MOTUL HYBRID 0W-8 VOA or UOA?

[lowon]

Litterally throw this at them and go home, done deal. It will NEVER come to this anyway, total hypothetical case.

View attachment 244024

You do realize it's not easy to claim warranty right? Dealerships are always hesitant to just repair things right away because they don't want to get in trouble with the corporate for warranty abuse. So it's always a hassle getting warranty work done.


For those of you guys acting super tough saying customers have so much power and rights (which they technically do, but more often than not big companies literally don't care and will abuse the individual customer knowing most people won't sue because of the cost), do you have any experience claiming warranty? Because I do, and I have A LOT OF EXPERIENCE doing so and not one single time was it easy. Every single time it's either "the issue is not reproducible, or you're it's normal" etc and you have to go through an endless battle tying to document and explain to them that the issue does exist. Most of the time they're not afraid to tell you to kick rocks. It's even worse with engine issues, because it's immediately pin pointed to abuse.

I know the law says the dealer has to prove that the thing you did isn't the reason for failure, but 90% of the time it's easy for them to make up some bs reason and deny your warranty - look at the gr86. Then it's up to you to fight and that's the hard part, because using a multi-billion dollar company as a singular individual is asking to lose.

 

[lowon]

Incorrect. It’s actually the state that determines the consumers right. The whole point of your right to arbitration is because the legal system knows the “oe” can out spend the consumer. It’s to help the consumer. Certain states are even more consumer friendly like California. In fact the “oe” cannot fight the ruling of the arbitrators but the consumer can. Again I’ve been involved with the process. It usually includes the tech, service manager or foreman and the oe regional warranty rep. Dealers/oe rarely win and will avoid arbitration if possible.

You do realize I'm Canadian right? We don't have states here, and the magneson moss law is also American only.

 

[DirectRejection]

Hey everyone,

I was searching around BITOG and other toyota/lexus forums looking to see if anyone has some UOA or VOAs regarding motul's hybrid 0w-8 oil and couldn't find anything. So I decided to make this thread in case anyone has some UOA's or VOA's that they have stumbled upon for this oil that I haven't seen yet. Or if anyone has some data on the additive package in this oil.

The reason why I am asking is because my new 2025 lexus hybrid requires 0W-8 oil, and it's time for an oil change (and I don't want to go with 0W-16 or anything else to avoid the potential of voiding my warranty). I did look at TGMO 0W-8, but it would be ~$22/bottle locally, and I would need 5 bottles for an oil change. So I'd prefer to go aftermarket given the aftermarket oil is good quality of course.

Also here in Canada we don't have the mobil1 offerings readily availabe at the store yet (motul is indeed available at lordco), and HPL is going to be too expensive to import and at that point I'd probably just stick with toyota genuine stuff.


Anyways thanks for the help!

2019 Lexus UX 250h F-Sport.
M20A-FXS.
150k miles.
Oil used:
-LGMO 0W16.
-HPL HDEO 0W16.
~10k mile OCIs.

2022 Toyota Corolla Cross.
M20A-FXS.
150k miles.
Oil used:
HPL PP 0W8.
30k mile OCIs

2024 Toyota Corolla Cross Hybrid.
M20A-FXS.
Oil used:
HPL PP 0W8.
21k vehicle miles.

Let's get real.
There is not going to be any warranty claim on a
2025 Lexus UX 300h.

Use a quality 0W8 ie M1, with 10k km OCI.
And with highest confidence.
The rest of this is frankly superfluous argumentation.
Good luck.

 

[lowon]

2019 Lexus UX 250h F-Sport.
M20A-FXS.
150k miles.
Oil used:
-LGMO 0W16.
-HPL HDEO 0W16.
~10k mile OCIs.

2022 Toyota Corolla Cross.
M20A-FXS.
150k miles.
Oil used:
HPL PP 0W8.
30k mile OCIs

2024 Toyota Corolla Cross Hybrid.
M20A-FXS.
Oil used:
HPL PP 0W8.
21k vehicle miles.

Let's get real.
There is not going to be any warranty claim on a
2025 Lexus UX 300h.

