New mobil 1 extended performance pds

[Slow Car Sport Mode]

As much as we all LOVE to look down our noses at “subpar” oils, the quality of the standards these days pretty much guarantees that if the oil actually meets the required certification, regardless the oil used, there will be no statistical difference in wear. Single engines can “compare” to macro data trends, but the reality is that maintenance frequency and air/oil filtration far outweigh the oil itself in predicting the length of an engine’s life.

We can chase all kinds of bougie or boutique oils but in reality, ~95% of properly maintained engines of a given type will all end up around the same lifespan regardless of the oil used. Confirmation bias is a B (ad habit ).

My engine (EJ) seized last month. Seized. Down the block from my house. Pinhole leak in that stupid hose above the thermostat and lower hose that's either an ATF cooler line or, more likely, a Water Pump Bypass (?? Subaru, explain.) OK so temp gauge pegged and engine shut off by itself.

I was able to immediately restart it, blast the heater, use paper towels and put holders (oven glove would have worked too) and unsafely open the cap and vent the steam.

Someone I speak with mentioned that my high quality PCMO (might have been HPL) is a big part of why I was able to avoid catastrophic damage, versus a "lesser quality" oil.

I am an oil snob and I'm presently using Mobil 1

My favorite is Schaeffer oil,used it for years. My second choice is Torco. I jumped on the HPL bandwagon just last week.

I think you made a great choice there.

I want to eventually have enough HPL on hand that I dont need to visit the store to buy either Mobil 1, Supertech or anything else.. Baselining.

There is a benefit to the best quality oil.

It does cost more to buy.

See how much crud came out of @wwillson vehicle after using the "meets the spec" oils which yeah are probably fine, says something about the ability of HPL as does my experience.... I will indicate in the flow of filters mailed to @53' Stude when HPL EC or PCMO has been introduced as a reference point.

 

[buster]

Boutique oils are a shot in the dark. Very few are worth it. Niche products with hype.

 

[Foxtrot08]

Additionally I find it interesting that one brand gets singled out in some of the most ridiculous comparisons …
Endless SDS postings from that company - where’s all the others ?

I’ve said this before in other conversations:

Mobil 1 today, is the bar that all other oils must pass. It’s not that Mobil 1 is particularly a great oil, nor is it bad. But it’s pretty much “the standard” other oils must meet or exceed.

This has a few pros and cons:
1. Mobil naturally sells a lot of it, because it is the standard. (Pro)

2. Mobil isn’t super creative with the formulation, nor do they rapidly change/advance it. (Con)

People expect it to be something it’s not, because the amount of marketing and momentum it has going for it. In the scheme of things, the PCEO market is also small, so it’s the biggest fish in a little sea.

 

[PimTac]

“My engine (EJ) seized last month. Seized. Down the block from my house. Pinhole leak in that stupid hose above the thermostat and lower hose that's either an ATF cooler line or, more likely, a Water Pump Bypass (?? Subaru, explain.) OK so temp gauge pegged and engine shut off by itself.”

“I was able to immediately restart it,”



Maybe I’m getting old but I thought that when an engine seized up that was it. Done for. Kaput.

 

[4WD]

I’ve said this before in other conversations:

Mobil 1 today, is the bar that all other oils must pass. It’s not that Mobil 1 is particularly a great oil, nor is it bad. But it’s pretty much “the standard” other oils must meet or exceed.

This has a few pros and cons:
1. Mobil naturally sells a lot of it, because it is the standard. (Pro)

2. Mobil isn’t super creative with the formulation, nor do they rapidly change/advance it. (Con)

People expect it to be something it’s not, because the amount of marketing and momentum it has going for it. In the scheme of things, the PCEO market is also small, so it’s the biggest fish in a little sea.

As a scientist recently posted - they don’t always have to regroup to meet the next standard. You know it’s not their place in the PVL price wars to produce extreme lubricants - (people are paying some serious coin here for HPL) …
As Grp3’s continue to phase out lower stocks they’ve taken out “upper class” stocks along the way …
The Mobil industrial lubricant side is where mPAO’s and esters rule when needed …
PVL can do fine on Grp3 in a solid formulation …

 

[4WD]

“My engine (EJ) seized last month. Seized. Down the block from my house. Pinhole leak in that stupid hose above the thermostat and lower hose that's either an ATF cooler line or, more likely, a Water Pump Bypass (?? Subaru, explain.) OK so temp gauge pegged and engine shut off by itself.”

