Whereas GM would just hope 3.3 million people would "go away"
You crack yourself up. That's good, 'cause nobody else thinks you're funny.
You crack yourself up. That's good, 'cause nobody else thinks you're funny.
Toyota - The recall KING?
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JHZR2
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Those were some good responses... As a diesel fan, I have to ask...
First, I own MB diesels, does that mean that somehow unbeknownst to me, I do so because of my ego??? Or are you equating diesels to 'ego' incorrectly?
Second, have you considered cost per mile, not just per gallon cost??? Diesels can significantly beat ga$$ers in economy in MANY conditions, and all of a sudden, a lot of times, that regular gas isnt so cheap in a per mile equation anymore...
Third, obviously your neighbor's engine has an issue. Ive started my 200k+ 20 year old MB diesel without plugging it in or even using excessive amounts of degel additive in below-zero temperatures quite a few times... It wasnt all that happy, but last I checked, neither are my ga$$er engines when I start them in such temperatures... Your neighbor quite well may need some lessons in maintenance. And, IIRC from one of my old dodge ram brocheures that Ill pull out, the CTD was designed for unassisted starts down to -20 or so... something is wrong.
Fourth, a V8 fullsize has pretty great payload capcity as is... Are you using it all? If not, maybe you should get a mini truck, or just rent one when needed... maybe your truck is a fashion statement, eh? Just checking... with a truck that is really used, if you have capacity for x pounds, and you actually use the capacity of the truck as intended, then you would really rather have x+ extra pounds capacity, so that you can do even more... if this isnt the case, you bought too much truck that you certainly didnt need anyway, so it was a silly purchase anyhow.
Regarding the fifth item, good for you, lots of extra points of failure, so that you can create even more American (repair) jobs when they break... thanks!
Sixth??? doubt all you want, but youll be hard pressed to find an engine series on the road that has proven as durable as a cummins diesel... put all the toyota spin you want on it... I wonder what is the highest mileage toyota v8, and how that compares to the highest mileage, or fleet average mileage for b-series CTDs.
Finally, seventh... buying cash is only one part of the equation... dont forget lifecycle cost. Neither your ability to save $26k plus tax, or ability to get a toyota pickup for that much is impressive. Looking at how much the overall package has cost when you hit 250k miles is the more interesting metric (if the truck is still on the road).
We shall see...
JMH
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"First, I don't need a diesel, for my ego or otherwise.
Second, around here, diesel fuel is considerably more expensive. Why would I want to lock myself into THAT?
Third, my neighbor has a massive Ford Excursion - diesel. They have been plugging it in to keep it warm for the last month or so....
Fourth, I don't need greater payload or towing capacity.
Fifth, my Double Cab Tundra is quite roomy, has both heating and air conditioning to the back seat, FIVE power windows (yes, the rear window drops all of the way down, standard), heated mirrors, variable valve timing, a five speed automatic transmission and four wheel drive. All of these things have value to me and actually are used by me.
Sixth, less durable? I seriously doubt that.
Seventh, more expensive? I really doubt that as well. It was affordable enough that I paid cash for it."
From what I've seen a diesel makes sense in a larger vehicle, otherwise you just end up wasting resources.
Diesel and gas prices float around, but in a given vehicle a diesel will usually get better mileage. Mine gets better mileage than the models that I posted, and mine is too heavy to need an EPA listing.
The Cummins diesel is popular in Alaska and Canada, it works fine in cold weather. Dunno about how others fare.
I don't tow anything but do use the payload; if you build it they will use it.
I have a quad cab short bed 4x4 with a 5 sp manual and the Cummins diesel. The air and heating work fine, and the family has found it more comfortable than a BMW wagon.
Some Dodge diesels have made it to 1 million miles with no rebuilds, and 500k is not uncommon. The Cummins ISB is a common medium duty engine, and at least until recently even Ford offered it in models like the F550. If you're gonna bet say $30k that a hard worked vehicle will make it to 500k miles the Cummins ISB a better bet than most.
My truck was less than any of the models that I posted.
I acknowledge that most people do not want anything to do with diesel. Some neighbors replaced their F250 at less than 100k miles as it was shot, and they bought a large block F350 as they didn't want a stinky diesel. He also said that in Colorado sometimes they didn't know if they'd make it to the next gas station, driving up the steep grades and all with their camper. Whatever,
Second, around here, diesel fuel is considerably more expensive. Why would I want to lock myself into THAT?
Third, my neighbor has a massive Ford Excursion - diesel. They have been plugging it in to keep it warm for the last month or so....
Fourth, I don't need greater payload or towing capacity.
