Rental Car Review: 4 Days with a Tesla Model 3 Performance

Joined
Jan 14, 2011
Messages
5,871
Location
northern Az where the Antelope play
Originally Posted by Boomer
I have been writing to my local state reps and senators about taxing electric cars for their use of the roads. I pay a lot of taxes (through gas purchases) to use the roads. It seems to me that it is only fair that e-car users get an annual bill for road taxes of several hundred dollars to make them comparable to gas cars. Nobody should be able to use a taxpayer supported road system with out paying for the privelege.
Hope you included the Amish and bicycle riders. smirk2 EVs are still in the early adopter phase of their development. Early adopters are willing to adjust to own and experience new technology. Most people aren't and won't accept EVs until it's a seamless choice between ICE and EV. A high percentage of US households could easily live with an EV as the 2nd or 3rd vehicle in the fleet.
 
Joined
Jan 9, 2010
Messages
8,807
Location
Los Gatos, CA
I would be curious as to your before Tesla thoughts vs your after Tesla thoughts and opinions. That is, what were you "wrong" about. For me, it was about charging vs fill up and range in general. I realized that, while it is different, you learn. It is doable. Not perfect, but doable. Kinda cool, actually. It can be nice to be wrong.
 
Last edited:

dogememe

Thread starter
Joined
Apr 15, 2017
Messages
2,780
Location
San Rafael, CA
Originally Posted by JeffKeryk
I would be curious as to your before Tesla thoughts vs your after Tesla thoughts and opinions. That is, what were you "wrong" about. For me, it was about charging vs fill up and range in general. I realized that, while it is different, you learn. It is doable. Not perfect, but doable. Kinda cool, actually. It can be nice to be wrong.
I honestly have always though that "electric cars are kinda cool but also kinda stupid" and now my opinion is "electric cars are really awesome and great for some people but people aren't going to be replacing their corollas and suburbans with EVs for another 10 years or so". I do, however, not like my Suburban nearly as much as I liked it before. I drove it today and it's so slooooooooow (compared to the Tesla... compared to the Escape it's a rocket) and the whole engine/transmission is so unresponsive and laggy. Ugh I'm never going to look at any of my vehicles the same way again haha.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jul 9, 2008
Messages
2,478
Location
British Columbia, Canada
Originally Posted by Rand
First thing around here is terrible roads.. those big wheels/low profile tires are probably $1000 each to replace if you need a new wheel and tire from a bomb crater normal winter road in Ohio.
That problem is not exclusive to Teslas. The base Model 3 has reasonable size alloy wheels so wheel damage is not a bigger problem for it than for any other modern vehicle. One thing I didn't know is that those ugly aero discs on the base wheels come off and there's a normal looking alloy wheel underneath. I think the only time you'd have the aero discs on would be for a very long trip where range and efficiency matter the most.
 
Joined
Jan 9, 2010
Messages
8,807
Location
Los Gatos, CA
Originally Posted by dogememe
Originally Posted by JeffKeryk
I would be curious as to your before Tesla thoughts vs your after Tesla thoughts and opinions. That is, what were you "wrong" about. For me, it was about charging vs fill up and range in general. I realized that, while it is different, you learn. It is doable. Not perfect, but doable. Kinda cool, actually. It can be nice to be wrong.
I honestly have always though that "electric cars are kinda cool but also kinda stupid" and now my opinion is "electric cars are really awesome and great for some people but people aren't going to be replacing their corollas and suburbans with EVs for another 10 years or so". I do, however, not like my Suburban nearly as much as I liked it before. I drove it today and it's so slooooooooow (compared to the Tesla... compared to the Escape it's a rocket) and the whole engine/transmission is so unresponsive and laggy. Ugh I'm never going to look at any of my vehicles the same way again haha.
Yep, the Model 3 will spoil you. Kinda one reason I call it a toy... It is a true point and shoot car; real quick, darty, handles really well. Give it partial throttle out of a turn and wow! Makes you wanna take the long way. The small steering wheel becomes your norm; others become large. The interior and dash as a whole, while not for everyone, is futuristic. I drive our GS the most. After a spin in the Tesla, the Lexus, with all its knobs and dodads, seems overly cluttered; even confusing. How many other GPS screens display road work cones? The iPhone interface is coming folks. I appreciate your thoughts.
 
