Rotella T6 Alternatives?

O

Olympus

Joined
Jan 22, 2023
Messages
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I just noticed that the new Rotella T6 jugs no longer say anything about meeting JASO MA2 specs. I've been running T6 a bulk fleet oil for multiple applications. KTM 300 XCW dirt bike, Kawasaki KLR110 dirt bike, Suzuki King Quad four wheeler, Yamaha Grizzly 90 four wheeler, John Deere commercial mower (Kawasaki FX801V), LS compact tractor, and a 2005 Jeep Wranger 4.0L.

Did T6 change it's formulation so it's not longer acceptable for wet clutch applications? Is there anything alternative that I can use for fleet use? 15w40 is what I always used. I live in the midwest and all vehicles are stored in an insulated shop. About half of the equipment only gets used in the summer months exclusively.
 
From the Shell website

T6 15w40
API, CK-4, CJ-4, ACEA E9, JASO DH-2, MA/MA 2; Caterpillar ECF-2,ECF-3; Cummins CES 20086; DDC DFS 93K222;MB-Approval 228.31; Volvo VDS-4.5; Ford WSS-M2C171-F1;Allison TES 439, MAN 3775; MACK EOS-4.5

OEM Specifications and Approvals for Shell ROTELLA® T6 full synthetic heavy duty engine oil​

  • API: CK-4, CJ-4, CI-4 PLUS, CI-4, CH-4
  • ACEA E9; JASO DH-2; Cummins CES 20086; Volvo VDS-4.5; Detroit Fluid Specification (DFS) 93K222, Caterpillar ECF-2/ECF-3, MAN M3575, JASO MA/MA2, Allison TES 439, MB-Approval 228.31
 
Friction modifiers additives are only a small percent of the total oil
product and help the base oil do things that it otherwise could not...
Additives fall into several basic categories but Moly, Phosphors and
Zinc are the most often used friction modifiers... what ever small
percent of FM employed they will not defeat a wet clutch in good
working order...

JASO has approved 1,778 oils as of Dec 2023 which covers virtually
everything on the market... From 0w to mono grades... from 30 to 60
multi grades... from Auto to Cycle oils and yet no oil has ever been
listed by JASO for defeating a wet clutch... fact is high mileage not
our oil is the observed cause of a clutch loosing its grip...

If you wish high mileage clutch life then you have to invest in some
good old sweat equity... because at the first sign of slip it doesn't
automatically mean your clutch is tired and worn out or that your
clutch plates are wore too thin because you can Mic them to
determine serviceability and within the factory specifications...

Under scrutiny you'll find that your slip was due to normal
glazing and contaminates... if your interested in making your
clutch bite good as new then roll up your sleeves and read on...

Inspect the friction plates for glazing... make sure you have plenty
of material to work with... your shop manual states clutch thickness
in thousands of an inch or mm...

First removed the contaminants with Acetone... pick a hard surface to lay
over a 600 grit black dry emery paper... rotate the clutch plate in a
circle... you're just busting the glaze... don't get carried away
remove too much material... You should end up with a friction plate
looks dull like a new one as opposed to a shinny glazed one... recheck
thickness...

gallery_3131_51_129667.jpg



Next check the pressure plates for bluing caused by localized heat...
make sure they are not warped... consult the manual for a thickness
range... now removed the contaminants with Acetone and wire wheeled
them to erased the blue and also to generally scuff up the surface...
you should end up with a dull surface free of Blue marks...

gallery_3131_51_40098.jpg


PressurePlates2.jpg.4d1e496dbcbcbb383730a9ab807432c9.jpg
 
Last edited:
Ursatdx said:
From the Shell website

T6 15w40
API, CK-4, CJ-4, ACEA E9, JASO DH-2, MA/MA 2; Caterpillar ECF-2,ECF-3; Cummins CES 20086; DDC DFS 93K222;MB-Approval 228.31; Volvo VDS-4.5; Ford WSS-M2C171-F1;Allison TES 439, MAN 3775; MACK EOS-4.5