Fifth, my Double Cab Tundra is quite roomy, has both heating and air conditioning to the back seat, FIVE power windows (yes, the rear window drops all of the way down, standard), heated mirrors, variable valve timing, a five speed automatic transmission and four wheel drive. All of these things have value to me and actually are used by me.
Sixth, less durable? I seriously doubt that.
Seventh, more expensive? I really doubt that as well. It was affordable enough that I paid cash for it."
From what I've seen a diesel makes sense in a larger vehicle, otherwise you just end up wasting resources.
Diesel and gas prices float around, but in a given vehicle a diesel will usually get better mileage. Mine gets better mileage than the models that I posted, and mine is too heavy to need an EPA listing.
The Cummins diesel is popular in Alaska and Canada, it works fine in cold weather. Dunno about how others fare.
I don't tow anything but do use the payload; if you build it they will use it.
I have a quad cab short bed 4x4 with a 5 sp manual and the Cummins diesel. The air and heating work fine, and the family has found it more comfortable than a BMW wagon.
Some Dodge diesels have made it to 1 million miles with no rebuilds, and 500k is not uncommon. The Cummins ISB is a common medium duty engine, and at least until recently even Ford offered it in models like the F550. If you're gonna bet say $30k that a hard worked vehicle will make it to 500k miles the Cummins ISB a better bet than most.
My truck was less than any of the models that I posted.
I acknowledge that most people do not want anything to do with diesel. Some neighbors replaced their F250 at less than 100k miles as it was shot, and they bought a large block F350 as they didn't want a stinky diesel. He also said that in Colorado sometimes they didn't know if they'd make it to the next gas station, driving up the steep grades and all with their camper. Whatever,
I just like the noise diesels make at idle. Now if I could get one with a jake-brake for those badly-placed stop signs...
Incidentally, diesels are quite popular in Germany and they don't stink. I drove a diesel Ford Focus C-Max and for all purposes and intents it was like driving a regular gasoline car.
Incidentally, diesels are quite popular in Germany and they don't stink. I drove a diesel Ford Focus C-Max and for all purposes and intents it was like driving a regular gasoline car.
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I know Toyota is perfect. They came here to save us from the evil US corporations. The CEO's of Toyota don't even need to ________. They have someone else do that for them.
Wow! 3.3 million cars with sludge and the typical toyota zombie responce, "Nothing to see here... move on. Oh that oil sludge? New cars are suppose have that... It's a Toyota!!!
No, I think the zomboid answer is, "You neglected it, therefore it sludges".
Well, Toyota stock-holders seem to be doing better than your GM/Ford pals are.
Recalling 3.3 million POTENTIAL cars/trucks doesn't mean 3.3 million are sludging.
Recalling 3.3 million POTENTIAL cars/trucks doesn't mean 3.3 million are sludging.
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Scott, if GM cars suck so bad, why are you wasting your time trying to get a deal on a GTO?
In today's paper, the Toyota dealer is advertising on their 2006 models: $4006 off MSRP on Tacomas, 0% or $1000 bucks on Sienna's 0% or $4000 bucks on Tundra's, $4506 off Highlanders, $6006 off 4Runners, $9006 off LandCruisers, and $3000 off Sequuoia's.
The only difference between Toyota and GM, is that Toyota is blander. And yes, I got past the sixth grade ....
If they are so much better than Toyota, WHAT WAS THE DIRECT INVESTMENT OF EACH OF THE "BIG THREE" IN 2005???
What has been the growth of each of them over the past five years (direct employment, production, direct investment)?
What has been the growth of each of them over the past five years (direct employment, production, direct investment)?
IIRC In 2004, according the Automotive Trade Policy Council GM, Ford and DaimlerChrysler's Chrysler Group directly employ 382,000 American workers, and indirectly employ over 4.4 million. On the other hand, Toyota, Honda and Hyundai directly employ 91,000 American workers, and indirectly employ 840,000. Not sure about 2005 but I highly doubt it has changed to far from those numbers.
Hey Scott's got Jokes!!! Good come back, nitwit, I'll have to remember that one.
O'ya Recalling 3.3 million POTENTIAL cars/trucks doesn't mean 3.3 million are sludging, true, but why recall them if there isn't a significant problem with them, but hey why confuse you with facts.
Can't say I agree with the OP on the ego thing, to each their own I guess. But you can't really put a Cummins diesel (or Powerstroke and Duramax) in the same ball park as gas V8. They SHOULD last way longer, especially puting a fantastic medium duty motor like the Cummins in a pickup truck! The rest of that Dodge is a whole other story.