“I was able to immediately restart it,”



Maybe I’m getting old but I thought that when an engine seized up that was it. Done for. Kaput.

Pseudo seized

 

[Foxtrot08]

As a scientist recently posted - they don’t always have to regroup to meet the next standard. You know it’s not their place in the PVL price wars to produce extreme lubricants - (people are paying some serious coin here for HPL) …
As Grp3’s continue to phase out lower stocks they’ve taken out “upper class” stocks along the way …
The Mobil industrial lubricant side is where mPAO’s and esters rule when needed …

It helps when they enjoy a seat at the table to write the next standard as well. So they can pre plan well before any ILMA. I was personally part of the PC11 development. And majors had it down years before CK4 came out.

That being said, Mobil industrial is another conversation. It’s not all cheery for them.

 

[buster]

I’ve said this before in other conversations:

Mobil 1 today, is the bar that all other oils must pass. It’s not that Mobil 1 is particularly a great oil, nor is it bad. But it’s pretty much “the standard” other oils must meet or exceed.

This has a few pros and cons:
1. Mobil naturally sells a lot of it, because it is the standard. (Pro)

2. Mobil isn’t super creative with the formulation, nor do they rapidly change/advance it. (Con)

People expect it to be something it’s not, because the amount of marketing and momentum it has going for it. In the scheme of things, the PCEO market is also small, so it’s the biggest fish in a little sea.

I'm not sure how you came to 2. What I've seen over the years is others "following" what Mobil was doing.

For example, in early 2000's Mobil went to a higher Ca based formulation while Amsoil was using mostly Mg. Over time the Ca levels were lowered (SA). Amsoil used high Ca up until around 2015. The higher Ca worked well but LSPI reared its head. Around 2012 Mobil switched to a mostly Mg based formulation due to LSPI issues. They were alone at that time in using this blend. Years later, Driven, Amsoil etc. all switched to the same Mg/Ca based formulation due to LSPI issues. Redline has stuck with a formulation that looks like it's from 1997. Driven thought they did something miraculous with their GDI oils claiming they were so special when in reality they were anything but. This was in 2016 or so. Behind the curve a bit?

I've seen nothing from other blenders that suggest they are more creative. In fact, it appears to be the opposite. I would also add why change something when it already meets exceed the standards and future standards?

Please explain how creativity is part of this process.

"Many Mobil 1 motor oils met the API SP performance standard before the licensed start date, making those full synthetic oils more than 10 years ahead of their time for providing protection against LSPI."

Low-speed pre-ignition engine protection | Mobil™ Motor Oils

Discover how Mobil 1™ motor oils can help protect your engine against the effects of low-speed pre-ignition (LSPI).

www.mobil.com

 

[OVERKILL]

PP & FP above are D97 & D92 for both.

Thanks for Checking, they tend to flip-flop on the FP testing protocol choice.

 

[OVERKILL]

“My engine (EJ) seized last month. Seized. Down the block from my house. Pinhole leak in that stupid hose above the thermostat and lower hose that's either an ATF cooler line or, more likely, a Water Pump Bypass (?? Subaru, explain.) OK so temp gauge pegged and engine shut off by itself.”

“I was able to immediately restart it,”



Maybe I’m getting old but I thought that when an engine seized up that was it. Done for. Kaput.

It sounds like his engine overheated, not seized. If it seized, it wouldn't have started back up.

 

[buster]

Reading Driven's marketing material is quite funny too. They discovered something that was already known 5 years prior?

"Driven’s DI Synthetic Motor Oils are ahead of the curve when it comes to the newest API SN Plus & SP Engine Oil specs."

^that is complete BS. They were LATE in moving to that chemistry.

Direct Injection Oil - Driven Racing Oil

Our direct injection oil is engineered to equip direct injection engines with the motor oil they need for optimal performance. Shop great deals here.

drivenracingoil.com

 

[Slow Car Sport Mode]

“My engine (EJ) seized last month. Seized. Down the block from my house. Pinhole leak in that stupid hose above the thermostat and lower hose that's either an ATF cooler line or, more likely, a Water Pump Bypass (?? Subaru, explain.) OK so temp gauge pegged and engine shut off by itself.”

“I was able to immediately restart it,”



Maybe I’m getting old but I thought that when an engine seized up that was it. Done for. Kaput.