Use a quality 0W8 ie M1, with 10k km OCI.
And with highest confidence.
The rest of this is frankly superfluous argumentation.
Good luck.

Thanks, and yeah let's hope in never have to use the warranty. I don't have mobil1 here but I'll assume motul is just as good, typically with the 40 weight stuff on my m2 it seems to be excellent.

Just curious, was it a mistake or did you actually mean to write 30k mile oci on the Corolla cross? Because that's nuts.

 

[Glenda W.]

You do realize I'm Canadian right? We don't have states here, and the magneson moss law is also American only.

I did not. I apologize and don’t know your rights in Canada. My experience is only in the US.

 

[lowon]

I did not. I apologize and don’t know your rights in Canada. My experience is only in the US.

No worries, but it does suck because we lack a lot of the excellent consumer protections found in the US. I don't even think all of Canada has lemon laws (I think it's only Quebec)... So you can see how some of us can potentially get absolutely shafted. So I try not to eff about with warranty so I don't have to deal with it. Warranty is always a stressful time for me, but what can you do it sucks to suck.

 

[DirectRejection]

Thanks, and yeah let's hope in never have to use the warranty. I don't have mobil1 here but I'll assume motul is just as good, typically with the 40 weight stuff on my m2 it seems to be excellent.

Just curious, was it a mistake or did you actually mean to write 30k mile oci on the Corolla cross? Because that's nuts.

I was thinking M1 would be cheaper, but Motul would be excellent too.

Knowledge, confidence and driving conditions led me to HPL.

I only started going out to 30k mile OCIs, after successive, gradually extended OCIs.

 

[lowon]

I was thinking M1 would be cheaper, but Motul would be excellent too.

Knowledge, confidence and driving conditions led me to HPL.

I only started going out to 30k mile OCIs, after successive, gradually extended OCIs.

Holy moly that's nuts, glad it's working out well for you.

M1 would be cheaper but it's not available here yet.

 

[kschachn]

I realize that a higher hths offers more protection, there's a reason why I use 5w40 instead of 0w30 after the warranty period on my m2 that I track. But to avoid warranty issues I want to keep things done by the book for my brand Lexus.

You do realize the only approved grade in NA is jaso glv-1 right? So 0w-8 or 0w-16

It's not approved. It is recommended.

 

[kschachn]

Post here what the warranty says. If it does say something such as "You must use 0W-8 grade to preserve warranty. Any other grade will invalidate you new-car warranty" then I will change my mind.

You are going on and on about warranty requiring a specific grade but no one has ever posted language from their manual stating that. Yours would be the first.

 

[kschachn]

Incorrect, the dealer actually has 0w-8 in stock so they'll use what is specified by Toyota. Dealers aren't going to risk dealer status by doing random crap, they're an extension of the OEM so they have to do things by the book.

Not all. Many dealers do not use what is listed in the book. Some like my VW dealership use a different approval if you ask. I asked for 504 00 oil instead of 508 00 for the free changes and they did. They do not have to "do things by the book", same as they do not have to use manufacturer branded supplies.

 

[lowon]

Post here what the warranty says. If it does say something such as "You must use 0W-8 grade to preserve warranty. Any other grade will invalidate you new-car warranty" then I will change my mind.

You are going on and on about warranty requiring a specific grade but no one has ever posted language from their manual stating that. Yours would be the first.

Post #30 https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/motul-hybrid-0w-8-voa-or-uoa.387948/page-2#post-7031153

Read the thread before you chime in next time...


Clearly if you go outside of the manufacturer's requirements they're not going to warranty it. By your logic you can run 10w60 and when the engine inevitability fails from lubrication issues you expect Toyota to warranty it.