Toyota also has diesels in other parts of the world that will 500k+.
On Tundra Solutions, there is a high mileage thread. Here's a pic of the odo on a 2002 model.
And no, I don't think Toyota is perfect and can do no wrong. They've had their issues, just at a smaller frequency than some other manufacturers.
To others: Yes, I agree, glassy eyed Camry drivers suck.
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Scott, if GM cars suck so bad, why are you wasting your time trying to get a deal on a GTO?
In today's paper, the Toyota dealer is advertising on their 2006 models: $4006 off MSRP on Tacomas, 0% or $1000 bucks on Sienna's 0% or $4000 bucks on Tundra's, $4506 off Highlanders, $6006 off 4Runners, $9006 off LandCruisers, and $3000 off Sequuoia's.
The only difference between Toyota and GM, is that Toyota is blander. And yes, I got past the sixth grade ....
Wasn't trying to get a deal, I was looking to see how they were trying to compete on the sales floor and with the product.
They lost on two counts:
1) They seemed either clueless, or unwilling to face reality and TRY to sell me a car.
2) Like most of what GM has to offer, it's overpriced and under-equipped in comparison. Not to mention, the interior, while better than most GM products, was still stuck in the '80s.
I looked at it. I was curious. Since so many threads here debate the topic, I go an actually look at and drive most of what I have time to.
Of all my office mates that bought GM trucks/SUVs, most of them won't do it again. I've taken all of them to the dealers on numerous occasions to get things fixed (under warranty) while those of us with non-GM trucks and cars have had no problems.
That's pretty typical, and why the "Big Three" will be distant memories.
As for why Toyota is discounting TRUCKS and SUVs, that's simple: gas-guzzlers were hot before gas went through the roof, and like all the other manufacturers, they bit and got bitten by over-producing these gas-hogs.
Not a very good example, and I know you're smart enough to know why.
Scott
Im failing to see how the Big 3 will be distant memories ? My Dad owns a 2002 Dodge Ram Quad Cab with the 4.7 V8. It has arounnd 210,000 on it last time I called him. He loves to travel more than anything so in a few more years I easily expect him to be at 500K. The Only thing the truck had a problem with was the Blender door in the Vent system and that was almost 2 years ago. So Im failing to see how the Dodge truck is subpar ?
Your dad - and many other's dads may love their US cars/trucks, but look at the companies - they're hurting big-time.
Ford and GM are teetering on bankruptcy.
Do you not read the news?
Don't blame Toyota and Honda, blame the companies and the big, fat slobs that run them into the ground. The unions don't help either.
Scott
Ford and GM are teetering on bankruptcy.
Do you not read the news?
Don't blame Toyota and Honda, blame the companies and the big, fat slobs that run them into the ground. The unions don't help either.
Scott
Ford and GM in my opionion are Hurting but they are starting to get their act together and pull some weight now. Yes I read the news every day. Im not blaming anybody for a Mistake they make Im just making a point that the domestic cars Especially some, Are actualy Very good Quality. Its one of the reasons I bought my Dodge Ram.
I also went to look at Mustangs.
Great car, mostly nice-looking, and I believe great power-plants.
Dealers have them by the score on the lots.
They're not even trying to discount those, but I gave one of them my phone number to see what would happen.
Calls every day, but every time I ask about discounts and/or incentives, there's nothing being put out there.
Don't you think that's odd for a company in such turmoil?
I truly think that they don't realize what's going on. Or they're aware, and think that if they pretend things are good, people will think the same and be willing to buy a car that's available in abundance.
I frankly find them to be overpriced, and with a good discount, I'd be willing to look. I had nothing but American cars until about 15 years ago - after numerous cars dying and crapping out before what I consider their time, I gave up.
I also had bad experiences with tow Nissan Maximas - I love those cars, but they sucked and broke a lot. I hate them as much as GM.
Scott
Great car, mostly nice-looking, and I believe great power-plants.
Dealers have them by the score on the lots.
They're not even trying to discount those, but I gave one of them my phone number to see what would happen.
Calls every day, but every time I ask about discounts and/or incentives, there's nothing being put out there.
Don't you think that's odd for a company in such turmoil?
I truly think that they don't realize what's going on. Or they're aware, and think that if they pretend things are good, people will think the same and be willing to buy a car that's available in abundance.
I frankly find them to be overpriced, and with a good discount, I'd be willing to look. I had nothing but American cars until about 15 years ago - after numerous cars dying and crapping out before what I consider their time, I gave up.
I also had bad experiences with tow Nissan Maximas - I love those cars, but they sucked and broke a lot. I hate them as much as GM.
Scott
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