Joined
Jan 9, 2010
Messages
8,807
Location
Los Gatos, CA
Originally Posted by super20dan
this is the car tesla should have built first-not that stupid worthless roadster
Musk's stated goal was to build an EV for the masses. To get there, he had to learn; Tesla was in uncharted territory. The 1st roadster was a Lotus based vehicle and was pretty remarkable. Lithium ion batteries and 200 mile range. It was really quick. I think Toyota helped with the motor and drivetrain, not sure. I remember it being a toy for the rich. Then came the Model S; a true game changer. I remember the 1st one I saw. A white beauty here in Los Gatos... They started at $60K, but the vast majority were $90K plus tax, etc. The big battery car's range was well in excess of 300 miles. Over 7 years ago. Take that, Taycan. Next came the X, with its faulty falcon doors. Not the prettiest SUV but fast as heck. Generally more expensive than the S; it quickly became a status symbol at well over $100K. My friend just bought one, he said his was like $110K. Think I'll keep our RX, thank you. Then the Model 3. Originally Musk wanted to call it the Model E so his cars could be SEXY. But Ford was gonna use the E so now it is S3XY. Good ol' Elon and his smokeables... 400,000 pre orders... We have had our Model 3 Medium Range (260 miles) RWD for almost a year. Tesla sells every 3 they can make, like 90K deliveries per quarter. Order backlog continues to grow. Tesla Gigafactory 3 in Shanghai broke ground in Dec 2018 to manufacture batteries and 250,000 Model 3 and Y cars per year. The first cars were completed in August of this year. Now that's amazing. FYI China is the biggest market in the world. They love the Model 3. Musk now says he is slowing the Model S and X development to focus on the 3 and Y. Say what you want, but he has changed the world. Another great American success story. Right up the road in Fremont, CA.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jul 22, 2005
Messages
11,654
Location
NorthEast
Great and honest review and I agree with most of it. You don't *need* the Performance version. (But you *want* it once you drive it :-) The AWD is the perfect balance for the price, usability and performance. If you have a garage, then charging at 220V should not be big issue at all. I plug it in at the end of the day when I pull in my garage. The only time I visited gas station with this car was to get inspection sticker!
Quote
Even with super skinny tires this thing is so, so smooth.
I don't think you meant what you wrote there :-) Those rubber band tires are NOT skinny but rather very thinly sliced like a salami! By the way, I already had to spend lots and lots dollars on those 20" alloys getting damaged and blowing up a tire because of a pothole on highway. I am going to put 18 inch snows on it and may eventually replace snow with performance 18 rubber. As far as long distance trips, I have not taken any in it. And one of the reason is indeed the possibility of having to change the way we to do long distance travel. However, hundreds of thousands of Tesla owners regularly take theirs on trip including my colleague who has the same car. Technically, there is no problem at all but emotionally it is little bit different. In couple of days, my car will have its 1st birthday. It has visited Supercharger only once just to see if I could use it.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Aug 10, 2016
Messages
91
Location
Loganville GA USA
Nephew has a P85. I have driven it a few times. I really like everything about it, quiet, smooth, and very powerful. I just can't afford one.
 
Joined
Aug 5, 2002
Messages
19,331
Location
Silicon Valley
A few coworkers have it. Nice car. The 30k starting price is a lie (most end up with a 45k before tax price tag) and as is the range. Not something I'd spend my money on but I do see the appeal.
 
Joined
Aug 5, 2002
Messages
19,331
Location
Silicon Valley
Originally Posted by Boomer
I have been writing to my local state reps and senators about taxing electric cars for their use of the roads. I pay a lot of taxes (through gas purchases) to use the roads. It seems to me that it is only fair that e-car users get an annual bill for road taxes of several hundred dollars to make them comparable to gas cars. Nobody should be able to use a taxpayer supported road system with out paying for the privelege.
Then you are going to have a millage based system for road use. That's opening a can of worms......
It is called toll road. I don't see the appeal of reducing tax on fuel but tax it back on the toll, and having all major highway being toll based.
 