Person I ran that by said that the reason it stalled out under it's own power was that something "seized" to stop the rotation, is why I mentioned that in that way.

Starting it right back up avoided staying seized

 

[buster]

2011 Mobil 1 is already addressing LSPI.

Mobil 1 5W-30 EP, SN Rated with TBN and TAN

Here's a VOA of another Mobil 1 SN rated product - this time it's Mobil 1 5W-30 EP SN. Note that the additive package has changed, but very similar to Mobil 1 0W-20 SN, in that it uses a combination of Calcium and Magnesium for detergent additives. I am also shocked at the high TAN! TBN also...

bobistheoilguy.com

2017 Driven thinks they discovered something.

 

[Trav]

My engine (EJ) seized last month. Seized. Down the block from my house. Pinhole leak in that stupid hose above the thermostat and lower hose that's either an ATF cooler line or, more likely, a Water Pump Bypass (?? Subaru, explain.) OK so temp gauge pegged and engine shut off by itself.

I was able to immediately restart it, blast the heater, use paper towels and put holders (oven glove would have worked too) and unsafely open the cap and vent the steam.

Someone I speak with mentioned that my high quality PCMO (might have been HPL) is a big part of why I was able to avoid catastrophic damage, versus a "lesser quality" oil.

I am an oil snob and I'm presently using Mobil 1

I think you made a great choice there.

I want to eventually have enough HPL on hand that I dont need to visit the store to buy either Mobil 1, Supertech or anything else.. Baselining.

There is a benefit to the best quality oil.

It does cost more to buy.

See how much crud came out of @wwillson vehicle after using the "meets the spec" oils which yeah are probably fine, says something about the ability of HPL as does my experience.... I will indicate in the flow of filters mailed to @53' Stude when HPL EC or PCMO has been introduced as a reference point.

Look for head gaskets in the near future. These engines (any engine but these in particular) do not tolerate well any sort of overheating event.

 

[buster]

Mobil 1 VOA from 2005. Looks like Redline today LOL.

 

[Foxtrot08]

I'm not sure how you came to 2. What I've seen over the years is others "following" what Mobil was doing.

For example, in early 2000's Mobil went to a higher Ca based formulation while Amsoil was using mostly Mg. Over time the Ca levels were lowered (SA). Amsoil used high Ca up until around 2015. The higher Ca worked well but LSPI reared its head. Around 2012 Mobil switched to a mostly Mg based formulation due to LSPI issues. They were alone at that time in using this blend. Years later, Driven, Amsoil etc. all switched to the same Mg/Ca based formulation due to LSPI issues. Redline has stuck with a formulation that looks like it's from 1997. Driven thought they did something miraculous with their GDI oils claiming they were so special when in reality they were anything but. This was in 2016 or so. Behind the curve a bit?

I've seen nothing from other blenders that suggest they are more creative. In fact, it appears to be the opposite. I would also add why change something when it already meets exceed the standards and future standards?

Please explain how creativity is part of this process.

I would also add that there is a reason why competitors often compare their oils to Mobil 1 other than it being just the market leader - it's actually very good.

"Many Mobil 1 motor oils met the API SP performance standard before the licensed start date, making those full synthetic oils more than 10 years ahead of their time for providing protection against LSPI."

Low-speed pre-ignition engine protection | Mobil™ Motor Oils

Discover how Mobil 1™ motor oils can help protect your engine against the effects of low-speed pre-ignition (LSPI).

www.mobil.com

Unless your comparing redline's parent company, P66 to Mobil, there is no comparison between Redline and Mobil. As they don't share the same market place. Amsoil vs Mobil also, don't really share the same market place. Comparing Boutique oils to Mobil One isn't really an apples to apples comparison, as you're comparing essentially ILMA's to a major.

So it would be Mobil vs SOPUS vs P66 vs BP/Castrol, essentially in the US.

So let's look at some 'creativity' - mostly marketing for PCEO, as it really in the scheme of things matters little.

Mobil vs SOPUS - Specifically Pennzoil platinum. Creative marketing with the usage of GTL base stocks. Low Noack, over all good formulation. They evolve it through the typical SOPUS style of more convoluted naming sequences, with little easy to understand explanation of what the differences are between them.

Mobil vs P66 - Kendall GT-1 MAX - the previous formulations had a utilization of Ti in their formulation. They had to dial it back to a more 'conventional' formulation with the LiquidTek due to costs, however it was something fun to utilize.

