service writers lie and pretend to know stuff

[Lumberg]

I used to be a mechanic. Big deal. Sometimes there's a problem or a job that exceeds my capacity at my house, and it has to be done by someone else.

In the dealership the mechanics (aka "technicians") are insulated from the public (really the other way around probably) by a layer of scum called the "service writers."

Presumably it's because the grubby mechanics aren't expected to have great customer service skills. That's fine.

But then the service writers start trotting out what they think are sage little nuggets of knowledge like the piston destruction "probably happened on the intake stroke." I'll ask "what about the power stroke?" And he'll say "it had to have happened while the piston was traveling downward because all the parts ended up in the oil pan." (I guess this guy skipped gravity and only studied momentum. Not to mention that the largest stress is put on the piston at combustion)

Once my gf had her Camry at a totally different stealership and the service writer told me that her car didn't have a coil. (The spark coil). I admittedly had never looked under her hood at the time so I asked, oh, so it's one of those designs with separate coil packs then? He stood his ground and said no coils at all.

I said "let's walk out to the car together so you can show me what's wrong" and as soon as we get there, I interrupt him, point to the coil, and ask him, "what's that?"

I didn't even wait for his response, I told gf that we're calling AAA and getting the car towed somewhere people don't LIE TO YOUR FACE.

Lately, in order to hopefully save them the embarrassment, I'll tell them ahead of time that I'm a mechanic. I just don't have the time/tools/space/manpower to do this job. EVEN THEN they just can't help themselves. It's almost like now they are rising to the challenge.

Service writers are just like tow truck drivers. If they really understood how cars worked and could fix them, they would be mechanics.

Now I'm no savant when it comes to working on cars--I've got butterfingers and I am way too meticulous to make a living fixing cars. But my B.S. detector is pretty well tuned. For people who fail to even grasp the basics of the four stroke combustion cycle to try to tell me how the [censored] car works is worse than insulting.

Note that the worst incidents in my case happened at Toyota stealerships. I've had mediocre experiences at Ford.

It seems that the excellence of Toyota's product is exceeded only by the dishonesty of the service writers.

Salesmen, hucksters, confidence men, racketeers, idiots, scum, wannabes.

***!?!?!?!

 

[mechtech2]

If service writers didn't stretch the envelope, they would be replaced by the management..

 

[Gary Allan]

Well, don't hold back. Tell us how you really feel.

 

[Lumberg]

Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
Well, don't hold back. Tell us how you really feel.


touche?

 

[demarpaint]

In declining new/used car sales, its the service dept that keeps the dealership alive, and most of the time they're the cash cow. The more the service writer can rip off the customers the more he and the dealership make. Management in a lot of dealerships really push the service writers and all depts as soon as sales drop.

I do my best to stay as far away from dealerships as I possibly can, having worked in several different dealerships I pretty much learned all their little tricks. Sadly after working at many different places none of them were honest, they ripped off the customers and employees. I'm sure there are some honest dealerships, I couldn't find one. I went back to my previous occupation.

Frank D

 

[JHZR2]

Ive heard that the service department barely makes money, if at all...

Doesnt mean that they dont really hit you for more than they need to... sometimes.

JMH

 

[demarpaint]

Well run service depts make money, especially in the larger dealerships with a large retail base. Warranty work is a tough way to make money, but good service writers have ways around that.

Frank D

 

[Spector]

New car sales pay the overhead, used cars and service make the profit.

Recently had a recall on my Buick valve cover gasket. I asked if I could get a labor reduction on plug replacement since the recall involved some duplicate labor. Service writer asked shop supervisor and said it would not reduce the cost. So, had the recall done and the other work will be done at independent mechanic. not to defend them but they seem to have no wiggle room and too many rules and no empowerment to do what is right.

Of course they found several items that needed more work which I declined and will see what my inedependent says. Too bad they cannot be trusted to give you the truth!

 

[MrCritical]

Have to disagree.

Per old school GM, anyway. Parts and Service are responsible for 60% of the overhead.

I was a service advisor from '94 till 2008.

If a dealership wants repeat business they will have honest knowledgeble service advisors, and their pay scale will reflect the ownerships desire to be honest.

The hardest thing to teach a salesman or service advisor at a dealership is how to say "I don't know". But then they follow up with "I'll find out".

There are honest dealers just like honest independents. Approximately 20% of our shop load is stuff that independents have tried to repair incorrectly.

 

[Lumberg]

Originally Posted By: MrCritical
Approximately 20% of our shop load is stuff that independents have tried to repair incorrectly.


Now that I definitely believe. It's hard to believe how many independents use the "throw parts at it" approach until they get too deep into the customer's pockets.

I'd like to start my own shop so bad. Maybe some day before I get too old.

I sprung for the factory repair manuals for my Camry so I know that thing inside & out, from the pin outs on the ECM to the ACIS (basically a crude variation on variable intake runner length).

So the only problems I can't solve are the ones where I don't have the manpower, time, or tools.

