U.S. to Impose Tariff on Tires From China

[Drew99GT]

Originally Posted By: PT1
Originally Posted By: oilyriser
It would be great if environmental and labour standards were included in the compliance standard.

Yeah...sure....


You think it's funny that yet another one of China's manipulated advantages in global trade is their insistence of no environmental or labor controls? ie., In 99% of cases, they can build the same thing drastically cheaper and sell it less here (currency manipulation), and if they wanted to, probably of equal quality? Most Americans now adays will always opt for the cheapest pos though.

God this country is doomed...

 

[rshaw125]

There is a very important element to this that I do not believe has been mentioned. The Chinese are buying huge amounts of our debt. Debt created by Americans living way beyond their means. Last week the debt ceiling was lifted yet again to borrow more money from China and also Japan. Money to fund ridiculous programs like cash for clunkers and deficits that are now measured in trillions of dollars. The tire import tariff may blow up in Obama's face.

 

[KrisZ]

This thread is just halarious, people get all worked up by the fact that stuff is made in China, forgetting a tiny little bit of info; that is the fact, that most of the product brands are American owned, and are only made in China, so in theory all the profits stay here, right?
At least that's the argument the Not So Big 3 use for buying Domestic.

And it's easy to blame China, but the fact remains that WE AS CONSUMERS are to blame, we just want cheaper and cheaper stuff.

Some mentioned, that other countries have stiff tariffs against foreign made goods, that's true, but at the same time the consumers in these countries realize the premium they have to pay for these goods made in their countries to preserve jobs and market, and are fine with it. Most countries in Europe have a very high cost of living and things like central AC, clothes dryiers, TV set in every room etc. are considered luxury items, but are taken forgranted here. We want to have the cake and eat it too, that's the problem.

 

[Bill in Utah]

Trust me the P4s I bought were not CHEAP. They are NOT $30 a tire.

My points are that as long as we (USA) come up with it being WAY too expensive to make things here (both in EPA this, OSHA that, FED/STATE/Local fees/taxes, and labor) the companies will go overseas.

Making only the rich or big bad businesses pay is a joke. We all pay in jobs.

Adding things like Health care / cap and trade will really make those companies come back here with the jobs.

Coming up with that China tires are unsafe and all they make is junk is not true. Somethings they make MAY be but like most things here, lets be biased and not present facts.

And a Tariff will fix everything. It is on EVERY tire not the "cheap" ones that some here keep hounding on.

Drew you are correct.

This country is doomed...

Bill

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
You think it's funny that yet another one of China's manipulated advantages in global trade is their insistence of no environmental or labor controls?


Actually, the new power stations in China are (generally) more efficient than the 30-50 year old things that run in Oz and the States.

They are voluntarily installing SOx, and NOx reduction, plus being more efficient in the first place.

 

[Gary Allan]

Originally Posted By: PT1
Originally Posted By: oilyriser
It would be great if environmental and labour standards were included in the compliance standard.

Yeah...sure....


Exactly. What makes them at such an advantage to begin with? It's not labor costs (although it all adds up). It's the cost of doing business. They have a long time "advancing" (there's that pesky UL) before they catch up in enlightenment to the folly of some practices. It took us 50 years to complicate our lives. They got way more people to distribute the learning curve over.

Life is still too cheap there.

 

[ffracer]

Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Originally Posted By: ffracer


Show me the links and facts where they do..... to use your logic. Nobody questioned Pirelli - we do question Chinese mfgs. Cheapest isn't the best value, when there isn't a standard to compare for each application. Most chinese windshields will not meet crash damage. Nobody is asking the UAW to make tires.

My recommendation Bill is to go drive a Ford Explorer overloaded in the Utah desert with Chinese tires and report back.

As someone who was in the industry, you don't have any basis. Go ahead eat some Chinese pet food with melamine and see who can you sue when you get sick. See PPG vs. FYG. lawsuits etc. Why repeat it with tires?