OEM Specifications and Approvals for Shell ROTELLA® T6 full synthetic heavy duty engine oil​

  • API: CK-4, CJ-4, CI-4 PLUS, CI-4, CH-4
  • ACEA E9; JASO DH-2; Cummins CES 20086; Volvo VDS-4.5; Detroit Fluid Specification (DFS) 93K222, Caterpillar ECF-2/ECF-3, MAN M3575, JASO MA/MA2, Allison TES 439, MB-Approval 228.31
Click to expand...
Not sure where you found that at on the website. I went to the T6 15w40 product page and couldn't find it. I clicked on the PDF brochure for it and it only lists JASO DH2 and nothing else.

rotella.shell.com

Shell Rotella® T6 15W-40 Full Synthetic

Learn more about Shell Rotella® T6 15W-40 Full Synthetic Heavy Duty Diesel Engine Oil, which is designed and formulated to provide improved performance compared to conventional diesel engine oils.
rotella.shell.com rotella.shell.com
 
Last edited:
Discussed pretty well in this thread. Note too that any reference to JASO is a recommendation only.

Rotella 15w40 T4 & T6 in Motorcycles

I'm starting this thread to compare the two flavors of Rotella 15w40 in motorcycles. Apparently the synthetic T6 was only available in 5w40 for many years, so if you wanted a Rotella 15w40, you were looking at the T4 "Dino" oil. I've been very happy using T4 15w40 in my Nighthawk 750 (air...
bobistheoilguy.com
 
Olympus said:
I just noticed that the new Rotella T6 jugs no longer say anything about meeting JASO MA2 specs. I've been running T6 a bulk fleet oil for multiple applications. KTM 300 XCW dirt bike, Kawasaki KLR110 dirt bike, Suzuki King Quad four wheeler, Yamaha Grizzly 90 four wheeler, John Deere commercial mower (Kawasaki FX801V), LS compact tractor, and a 2005 Jeep Wranger 4.0L.

Did T6 change it's formulation so it's not longer acceptable for wet clutch applications? Is there anything alternative that I can use for fleet use? 15w40 is what I always used. I live in the midwest and all vehicles are stored in an insulated shop. About half of the equipment only gets used in the summer months exclusively.
Click to expand...
I noticed that too. At least on the new T6 10w30 viscosity, they put a cute lil motorcycle graphic on the bottle. But no JASO MA letters. Yet the T5 has the JASO MA letters, but no lil moto graphic...

Rotella T5 and T6 in 10w30

I was surprised to learn that Rotella T6 is now being offered in 10W30, and the new T6 jug has a pic of a motorcycle on it too. Oddly, despite having a motorcycle pic on the front of the T6 jug, there are no JASO MA letters on the back! As I shared recently, the T5 10W30 recently added the...
bobistheoilguy.com

It appears that Rotella has not changed, but the JASO MA standard has.

JASO MA is a convenient way to gauge if an oil will work in a wet clutch, but Rotella has been used in bikes far longer than the JASO MA standard has existed.

If you're happy with Rotella so far, I'd be inclined to just keep using it.
 
Since the CK-4 rollout, Delvac Super 1300 had lowered their phos to what is the minimum of the JASO spec of 800ppm. I know of no other indication that the phos reduction had been backfilled with motorcycle-benefitting AW/EP additives. It also does not tout that it meets MTU spec (a light-loaded geartrain wear spec,) nor allison transmission spec. These tend to be convenient analogues to me to bolster confidence in the blend's AW performance.
 
