Midsize truck shopping

[hemioiler]

Trucks stick around a long time in the West. Lots of 20 and 30+ year old trucks still on the road.
My titan is 20 years old now.

I'm saying: compare a 2020 ridgeline (or whatever) to a 2020 half ton. The half ton will always out tow the ridgline, no matter what engine is in there; because the engine is only piece of the puzzle, the rest of the truck is just so much better for towing. If you want to compare a 2020 ridgeline to a 30 year old half ton with saggy springs and rounded out bushings, knock yourself out, but it's not a useful comparison.

Tow rating on a half ton is more than engine and axle - but also engine and trans cooling, and brakes.

No, I mean a v6 half ton vs otherwise identical v8, the v6 only gets a lower tow rating (in Ram anyway) because of the lower power that the v6 produces; the rest of the truck is identical. The difference in GCWR for a Ram 1500 v6 with the 3.92 and a v8 with the 3.21 is < 1000 pounds.

In owning a boat shop and being a boat manufacturer for over a decade I've ridden and towed in just about everything made with my customers and friends , I can say from experience - no body on frame solid rear axle truck rides or handles as well as the IFS/IRS Ridgeline.

My old Grand Cherokee was as good a ride as any ridgeline, built on the mercedes SUV platform (unibody), and though in some areas the GC was different, more refined, my truck is still extremely pleasant just a little more "trucky". Though the suspension is stiffer, the half ton is bigger so I fit better in it, get less physically fatigued, and greatly prefer driving the truck over the GC for any amount of distance. In a few tight parking lots in the city, ok, the GC would win that contest. Towing? GC doesn't have a chance against my truck. My trailer would push that little GC all over the road.

The 2020 ridgeline owner's manual says this: "When towing a fixed-sided trailer (e.g., camper), do not exceed 55 mph (88 km/h). At higher speeds, the trailer may sway or affect vehicle handling."

I don't know any midsize that has that requirement, let alone a half ton. If I'm in a hurry on an empty freeway, I stop at 70 mph in my truck because that's reaching the limit of my trailer tires, the truck itself is still perfectly in control and has gobs of power left with no cooling issues.

And we haven't even begun to compare luxury or tech. No contest, a fully pimped out Ram/F150/GMC absolutely destroys the ridgeline in all these areas. Air suspension, massaging seats, giant pano roofs, massive infotainment screens, HID, cushy leather, "self driving" etc etc. The list is endless.

It's not my pick to tow or haul above its weight, but within its window I'll pick it over my three other choices and and every time.
Hauling a bale of hay or even a big block on a pallet is still truck work and its way better ride than a body on frame trucks

The half ton is always going to handle the weight much better than the little ridgeline. Longer wheel base, wider track, stiffer suspension, bigger brakes. Objectively speaking, the ridgline is worse when it comes to carrying cargo, it's not an opinion. Even if the payload is identical, the fact that the half ton has a much higher GVWR means it will handle the weight better. And a better metric is to use RAWR anyway, and the half ton has much beefier axles (6 studs, not 5 like the ridgeline), will take more abuse etc.

I'm well aware of where the thing falls down, and dont pretend its something its not and with two other truck and a suburban to chose from I can pick anything I want.

Great. You obviously prefer the smaller truck, but you definitely "pretend it's something its not" when it comes to hauling/towing, offroad performance etc. But I've said my peace and will move on, I'm not trying to trash your ride,

 

[LDB]

Speak of the devil. Mid-size RAM coming 2027.

https://www.motorauthority.com/news...ail&utm_term=0_fed581d99a-ca414c9585-55781788

 

[UncleDave]

I'm saying: compare a 2020 ridgeline (or whatever) to a 2020 half ton. The half ton will always out tow the ridgline, no matter what engine is in there; because the engine is only piece of the puzzle, the rest of the truck is just so much better for towing. If you want to compare a 2020 ridgeline to a 30 year old half ton with saggy springs and rounded out bushings, knock yourself out, but it's not a useful comparison.


No, I mean a v6 half ton vs otherwise identical v8, the v6 only gets a lower tow rating (in Ram anyway) because of the lower power that the v6 produces; the rest of the truck is identical. The difference in GCWR for a Ram 1500 v6 with the 3.92 and a v8 with the 3.21 is < 1000 pounds.



My old Grand Cherokee was as good a ride as any ridgeline, built on the mercedes SUV platform (unibody), and though in some areas the GC was different, more refined, my truck is still extremely pleasant just a little more "trucky". Though the suspension is stiffer, the half ton is bigger so I fit better in it, get less physically fatigued, and greatly prefer driving the truck over the GC for any amount of distance. In a few tight parking lots in the city, ok, the GC would win that contest. Towing? GC doesn't have a chance against my truck. My trailer would push that little GC all over the road.

The 2020 ridgeline owner's manual says this: "When towing a fixed-sided trailer (e.g., camper), do not exceed 55 mph (88 km/h). At higher speeds, the trailer may sway or affect vehicle handling."

I don't know any midsize that has that requirement, let alone a half ton. If I'm in a hurry on an empty freeway, I stop at 70 mph in my truck because that's reaching the limit of my trailer tires, the truck itself is still perfectly in control and has gobs of power left with no cooling issues.

And we haven't even begun to compare luxury or tech. No contest, a fully pimped out Ram/F150/GMC absolutely destroys the ridgeline in all these areas. Air suspension, massaging seats, giant pano roofs, massive infotainment screens, HID, cushy leather, "self driving" etc etc. The list is endless.