You sure like to argue and ask for facts, but rarely provide them, just more opinions.

Take care


Oh so all the Chinese tires are junk? Show me the links for that. My P4s are MADE in China.

The Explorers rolling over were due to Chinese tires?

The Tariff is being put on the Chinese due to being unsafe?

Your "recommendation" is plain STUPID. So a Explorer should be overloaded with American tires will be fine?

So its obivious that you are not biased since you WERE in the industry.

What the #&*^$@# does eating Chinese pet food have to do with anything? Windshields?

I've provided more FACTS to this board than you EVER will. Take your biased position on the Chinese go somewhere else.

Plenty of Chinese made tires that are SAFE and provide excellent performance. My P4s today did excellent in 3-4 inches of standing water and there were many other vehicles that were having issues.

Wonder how many of them had American made tires mfg by bitter overpaid employees?

Yeah the Tariff is sure going to make things better. Just like all the "help" for GM and Chrylser.

Lets see how all the "change" works out.

bill


Biased hardly. I was in glass and still am, just not automotive. There was not ONE Chinese company that could even remotely meet OEM standards for NA, European, or Japan carmakers' windshields. Not one. Including the OEMs for the Chinese market.

Name one tire company in China that is home grown, not an arm of a US, Japanese, Korean, or European company that meets OEM standards. there are none.

I agree a broad tariff is not good for trade, but neither is trade that provides substandard products with limited liability. If Pirelli's Chinese tires are [censored], people sue Pirelli or stop buying them. Pirelli fixes the problem to stay in business. This isn't the case with the local companies. It cost money to design and make good tires and be compliant with standards, they don't spend the money, they just pop up somewhere else with another name.

Plenty of safe Chinese tires? Show me what standards they have passed. ANSI, ASTM, SAE, JIS, DIN? Any??? They are black and roll. that's it.

It took years for Hankook and Kumho to get OEM certified and they know what they are doing.

This isn't about some multinational making something here or there; it is about the wild west in standards and intellectual property.

You don't mess with food or car safety. People get hurt.

 

[eljefino]

Originally Posted By: ffracer

Plenty of safe Chinese tires? Show me what standards they have passed. ANSI, ASTM, SAE, JIS, DIN? Any??? They are black and roll. that's it.


DOT?

 

[Nick R]

Originally Posted By: eljefino
Originally Posted By: ffracer

Plenty of safe Chinese tires? Show me what standards they have passed. ANSI, ASTM, SAE, JIS, DIN? Any??? They are black and roll. that's it.


DOT?


The DOT will probably pass anything that has the general roundish shape of a tire. They would probably pass a giant stone wheel if it was submitted.

 

[rkpatt]

There are some good Chinese tires out there . I presume that there were problems in the beginning with Hankook , Kumho , Maxxis etc .


I read somewhere that the cost of making tires is about 40%-50% labor and 40%-60% materials . The US mfgs could compete with the Chinese if they could come up with a more efficient process that the Chinese won't use .

 

[CivicFan]

Originally Posted By: rkpatt
There are some good Chinese tires out there . I presume that there were problems in the beginning with Hankook , Kumho , Maxxis etc .


I read somewhere that the cost of making tires is about 40%-50% labor and 40%-60% materials . The US mfgs could compete with the Chinese if they could come up with a more efficient process that the Chinese won't use .


The way the US companies compete is through innovation. There is a reason for low prices and some of it is because of low innovation. The products that are made by, say, American companies, and are meant for the internal consumption in China are a few generations behind what they make here. It is done to keep the competitive advantage because you don't want to get ripped off - you make less sophisticated parts there and make the cutting edge stuff in the States.

The funny thing is that the Chinese manufacturers are concerned about getting ripped off, too. When they have innovative products, processes and such, they will guard them as zealously as an American company.

 

[benjamming]

...while at the same time ripping off (read stealing) intellectual property of other companies & not think a thing about it.