Jay Freddy said:
Ps. As far as alternatives to Rotella, Mobil Delvac Supper 1300 15w40 is reputed to be excellent in bikes too, but they never claimed to be JASO MA compliant.
Click to expand...
I've been using this for 40K miles now and the Zuki has not exploded yet. Shift quality remains good well past 3K miles.
Not an endorsement but a pretty good test.
YMMV
Smoky
 
BusyLittleShop said:
JASO has approved 1,778 oils as of Dec 2023 which covers virtually
everything on the market... From 0w to mono grades... from 30 to 60
multi grades... from Auto to Cycle oils and yet no oil has ever been
listed by JASO for defeating a wet clutch... fact is high mileage not
our oil is the observed cause of a clutch loosing its grip...
Click to expand...

Here is JASO's published list containing 323 oils certified to defeat wet clutches. (Hint: They're the ones with the MB in the Performance Classifications column)

https://www.jalos.or.jp/onfile/pdf/4T_EV_LIST.pdf
 
MotoTribologist said:
Here is JASO's published list containing 323 oils certified to defeat wet clutches. (Hint: They're the ones with the MB in the Performance Classifications column)
Click to expand...

Negative... its not a list of 323 certified oils to defeat a wet clutch...

Motorcycle oils meeting JASO MA and JASO MB also make no mention of defeating a wet clutch...

JASO MA
Valvoline 4-Stroke Synthetic Motor Oil 10W-40 and 20W-50
Mobil 1 Racing 4T 10W-40

JASO MB
Red Line 10W-40 ester based motorcycle oil
Silkolene QUAD ATV 5W-40 Fully Synthetic 4-Stroke Engine Oil
 
Last edited:
BusyLittleShop said:
Motorcycle oils meeting JASO MA and JASO MB also make no mention of defeating a wet clutch...

JASO MA
Valvoline 4-Stroke Synthetic Motor Oil 10W-40 and 20W-50
Mobil 1 Racing 4T 10W-40

JASO MB
Red Line 10W-40 ester based motorcycle oil
Silkolene QUAD ATV 5W-40 Fully Synthetic 4-Stroke Engine Oil
Click to expand...
Never seen any motorcycle manual recommending JASO MB for a wet clutch application.
 
MotoTribologist said:
I literally posted it. You quoted it. I don't know what else to say. MB is not wet clutch compatible. The entire purpose of the MB classification is to designate an oil that causes a clutch to slip beyond a functional level.
Click to expand...
Why would a group certify one of their oils to meet JASO MB then? What is the motivation?
 
Brian553 said:
Why would a group certify one of their oils to meet JASO MB then? What is the motivation?
Click to expand...

MB is meant for bikes/motors without wet clutches or with separate engine/trans. I always wanted to make the Harley Davidson marketed engine oils MB rated, but I couldn't get the brass to see it my way back then.

We used to recommend MB for the older Honda mxers that had separate compartments. A lot of scooters without wet clutches recommend MB oils for fuel economy purposes.

Just a niche market for oils, really. Although that niche (scooters) is massive in some countries, people in those countries don't often fret too much about oil choice for a small mpg gain.
 
MotoTribologist said:
I literally posted it. You quoted it. I don't know what else to say. MB is not wet clutch compatible. The entire purpose of the MB classification is to designate an oil that causes a clutch to slip beyond a functional level.
Click to expand...

Negative Moto...
You posted a JASO list titled "JASO Engine Oil Standards Implementation Panel"... you did not post a list tilted "JASO's published list containing 323 oils certified to defeat wet clutches."

Even if the JASO panel had an oil that is not compatible the submitter is
protected from being identified in order to protect market share...

Quote JASO
"The Panel may disclose the results of market surveys in a manner such
that particular names of submitters and their oil products are not
identifiable."

JASO_MB(1).JPG
 
BusyLittleShop said:
Even if the JASO panel had an oil that is not compatible the submitter is
protected from being identified in order to protect market share...

Quote JASO
"The Panel may disclose the results of market surveys in a manner such
that particular names of submitters and their oil products are not
identifiable."

View attachment 184916
Click to expand...
I don't think an oil that doesn't meet the JASO specs would even be listed in the JASO registration list of motor oils. It has to meet the JASO specs, or it can not make the registration list.
 
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