Yeah, but Tesla still has the highest fatality rate in the industry.
Explain that.
Maybe AI can help?
Tesla Full Self Driving (FSD)
- Thread starter Torrid
- Start date
Explain that.
Maybe AI can help?
Honda and Subaru use camera only for multiple models. What source do you want? The build sheet on the cars?
If you just want to be argumentative for the sake of being argumentative I'm done with this interaction. Lack of knowledge and then just leveraging it with "I think" when it comes to forward radar is making my blood boil since facts don't matter to you.
You've seen radar work in snow? That's the only situation that would make cruise unavailable in my VW.
It would be okay simply to confess error.
No reason for your blood to boil just because someone calls you on something and no reason for you to imply that I lack knowledge.
Chill out and be aware that I am seriously thinking of a Model 3, a good EV warts notwithstanding.
Are you assuming Tesla accident fatality rate has to do with their lack of lidar?
Tesla's fatality rate is mainly attributed to driver behavior and the performance and heavy acceleration of the vehicles, which is also a driver issue.
Well back in 2023
"Since Elon Musk announced that Tesla was doing away with radar sensors on its cars nearly two years ago, the electric-car maker has seen an increase in crashes and near accidents, according to a recent report from The Washington Post."
Attributed by whom? You, Tesla?
I've made no assumptions.
I was merely making the observation that Tesla has the highest fatality rate of any brand sold in the US by either vehicles sold or miles traveled.
No disagreement on that.
You understand this is a FSD thread, right?
Are you making the FSD assumption? If you have data, I'm all ears.
I'm not making any assumptions. Tesla employees saw an uptick in accidents after radar was removed.
Even as recently as March of 2026 Tesla Ai trainers don't trust the technology. As much as Tesla owners love and defend their vehicles when employees don't trust it nor believe the stats, then maybe it's not as good as Musk claims.
"Why Tesla’s AI trainers don’t trust its self-driving tech – or its safety stats
Tesla says its Full Self-Driving software is up to 10 times safer than human drivers. But the figures the company uses to support its claims don't withstand scrutiny – and staffers who trained the technology say it isn't close to safely delivering autonomous vehicles at scale."Check out the Reuters article and see. At some scale I think Tesla is committing VW level fraud by hiding data and statistics.
So Tesla's house AI tells us that its cars are among the safest on the road that just happen to have high fatal accident rates?
How does Grok define "contradiction"?
Correlation ≠ causation
Sure. When Tesla employees have access to data that you and I don't and still say their accident rate is now higher should be a clue. Have you read the Reuters article? When current Tesla employees say that their current safety rating is a lie a 10x's safer than humans and that they won't ride in Robotaxis should make Tesla supporters question Musks motives. It's unfortunate that regulators will go after foreign car manufacturers for fraud but not Tesla. Musk 100% knew that hardware 3 vehicles wouldn't be fully autonomous. Nor will hardware 4,5,6,7,8. Mercedes level 3 is five years ahead of what Tesla can produce.
There is no 100% of anything in the world.
Is it better than a new 16 year old driver? Sure.
Is it better than Waymo with lidar and camera on the KFC bucket up above? Will never be. You can't beat the lack of blind spot when you put a rotating bucket above your roof and adding lidar all over. I am sure that's what it means when a professional engineer look at it vs a fanboy look at it with rose tinted glasses.
Personally I wouldn't mind riding in Robotaxi once in a while (someone else is getting killed instead of me in the car), but I would not selling insurance to Robotaxi at the same premium as Waymo if I am an insurance company.
Metrics matter. Waymo has been going around without driver for a year or two now, and these days if I see a Waymo with a driver inside I would think it is weird. Most front occupants in Waymo I see are on the front passenger side instead now.
Compare to a human driver? FSD might be safer if in broad daylight boring road with nothing else going on. No cell phone distraction and no DUI would remove probably 1/2 of the accidents out there.
The cars are awesome and FSD for sure has it's flaws. You're just having a serious misunderstanding on how these systems work and are actually implemented. It would be awesome if all companies posted their testing of AEB.
That said I just canceled FSD again. The last few updates have messed up how each speed setting reacts to new speed zones and left alone will be getting me a nasty speeding ticket. The set and forget FSD crowd must be putting up with a lot just to avoid not having multiple disengagements a day. It's back to being less work to just drive again. Got to love constantly changing technology.
Yeah, not having a max speed is the biggest issue with FSD.