 

[JohnBrowning]

Just what we need to do tax the country lending us money and buying our dept! That is just such a smart idea Mr. President! Never mind the fact that none of my friends or family will ever get a job making tires in the USA! So now Chineese companies will have to move directly tot he USA to some states between Nevada and Kentucky and south of Michigan and set up plants in the USA makeing tires! So we can all get jobs working for the Chineese. It is already more people working for Toyota,Nissian,Honda,Mercedes,Hydai and Subaru in America then then working for GM,FOrd or Chrysler. I do not count Canadains and Mexicans as part of the USA so that explains that!

You would think they would learn that taxing stuff just makes them find a a way around it. I know maybe he can tax all the parts that built or assembled outside of the USA for GM,Ford and CHrysler this way they will have an incentive to pay Americans to do it! If he lets them set up shop south of the Mason dixie line and keeps the UAW's greedy hands out of the action we can maybe rebuild this countries industrial might. It is greedy Union's, State and Federal goverments along with idiotic protectionist schemes like import tariff's and subsides to Farmers and [censored] that has created this [censored] pile of an ecconomy we have. When people keep their greedy hands out of the capitalism it almost always works great and rights itself!

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: benjamming
...while at the same time ripping off (read stealing) intellectual property of other companies & not think a thing about it.


I don't get why South Korea gets away with that or worse.

Wanna build a power station there, you have to build it in their foundry, factory, and with their labour...then they copy it and call it their own.

I've seen equipment turn up with two or three patent violations, but nobody seems to give a rat's freckle.

 

[PandaBear]

Some tires are junk regardless of where they make them: Goodyear Integrity, Michelin Energy MXV4, Bridgestone RE92, and Pirelli P6 are some great examples.

My Chinese Wynstar Phaser R23 were great, the plant were bought by Michelin later and converted to make Michelin tires.

 

[Bill in Utah]

Originally Posted By: PandaBear
Some tires are junk regardless of where they make them: Goodyear Integrity, Michelin Energy MXV4, Bridgestone RE92, and Pirelli P6 are some great examples.

My Chinese Wynstar Phaser R23 were great, the plant were bought by Michelin later and converted to make Michelin tires.



And lets go with your other quote;

Quote:
P4 is unsafe regardless of country of origin.


Tell me more.

How many miles have you put on them? How did they do in snow? 3-4 inches of standing water on the freeway?

Going down the freeway in below freezing and well over 100 degree weather.

I've got almost 25k on them so I guess I have some experience. Please tell me yours.

Bill

 

[Gary Allan]

Quote:
When people keep their greedy hands out of the capitalism it almost always works great and rights itself!


Not really. You left out the Federal Reserve. They assure that you're in a constant shake down. You're poorer today and you will be poorer tomorrow. Credit is the killer. First it was your retirement that was put into the market for harvesting. Then, in finality, it was everyone's home equity ..even those who had not already destroyed theirs willfully.

 

[benjamming]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: benjamming
...while at the same time ripping off (read stealing) intellectual property of other companies & not think a thing about it.


I don't get why South Korea gets away with that or worse.

Wanna build a power station there, you have to build it in their foundry, factory, and with their labour...then they copy it and call it their own.

I've seen equipment turn up with two or three patent violations, but nobody seems to give a rat's freckle.


They don't get a pass from me but we were just talking about China right now. However, you are preaching to the choir here on that one.

 

[Steve S]

Originally Posted By: smokey1
part of reason for jobs lost is due to the high costs of health insurance provided by the corporations that cuts into their profit . Did wonders for the GM and other AMERICAN car manufacturers . BAILOUT ! CHINA provides its own health care for its people , so more money in the pockets of the businesses moving to there . IT'S COMPROMISE

OR DEMISE

.

You forgot to add the high price of not being able to dump your wastes into the rivers and government regulations, the high priced CEO and other employees etc.

 

[Greggy_D]

This is one product I'll pay a bit more to have a USA manufactured item.