- P66 Shield products have been very tame in their marketing, much like Mobil's because of their OEM utilization. While using a secondary brand to be more creative.'

Mobil vs Castrol - Still utilizes Ti add packs.

Creativity is part of the process in terms of on the shelf marketing. Mobil 1 is clearly trying to come up with the 'gotcha' that the other brands have. Mobil is missing it a bit, they did try it with the extended performance, with their "Triple action+" formulation. But again, still a bit dated in terms of marketing. They could play around with advertising their base oils - like SOPUS/Pennzoil. They're very creative in their B2B marketing of their base stocks.

As for the Ca/Mg/LSPI - this was a cost savings, not a 'performance' thing. Lowering the amount of calcium in the additive package, made the additive package cheaper. Thus, the cost of oil cheaper. Mobil just decided to go cheaper, earlier. Thus why you saw a price reduction from SN to SN+ products. IIRC, it was about 7 CPG.

I didn't say Mobil 1 was bad, I said it was the bar, which is pretty good (as you pointed out) to be the industry standard. However, if you use and of the 4 I listed above, your B10 on your engine life will probably be statistically the same.

 

[PimTac]

Person I ran that by said that the reason it stalled out under it's own power was that something "seized" to stop the rotation, is why I mentioned that in that way.

Starting it right back up avoided staying seized

I wonder if the computer killed the engine due to overheating?

 

[4WD]

Unless your comparing redline's parent company, P66 to Mobil, there is no comparison between Redline and Mobil. As they don't share the same market place. Amsoil vs Mobil also, don't really share the same market place. Comparing Boutique oils to Mobil One isn't really an apples to apples comparison, as you're comparing essentially ILMA's to a major.

So it would be Mobil vs SOPUS vs P66 vs BP/Castrol, essentially in the US.

So let's look at some 'creativity' - mostly marketing for PCEO, as it really in the scheme of things matters little.

Mobil vs SOPUS - Specifically Pennzoil platinum. Creative marketing with the usage of GTL base stocks. Low Noack, over all good formulation. They evolve it through the typical SOPUS style of more convoluted naming sequences, with little easy to understand explanation of what the differences are between them.

Mobil vs P66 - Kendall GT-1 MAX - the previous formulations had a utilization of Ti in their formulation. They had to dial it back to a more 'conventional' formulation with the LiquidTek due to costs, however it was something fun to utilize.

- P66 Shield products have been very tame in their marketing, much like Mobil's because of their OEM utilization. While using a secondary brand to be more creative.'

Mobil vs Castrol - Still utilizes Ti add packs.

Creativity is part of the process in terms of on the shelf marketing. Mobil 1 is clearly trying to come up with the 'gotcha' that the other brands have. Mobil is missing it a bit, they did try it with the extended performance, with their "Triple action+" formulation. But again, still a bit dated in terms of marketing. They could play around with advertising their base oils - like SOPUS/Pennzoil. They're very creative in their B2B marketing of their base stocks.

As for the Ca/Mg/LSPI - this was a cost savings, not a 'performance' thing. Lowering the amount of calcium in the additive package, made the additive package cheaper. Thus, the cost of oil cheaper. Mobil just decided to go cheaper, earlier. Thus why you saw a price reduction from SN to SN+ products. IIRC, it was about 7 CPG.

I didn't say Mobil 1 was bad, I said it was the bar, which is pretty good (as you pointed out) to be the industry standard. However, if you use and of the 4 I listed above, your B10 on your engine life will probably be statistically the same.

Shell built Pearl and needs to move those gallons (your terms) …
XOM stayed with LNG even though they have over 3000 GTL patents …
LNG is a great business to be in right now …

 

[Addicted2jeepz]

Person I ran that by said that the reason it stalled out under it's own power was that something "seized" to stop the rotation, is why I mentioned that in that way.

Starting it right back up avoided staying seized

The computer shut the engine down to avoid a more serious issue, it didn't seize and then unseize...

 

[Foxtrot08]

Shell built Pearl and needs to move those gallons (your terms) …
XOM stayed with LNG even though they have over 3000 GTL patents …
LNG is a great business to be in right now …

Yep, RDS is very concerned about moving the Pearl gallons. Which is why they made full synthetic everything... Including a FS 15w40.

That being said, it has hurt them in other ways. But that's a different conversation.