You do realize warranty is to cover the vehicle operating and maintained as it was intended by Toyota. The way you interpret it, if the manual doesn't state something then it doesn't count. By that ridiculous argument I could run gallium on the aluminum block and cause it to fail and Toyota would have to replace it because there's nothing about gallium in the manual...

 

[lowon]

Yeah I'm done here, this thread is pretty useless.

 

[Kalle.J]

Clearly if you go outside of the manufacturer's Toyota Corp. US requirements they're not going to warranty it. By your logic you can run 10w60 and when the engine inevitability fails from lubrication issues you expect Toyota to warranty it.

You do realize warranty is to cover the vehicle operating and maintained as it was WISHED by Toyota Corp. US . The way you interpret it, if the manual doesn't state something then it doesn't count. By that ridiculous argument I could run gallium on the aluminum block and cause it to fail and Toyota would have to replace it because there's nothing about gallium in the manual...

Fixed the text for you.

 

[IndyIan]

You do realize it's not easy to claim warranty right? Dealerships are always hesitant to just repair things right away because they don't want to get in trouble with the corporate for warranty abuse. So it's always a hassle getting warranty work done.


For those of you guys acting super tough saying customers have so much power and rights (which they technically do, but more often than not big companies literally don't care and will abuse the individual customer knowing most people won't sue because of the cost), do you have any experience claiming warranty? Because I do, and I have A LOT OF EXPERIENCE doing so and not one single time was it easy. Every single time it's either "the issue is not reproducible, or you're it's normal" etc and you have to go through an endless battle tying to document and explain to them that the issue does exist. Most of the time they're not afraid to tell you to kick rocks. It's even worse with engine issues, because it's immediately pin pointed to abuse.

I know the law says the dealer has to prove that the thing you did isn't the reason for failure, but 90% of the time it's easy for them to make up some bs reason and deny your warranty - look at the gr86. Then it's up to you to fight and that's the hard part, because using a multi-billion dollar company as a singular individual is asking to lose.

It never hurts to ask the service manager, at my Subaru dealer they were quite willing to put 5W30 syn in my car, where 0W20 is recommended(unless its not available, then 5W30 is fine).
Your service manager is the one that is going to talk to the toyota rep about warranty, and if they are cool with 0W16, they will say whatever the toyota rep needs to hear if he asks about oil changes.
If they balk, then run the 0W8, I doubt a hybrid actually lugs(high throttle opening at 12-1500 rpm) very often if at all? It won't be worn much in the relatively short warranty period, then you can run whatever you want.

 

[Nesterenko]

Yeah I'm done here, this thread is pretty useless.

You do not have to use 0W8 or whatever grade.
It's a recommendation only. Also, it seems like from what your manual says that they're more concerned about the Winter rating (look at the text you circled) than they are about the actual grade, which is ridiculous.
Dealerships don't always use the correct oil, they use whatever bulk they have on hand 0W8 required ends up being 0W16 or even 0W20.
Half the time they don't stick to what's recommended in their own manual.

 

[kschachn]

Post #30 https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/motul-hybrid-0w-8-voa-or-uoa.387948/page-2#post-7031153

Read the thread before you chime in next time...


Clearly if you go outside of the manufacturer's requirements they're not going to warranty it. By your logic you can run 10w60 and when the engine inevitability fails from lubrication issues you expect Toyota to warranty it.

You do realize warranty is to cover the vehicle operating and maintained as it was intended by Toyota. The way you interpret it, if the manual doesn't state something then it doesn't count. By that ridiculous argument I could run gallium on the aluminum block and cause it to fail and Toyota would have to replace it because there's nothing about gallium in the manual...

Clearly you are not correct. Yes you could use a 60-grade. As long as the winter rating is appropriate for the starting temperature then the engine will not inevitably fail from a lubrication issue. Please learn some basics about how oil lubricates an engine before you continue to post nonsense such as the gallium comment. You're thrashing at this point.