Kind of a shame that she's going out to pasture, unless this lead the Critic gave me pans out. In the meanwhile I am probably towing the car home today and starting to strip the aftermarket suspension parts (just rear sway bar and poly bushings on both sway bars).

I have another Camry of the exact same vintage so at least I can have the other one be the one with the awesome suspension.

 

[blackcherry06]

I became 'once bitten, twice shy' years ago when the transmission in my 85 Olds Calais started acting strangely. Basically, the torque converter stopped locking up at around 42mph, like it had done for years. It was easy to tell what was going on...giving it a bit of throttle at speed would cause the tachometer to rise slightly, even though the transmission didn't shift down...indicating no lockup.

I took it to the local Olds dealer and they diagnosed it as a 'pressure switch'. Fine..replace it please.

After leaving with my car, I noticed that it still would not achieve lockup. I returned and was given the explanation that my transmission was performing normally. Basically...dismissed. I drove straight to our local transmission shop for a 2nd opinion. After looking at the new pressure switch, he noticed that it was indeed installed, but not plugged in. He charged me $35 to plug it in, and the torque converter resumed locking up as it always had.

No more dealerships for me unless it's warranty work. And even then I'm hesitant.

 

[MrCritical]

These days, if a service advisor's pay isn't partially based on CSI (Customer Satisfaction Index)then his bosses are encouraging dishonesty, in my opinion.

I don't know how you'd figure a national average of honest dealerships. I've worked at 7 dealerships in my 30 or so years in this business. Only one would I characterize as dishonest. They started looking to upsell the customer before they properly diagnosed the problem. I stayed at that one just long enough to find another job.

I've been at this one since 1994, and I hope to retire here.

 

[mrsilv04]

I view Service Advisors the same way that I do politicians.

All they do is tell you what you want to hear. The trick is to glean out of all of it what you need to know.

Critical - We all wish there were more like you. Your customers are the lucky ones.

 

[MrCritical]

I appreciate that. But I give the credit to my boss and the one's who trained me.


Honest mistakes at our shop are paid for by the owner, not charged back to the tech, or the customer. If a problem pattern shows itself, the tech is scheduled for additional training, or blocked from certain jobs that they have problems with.

I couldn't rip people off for enough money to make me be able to sleep at night with a clear conscience.

I think the truth is that there are honest shops both independent and dealerships. Check around, ask people who do business at one you're considering. Vote with your feet.

 

[astraelraen]

I work at an accounting firm who does the tax returns, etc for a few large dealerships in my area.

Dealerships easily make 60% profit on service and parts sales. It is by far their most profitable units.

 

[blackcherry06]

I work with a poor soul that knows absolutely ZERO about even the basics in vehicle maintenance. His F-150 started running rough, in need of a tune-up. He goes to an independent shop around the corner from our office that RAPED him for a tune-up on that truck. I realize there is some labor involved in getting the spark plugs in and out of that engine (thanks to a stupid design by Ford) but $600 for a tune-up and oil change is pure rape. Spark plugs, air and oil filter, and some dino oil..and the rest is labor.

Unfortunately, the average person doesn't really know what's involved so when they're quoted a price like that, they assume that it's a difficult job and therefore worth it. I nearly passed out when he told me what he paid. It's the only time I can recall saying that someone would have actually been better off going to a dealership.

 

[Lumberg]

Originally Posted By: astraelraen
I work at an accounting firm who does the tax returns, etc for a few large dealerships in my area.

Dealerships easily make 60% profit on service and parts sales. It is by far their most profitable units.


That makes sense because that's where they can exploit the information discrepancy the best.

 

[ekpolk]

Originally Posted By: blackcherry06
I work with a poor soul that knows absolutely ZERO about even the basics in vehicle maintenance. His F-150 started running rough, in need of a tune-up. He goes to an independent shop around the corner from our office that RAPED him for a tune-up on that truck. I realize there is some labor involved in getting the spark plugs in and out of that engine (thanks to a stupid design by Ford) but $600 for a tune-up and oil change is pure rape. Spark plugs, air and oil filter, and some dino oil..and the rest is labor.

Unfortunately, the average person doesn't really know what's involved so when they're quoted a price like that, they assume that it's a difficult job and therefore worth it. I nearly passed out when he told me what he paid. It's the only time I can recall saying that someone would have actually been better off going to a dealership.

I'm guessing the local Ford store would have charged him a couple hundred more...

 

[JTK]

Originally Posted By: MrCritical
These days, if a service advisor's pay isn't partially based on CSI (Customer Satisfaction Index)then his bosses are encouraging dishonesty, in my opinion..


From what I gather, that's the way it is with the multi-line, mega dealerships in my area. The SA I dealt with recently for my Cobalt asked me to let him know directly if I was not 100% satisfied. Said his pay was directly effected by me checking "completely satisfied" on the follow-up survey. Anything less meant no joy per this SA. Much to my surprise, this dealership visit greatly exceeded my expectations. A total 180 from visits to other dealerships over the years.

Joel

 

[MrCritical]

Lumberg is correct. If a dealer has to rely on new car profit to stay open, he'll probably be shutting the doors pretty quickly.