by the time the US got around to mandating them in 2012, most cars had them already.

So you can absolutely guarantee that Toyota's R&D into water-thin oils was something they never would have freely undertaken unless compelled to do so by what they felt was a requirement they couldn't avoid. History is littered with examples of people who tried to fight the government and lost. (See: caterpillar and on-highway diesel emissions for EPA 2010).

But you can also be certain that all those measures that made the engines more tolerant of super thin oils will serve the engine well with a couple grades thicker especially the additive packages are equally robust.

I wouldn't go pouring a 10w-60 into a new Toyota that specs 0w-8. But going up two grades to a 0w-20 is zero risk, notwithstanding the Warranty Woobie crowd.
 
HighHy21 said:
Toyota USA is the one approving the warranty repair, not Toyota UAE.

And according to TCCN, in order for oil-related warranty approval, an sample of oil needs to be sent for used oil analysis
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When i was working at a Honda dealer we always did a used oil analysis before any engine replacement was even considered.
 
The Critic said:
If they ever ask for service records, you're going to find yourself in an uphill battle.

Just avoid the drama and use the specified oil. For 99.9% of drivers, it will never make a material difference. Save yourself the potential headaches.
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I thought Toyotas never need repairs, so isn’t this moot? lol.

Agree - it’s the job of most to deny warranty repairs, and non-dealer/diy service is like two strikes they’ll use against. Wrong viscosity, as dumb as we realize that is in terms of rationale, just makes it easier.
 
Hohn said:
So, if you are the OEM and have to choose between placating a government that holds the power of life and death over your business and placating a corner case customer whose engine is an oil burning disaster in only 80k miles, guess who wins? It's not even a contest.
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Aside from Huyndais and Kias are there many engines turning into oil burners in 80k miles?
 
Wireman1987 said:
This post is about a Corolla though that page isn’t from a Corolla OM
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Correct. I'll spell out more clearly:

Toyota manuals routinely state in the USA that you "Must use" some thin oil, some slightly thicker oil is acceptable only in emergencies, and then you have to go back to the thinner stuff.

Meanwhile they tell owners in other countries-- using the exact same engine and vehicle-- that they can use almost anything and there's ZERO emphatic warning about having to go back to a thinner grade at the next change.

If someone cannot see that this is just government compliance language in the USA manual and not technical engineering language, no amount of explanation from me will make that clear enough for them to discern.
 
tolian21 said:
Did they ever denny warranty because wrong viscosity oil was used?
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The used oil analysis was likely "the rubbing of the oil between thumb and forefinger" and looking at the colour of drips on their lunch napkin.
j/k

Denny was a great English folk singer - but I did hear she would null your warranty at the drop of a mic
 
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