 

[AL-Shooey]

That's not what the new 2025 Lexus owners manuals says. Previous manuals yes, but not the new ones. The new owners manual has strong wording that 0w-8 is required, and 0w-16 is only for temporary use and must be replaced with 0w-8 immediately whenever possible.

So using anything but 0w-8 puts you at risk of warranty denial, especially with how Toyota has been handling recent warranty claims with the gr86 and rtv issues - I don't want to risk it. So I'd prefer to get more data on 0w-8 oils to pick the best option.

That is correct. Already for a few years It is like this. However, in Europe, some Toyota workshops are telling us otherwise because they buy bulk oil, usually 0w-20 and flog that because they get it cheaper and can make more money. A Ripoff.
Factory Service Manual for Various 22 to 24 Hybrids, state 0W-8 JASO GLV1, possibly also 0W-16, -20, 5W-20, 5W-30 and 10W-40. Users manual recommend 0W-8 as fitted from Factory, 0W-16 o 0W-20 when 0W-8 not available. But must revert to 0W-8 at next oil change. I always stick to Recommended. As 0w-8 is very thin and later maybe I will change my Yaris Cross into 0W-16. Remember, Toyota some Toyota Hybrid Engines run at lower Oil Temperatures. Mostly 85 Max. Because they use Atkinson type engines. Not Otto. Check Specs.

 

[Bryanccfshr]

For those who haven’t driven the newest generation Toyota hybrids, the engine runs less, even at highway speeds. Many times at 70 mph it will run quite a bit in Ev mode at 65 it runs 50-50 on my morning commute. Duty cycle is much different. The dealer put 0w8 in the cross hybrid las oil change(0w16 stickers) think it is appropriate for my commute and the season.

FYI i run m1 0w40 in my Tacoma and have long term because it seems appropriate for the use.

 

[drugrep]

Hey everyone,

I was searching around BITOG and other toyota/lexus forums looking to see if anyone has some UOA or VOAs regarding motul's hybrid 0w-8 oil and couldn't find anything. So I decided to make this thread in case anyone has some UOA's or VOA's that they have stumbled upon for this oil that I haven't seen yet. Or if anyone has some data on the additive package in this oil.

The reason why I am asking is because my new 2025 lexus hybrid requires 0W-8 oil, and it's time for an oil change (and I don't want to go with 0W-16 or anything else to avoid the potential of voiding my warranty). I did look at TGMO 0W-8, but it would be ~$22/bottle locally, and I would need 5 bottles for an oil change. So I'd prefer to go aftermarket given the aftermarket oil is good quality of course.

Also here in Canada we don't have the mobil1 offerings readily availabe at the store yet (motul is indeed available at lordco), and HPL is going to be too expensive to import and at that point I'd probably just stick with toyota genuine stuff.


Anyways thanks for the help!

I have a 2024 Lexus ES 350 and I found out that the genuine Toyota oil has a very high Moly content of 787ppm according to:

http://pqiadata.org/Toyota_0W20.html

My suspicion is that the 0W-8 genuine Toyota oil will also have a high content. The website I posted hasn’t tested the 0W-8.

For my Lexus, I am sticking to the genuine Toyota oil because I have found no other oil that contains that high of Moly content. I am actually using the Toyota oil in the two Hondas we have that also require 0W-20.

With the money that you spent on that vehicle, I would search the Internet for the best price on genuine Toyota oil. I haven’t read all six pages of this thread, so someone else may have already mentioned this.

People will tell you if it meets the spec it’s okay but I don’t know enough to trust that advice. There are plenty of oils that meet the spec for my car, but they don’t have the Moly content. If you still want to look for something good and less expensive, this is what I would suggest. I use an oil from this brand in my wife’s Mercedes.

https://www.liqui-moly.com/en/us/special-tec-aa-sae-0w-8-p005465.html#22279

Again, I did not read all the pages to this thread, and I’m no expert AT ALL so someone may have given better advice than me.