Tesla Full Self Driving (FSD)

[fdcg27]

Our Equinox EV has front camera and front radar and automatic emergency braking and it still let my ex rear end someone. What a horrible vehicle! It’s obviously GM’s fault! EVs suck! We need to go back to horses!!

/s of course.

Yeah, but Tesla still has the highest fatality rate in the industry.
Explain that.
Maybe AI can help?

 

[Torrid]

I think either Subaru or Honda would be better sources than "Grok" but I have to give you credit for trying.

Honda and Subaru use camera only for multiple models. What source do you want? The build sheet on the cars?

If you just want to be argumentative for the sake of being argumentative I'm done with this interaction. Lack of knowledge and then just leveraging it with "I think" when it comes to forward radar is making my blood boil since facts don't matter to you.

 

[97prizm]

To be fair I haven't seen where Teslas cameras can see through snow storms or heavy fog. Lidar and radar excel at this.

 

[Torrid]

To be fair I haven't seen where Teslas cameras can see through snow storms or heavy fog. Lidar and radar excel at this.

You've seen radar work in snow? That's the only situation that would make cruise unavailable in my VW.

 

[fdcg27]

Honda and Subaru use camera only for multiple models. What source do you want? The build sheet on the cars?

If you just want to be argumentative for the sake of being argumentative I'm done with this interaction. Lack of knowledge and then just leveraging it with "I think" when it comes to forward radar is making my blood boil since facts don't matter to you.

It would be okay simply to confess error.
No reason for your blood to boil just because someone calls you on something and no reason for you to imply that I lack knowledge.
Chill out and be aware that I am seriously thinking of a Model 3, a good EV warts notwithstanding.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Yeah, but Tesla still has the highest fatality rate in the industry.
Explain that.
Maybe AI can help?

Are you assuming Tesla accident fatality rate has to do with their lack of lidar?

Tesla's fatality rate is mainly attributed to driver behavior and the performance and heavy acceleration of the vehicles, which is also a driver issue.

 

[97prizm]

Are you assuming Tesla accident fatality rate has to do with their lack of lidar?

Tesla's fatality rate is mainly attributed to driver behavior and the performance and heavy acceleration of the vehicles, which is also a driver issue.

Well back in 2023
"Since Elon Musk announced that Tesla was doing away with radar sensors on its cars nearly two years ago, the electric-car maker has seen an increase in crashes and near accidents, according to a recent report from The Washington Post."

 

[fdcg27]

Are you assuming Tesla accident fatality rate has to do with their lack of lidar?

Tesla's fatality rate is mainly attributed to driver behavior and the performance and heavy acceleration of the vehicles, which is also a driver issue.

Attributed by whom? You, Tesla?
I've made no assumptions.
I was merely making the observation that Tesla has the highest fatality rate of any brand sold in the US by either vehicles sold or miles traveled.
No disagreement on that.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Attributed by whom? You, Tesla?
I've made no assumptions.
I was merely making the observation that Tesla has the highest fatality rate of any brand sold in the US by either vehicles sold or miles traveled.
No disagreement on that.

You understand this is a FSD thread, right?

 

[JeffKeryk]

Well back in 2023
"Since Elon Musk announced that Tesla was doing away with radar sensors on its cars nearly two years ago, the electric-car maker has seen an increase in crashes and near accidents, according to a recent report from The Washington Post."

Are you making the FSD assumption? If you have data, I'm all ears.

 

[dogememe]

Yeah, but Tesla still has the highest fatality rate in the industry.
Explain that.
Maybe AI can help?

Sure, you want AI, here's what Grok had to say:

Tesla vehicles are among the safest on the road, consistently earning top NHTSA 5-star ratings and strong IIHS scores thanks to robust structures, low rollover risk, and advanced safety features.

However, some studies (like iSeeCars) report higher fatality rates per billion miles driven for Teslas compared to the national average. The main reasons are driver-related: Tesla owners tend to be younger, affluent, tech-savvy males who often drive more aggressively, speed, or over-rely on/misuse Autopilot/FSD, combined with the cars' quick acceleration that can encourage spirited driving.

Data issues in studies (e.g., opaque VMT estimates) also play a role, but the stats reflect who drives them and how far more than vehicle design flaws. Tesla's own telemetry shows strong safety performance with driver-assist features engaged.

 

[97prizm]

Are you making the FSD assumption? If you have data, I'm all ears.

I'm not making any assumptions. Tesla employees saw an uptick in accidents after radar was removed.
Even as recently as March of 2026 Tesla Ai trainers don't trust the technology. As much as Tesla owners love and defend their vehicles when employees don't trust it nor believe the stats, then maybe it's not as good as Musk claims.

"Why Tesla’s AI trainers don’t trust its self-driving tech – or its safety stats​

Tesla says its Full Self-Driving software is up to 10 times safer than human drivers. But the figures the company uses to support its claims don't withstand scrutiny – and staffers who trained the technology say it isn't close to safely delivering autonomous vehicles at scale."
Check out the Reuters article and see. At some scale I think Tesla is committing VW level fraud by hiding data and statistics.

 

[fdcg27]

Sure, you want AI, here's what Grok had to say:

So Tesla's house AI tells us that its cars are among the safest on the road that just happen to have high fatal accident rates?
How does Grok define "contradiction"?