Originally Posted By: Lolvoguy
Originally Posted By: FutureDoc
Lexus is another choice but Toyota is trying to convince folks that a harsh ride = sporty. They kinda ruined some of their cars. Still, not bad but not as good as they used to be.
Dunno if I agree with ya Doc,
The way I see it, is that Toyota is simply offering everyone what they want. Most buyers want something that "feels" more European and part of that experience is a getting more feedback for what the wheels/suspension are doing.
Everyone else in the segments are doing this, so why not Toyota
This is similar to Volvo in the early 90's who was building reliable, tough, comfortable RWD cars for the N. American market (the 240, 740, 940 etc.). To stay competitive against similar cars in their respective segments such as the Accord, Camry etc. Volvo needed to introduce a FWD car to their lineup, they did this with the 850 series. It turned many diehard Volvo customers away from Volvo (for good reason, as they mostly were cross shopping them against other RWD Euro brands such as MB, BMW etc.).
I agree with the thinking behind Lexus (going after "sporty demands" in the lux market) but it was not executed very well. That is my issue. They have been lost for the last 5 years and each recent update has made thing worse. They are chasing the "sporty" feel but there is a difference between sporty and harsh that Toyota missed. A lot of the European offerings still have "sport" but mask it well. For example both Audi and BMW have been moving towards a softer ride, BMW especially. So the market wants a "sporty" image but not necessarily a harsh ride. Lexus is stuck because they sacrificed a very soft ride depending on the model but did not quite get any true handling abilities out of it. Worse, Lexus has been hardening their "lease specials" rather than focusing on making their F brand a true performer. I simply do not know what Lexus is trying to do because the F line is too soft and the leasing models are becoming to harsh.
Volvo's issue was two fold (Uncle has been driving Volvos and only Volvos for decades and I often bummed the 240 or 740 during the summer when visiting). One, they were not as competitive (unable) at offering a luxury vehicle as the Germans but the cost of going up-market limited their customer pool as I think that a 80s Volvo buyer was anti-luxury to a point. Volvo lost that I call the current "Subaru buyer" ... someone that can often buy "more car" but is more restrained in their buying options. Double badness was that Ford did not doing anything for them beyond the C30 (aka a better Mazda3 two-door). Now, and only because the luxury market is extremely fickle with almost no owner loyalty, Volvo is back on market with Chinese money but I don't know how long that will last. Their interiors will sell the current generation but I dont know if they can keep it up.