CKN

Joined
Oct 14, 2014
Messages
7,201
Location
Utah
It is called toll road. I don't see the appeal of reducing tax on fuel but tax it back on the toll, and having all major highway being toll based.

That's not the entire answer. What "gas tax" does an electric car pay when doing an average trip around town? Statistically-most trips are shorter than 10 miles.
 
Joined
Aug 15, 2020
Messages
383
Location
Atlanta, GA
I have been writing to my local state reps and senators about taxing electric cars for their use of the roads. I pay a lot of taxes (through gas purchases) to use the roads. It seems to me that it is only fair that e-car users get an annual bill for road taxes of several hundred dollars to make them comparable to gas cars. Nobody should be able to use a taxpayer supported road system with out paying for the privelege.
Georgia has a separate registration fee for BEV's vs ICE to recoup lost road tax - my ICE cars were $22-$23/annual, BEV's are ~$213/annual. That does not even get you the green leaf plate for the HOV lane, that requires a separate specialty plate production fee and I think an extra $10/annual for the specialty plate.
 
Joined
Jun 4, 2003
Messages
1,038
Location
98245
... If you love to drive, you'll love this car. Sure on a track it can beat out more expensive performance/exotic vehicles but that doesn't matter. What matters is how it feels to drive and I had a smile on my face the entire time. You will too. So, why did I not give it 10/10 in the driving category?After all, it feels like you're going 75 when you're going double that, it goes 0-60 in 2.9 seconds, surely that deserves a 10/10? Well, no. You have to remember that this car is a giant iPad on wheels. You're driving a computer which is driving the car. This is why it's so frustrating when once in a while the car decides what it's going to do, even though you're asking it to do something different. And even worse, that behavior can, and will, change over time with software updates.
It seems you covered the duality here. If you love to drive, you may or may not love this car. It's an overweight lead sled. Very fast in a straight line, but all that weight means poor agility and the "ipad on wheels" means low driver engagement, a point and shoot affair.

Are you the kind of driver who loves stick shift, double-clutching, heel and toe rev matching, etc. with nimble handling and quick turn-in and a bit of throttle oversteer, the only music or stereo you want is the ICE roaring through free flowing exhaust, high engagement being "one with the car", the car does exactly what you tell it, instantaneously, without being second-guessed by a computer? Do you always get the manual transmission even if the automatic shifts faster and saves a few tenths 0-60, because you want the fun visceral experience? Then you will not love the Tesla.
 
Joined
Apr 10, 2015
Messages
330
Location
Houston, TX
Georgia has a separate registration fee for BEV's vs ICE to recoup lost road tax - my ICE cars were $22-$23/annual, BEV's are ~$213/annual. That does not even get you the green leaf plate for the HOV lane, that requires a separate specialty plate production fee and I think an extra $10/annual for the specialty plate.

That seems more punitive than it should be. Just comparing a Model 3 to something like a Honda Accord at 12,000 average miles per year / 30 mpg gets 400 gallons of fuel. Here in Texas I think the gas tax is $0.20 gallon so that's only $80 of lost gas tax. If I'm looking at this right, in Georgia it's like $0.26 a gallon in tax so only like $104.
 
Joined
Feb 15, 2003
Messages
11,294
Location
Jupiter, Florida
I could have written that review. It's exactly how I feel about them.

A poster above mentioned "poor agility". That's simply not so. These cars are heavy, yes. But they have the suspension goods and the weight distribution to be very agile indeed. If you like to drive like an idiot (I do) these cars are for you. That agility shows up in the autocross times, as Model 3's on sticky rubber are consistently in the fastest group.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Sep 23, 2008
Messages
10,031
Location
Ontario, Canada
I could have written that review. It's exactly how I feel about them.

A poster above mentioned "poor agility". That's simply not so. These cars are heavy, yes. But they have the suspension goods and the weight distribution to be very agile indeed. If you like to drive like and idiot (I do) these cars are for you. That agility shows up in the autocross times, as Model 3's on sticky rubber are consistently in the fastest group.
+1 We had a Model 3 P show up for our autocross this year and once he got some good rubber on it, it be was usually FTD. Very impressive car.
 
Top