ram_man's condensed Dodge Dart oil thread

[Merkava_4]

Originally Posted By: car51
Yeah ole' Merk thinks 10w30 and 20w50 or SAE 70 like top fuel cars is best for applications calling for 5w30. My dad that's retired with a 91 GMC truck with a v-8 doesn't use 10w30


You're afraid to use 10W-30 in your Chrysler 200 ; why ? Come right out and say it !

 

[53' Stude]

Something called warranty

 

[Merkava_4]

I wonder if they have any Chrysler 200 rentals around here. I would love to change it over to 10W-30 and then find me an on-ramp to redline it.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Yeah same here,doesn't make sense to me.

The easiest way to get your head around it (aside from a few quirks within ILSAC grades themselves) is to look at ILSAC and non-ILSAC stuff. A CJ-4/SN 5w-30 or an A3/B3 A3/B4 5w-30, both of which do exist, simply must have an HTHS of 3.5 or greater. The ILSAC 5w-30 is usually 3.1 +/- 0.1, in that range, because they, too, have to be roughly there. All these examples are 5w-30 according to viscosity rules, but there obviously are ranges. Heck, there are some 0w-30s thicker than ILSAC 10w-30s, for the same reason. Formulators have to design to spec.

 

[wemay]

Originally Posted By: Garak
...Heck, there are some 0w-30s thicker than ILSAC 10w-30s, for the same reason. Formulators have to design to spec.


Tell me about it...

https://mobiloil.com/en/motor-oils/synthetic

SAE Grade 0W-30
Viscosity @ 100ºC, cSt (ASTM D445) 10.9
Viscosity, @ 40ºC, cSt (ASTM D445) 62.9
HTHS Viscosity, mPa•s @ 150ºC (ASTM D4683) 3.0

SAE Grade 5W-30
Viscosity @ 100ºC, cSt (ASTM D445) 11.0
Viscosity, @ 40ºC, cSt (ASTM D445) 61.7
HTHS Viscosity, mPa•s @ 150ºC (ASTM D4683) 3.1

SAE grade 10W-30
Viscosity @ 100ºC, cSt (ASTM D445) 10.1
Viscosity, @ 40ºC, cSt (ASTM D445) 63.2
HTHS viscosity, mPa•s @ 150ºC (ASTM D4683) 3.0

 

[Garak]

Exactly. Those three there are all within a whisker of each other.

 

[440Magnum]

1) as lots of folks have stated, 0wXX doesn't become a benefit over 5wXX until -20, -30, -40 type temps. Youll be fine with 5wXX.

2) If you don't want to use Mobil, all well and good there are many choices for 5wX. But honestly their crop of 0wXX oils seems to be among the best of that grade- particularly 0w40 (not what you're looking for, I know), but also their AFE 0w30 and 0w20.

 

[440Magnum]

Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Originally Posted By: BigD1
Originally Posted By: MinamiKotaro
Actually, many 10w30s are slightly thinner at 40c, 100c, and HTHS than their 5w30 counterparts.


Yes that's true, but I don't know why.


Yeah same here,doesn't make sense to me.


Its been explained already in the thread (meeting A3/B3 A3/B4 5w-30 kinda requires it). All I would add is that this is another symptom of 10w30 gradually becoming an antiquated grade- there are a lot of 10w30s out there that don't bother to meet some of the newer/tighter specs because 10w30 is just not often recommended for new cars.

10w30 still has a lot of applications and certainly has the potential for some amazing numbers IF it were built on top of the latest tech base stocks, but you can't just go buy 10w30 willy-nilly and expect it to be a cutting-edge technology oil with the greatest base-stock blends, you have to look specifically for that. In fact, I'd say its a place a lot of the major mid-market brands tend to get rid of some of their older tech/cheaper to produce base stocks. Just my guess as an industry outsider looking at numbers... ;-)

 

[stchman]

The 0W is a winter number and you aren't going to really realize that until it gets REALLY cold (like -10F). No biggie.

 

[fdcg27]

You should already know that the difference between the two grades will be too small to measure at the lows you're looking at.
A 0W-XX is not always thinner than a 5W-XX.
The 0W is merely a very low temperature qualification and you can't assume that a 0W will be thinner at some higher, although still cold temperature.
A quality oil in either grade should work well at the lowest temperatures you're expecting.

 

[Bluestream]

I saw this more than once last winter...this was taken after the sun had been out for a few hours...My 16 year old Explorer with 290K started up, but made some nasty noises till the chain tensioners took pressure

 

[ram_man]

I've thought about it and read some uoa info. Seems like a lot of reports over 7500 miles seem to have higher wear numbers ect.
realistically I'd like to change my oil at either 5,000 or 7500
If I do 5,000 I can rotate every other time.
My normal drive to work is 20 miles 17 of it is hwy 70mph speed limit realistically I'm usually doing 75-80mph.
I often carry the car close to redline when driving spirited. My assumption is the olm would go off at 8000 that's based on what it's decrease rate is currently. I have no interest in pushing the oil to its limit I'm ok with using 70% or so of its life . My goals are the lowest wear reasonably attainable and a clean engine.
With my habits and preferred interval would I be able to meet my goals with a regular conventional oil? Maybe a syn blend of some sort or should I use a synthetic. I want a clean engine with low wear and nice quiet operation. Temps rarely ever go below -10 and are usually above 0 highs in the summer average 85-95 but can hit 110 in extreme cases. I appreciate everyone insight.

 

[The_Eric]

How are you defining high wear over 7500 miles?

 

[Oregoonian]

A syn-blend would be my choice.....Motorcraft or Penzoil Gold.... in 5w20. Both can be found at WalMart.

 

[ram_man]

Seen several of various vehicle and oils where the metals were above average for the oci.

 

[The_Eric]

Who's average? What wear metals?

 

[ram_man]

I just looked through the uoa section. Some long oci looked fantastic but plenty were only ok and showed higher wear on metal likes iron and al. It's a known fact the longer the oci the more wear is incurred. I just prefer to not do extended drains I'd rather go between 5,000-7500 and be happy.

 

[The_Eric]

It's a known fact that iron tends to track with mileage, so the higher the mileage, the higher the iron count. The rest of the wear metals will generally accumulate at a faster rate for a while, then much slower. Don't fool yourself into thinking that you'll get uber low wear metals or wear rates by going with shorter drains.

If you're bent on shorter drains then there was really no sense in asking here. My only advice is to use whatever oil is cheapest and has Chrysler's approval. Any APPROVED oil will suffice here.

 

[ram_man]

I don't think up to 7500 miles is really that short of a drain interval lol seems average to me

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: ram_man
I just looked through the uoa section. Some long oci looked fantastic but plenty were only ok and showed higher wear on metal likes iron and al. It's a known fact the longer the oci the more wear is incurred. I just prefer to not do extended drains I'd rather go between 5,000-7500 and be happy.


Then do it, OK?