The half ton is always going to handle the weight much better than the little ridgeline. Longer wheel base, wider track, stiffer suspension, bigger brakes. Objectively speaking, the ridgline is worse when it comes to carrying cargo, it's not an opinion. Even if the payload is identical, the fact that the half ton has a much higher GVWR means it will handle the weight better. And a better metric is to use RAWR anyway, and the half ton has much beefier axles (6 studs, not 5 like the ridgeline), will take more abuse etc.



Great. You obviously prefer the smaller truck, but you definitely "pretend it's something its not" when it comes to hauling/towing, offroad performance etc. But I've said my peace and will move on, I'm not trying to trash your ride,

Ok you changed your stance quite a bit from "any" to a more reasonable grouping.

A Cherokee isnt at truck so it does't matter how well it rode.

I didn't see such a declaration run my 2017's manual although its interesting Ill go back and look.

Im going to agree to disagree a half ton is always a better truck for every job a guy will use a truck for -
Carry a sofa across town or a SBC/ BBC to and from a shop, 5 4x8 sheets of plywood, or a regular guy run to home depot .

I dont automatically prefer the smaller truck for every job.
I prefer to use the right size truck for the right job and it just so happens I and most guys do mid sized truck jobs as much or more than full size truck jobs.
Which truck would you prefer when solo and nothing on the hitch? How often does that happen?

Kind of like having 3 socket sets 1/4 3/8 and 1/2 inch. The set I grab the most is the 1/4 set.

 

[hemioiler]

Ok you changed your stance quite a bit from "any" to a more reasonable grouping.

No I didn't, you were choosing to interpret "any" as literally "any half ton you can find on the market from brand new to 50 year old rust bucket that still happens to have wheels on it". I don't think anybody would make that claim. A more reasonable interpretation would be comparing any ridgeline from 2010 to 2025 vs any halfton from 2010 to 2025, when both were brand new.

A Cherokee isnt at truck so it does't matter how well it rode.

A "grand cherokee" (not "cherokee") is literally the same type of platform as "ridgeline/pilot". A unibody SUV platform. Nice to hear you admit the ridgeline is "not a truck".

And BTW, a grand cherokee is rated to tow more than your ridgeline, at 7200 pounds.

I didn't see such a declaration run my 2017's manual although its interesting Ill go back and look.

Im going to agree to disagree a half ton is always a better truck for every job a guy will use a truck for -
Carry a sofa across town or a SBC/ BBC to and from a shop, 5 4x8 sheets of plywood, or a regular guy run to home depot .

I dont automatically prefer the smaller truck for every job.
I prefer to use the right size truck for the right job and it just so happens I and most guys do mid sized truck jobs as much or more than full size truck jobs.
Which truck would you prefer when solo and nothing on the hitch? How often does that happen?

I already mentioned my preference several times: my truck is equal part commuter truck and equal part towing rig, it tows a lot 3 seasons of the year and I drive it to the office or around town when just myself. No contest, the truck is a far better highway cruiser vs my old GC. Very cushy ride, huge interior, luxury, strong v8, etc etc. The only time I miss my GC is in very tight spots, the turning radius on the GC is impressive, beating out smaller cars, that thing would park anywhere. But the amount of times I am in spot like that is about once or twice a year, I usually look for large uncrowded parking spots as I like to avoid door dings from karens mindlessly swinging their buggies and packages about. Airport parking is a good example, its rougher parking a half ton though I always do it without issue.

 

[UncleDave]

No I didn't, you were choosing to interpret "any" as literally "any half ton you can find on the market from brand new to 50 year old rust bucket that still happens to have wheels on it". I don't think anybody would make that claim. A more reasonable interpretation would be comparing any ridgeline from 2010 to 2025 vs any halfton from 2010 to 2025, when both were brand new.


A "grand cherokee" (not "cherokee") is literally the same type of platform as "ridgeline/pilot". A unibody SUV platform. Nice to hear you admit the ridgeline is "not a truck".

And BTW, a grand cherokee is rated to tow more than your ridgeline, at 7200 pounds.


I already mentioned my preference several times: my truck is equal part commuter truck and equal part towing rig, it tows a lot 3 seasons of the year and I drive it to the office or around town when just myself. No contest, the truck is a far better highway cruiser vs my old GC. Very cushy ride, huge interior, luxury, strong v8, etc etc. The only time I miss my GC is in very tight spots, the turning radius on the GC is impressive, beating out smaller cars, that thing would park anywhere. But the amount of times I am in spot like that is about once or twice a year, I usually look for large uncrowded parking spots as I like to avoid door dings from karens mindlessly swinging their buggies and packages about. Airport parking is a good example, its rougher parking a half ton though I always do it without issue.

Ok you didn't cull the group -I'll still maintain the Ridgeline is a better all rounder than lots of half tons on the road as long as you are in the towing and hauling window - it rides better and has a better AWD system than just about anything else around. 8 hours pulling a boat in the right lane and you will be begging to get out of a body on frame truck.

A grand cherokee isn't not a truck because its a unibody - its not a truck because it has no bed.
Lots of unibody SUV's are rated to tow more than a ridgeline.
How many unibody trucks now? Ridge, Maverick, Santa Fe are the ones that come to the top maybe more.

I always worry about all my stuff in parking lots driving trucks all the time Im always pushing out to the edges and ends of lots trying to keep body panels ding free and I got purposefully dinged on my last trip to LA and Im still steaming.

We can agree to disagree all without being disagreeable.

 

[factorytuned2012]

I am torn between either a 3rd gen Tacoma or a 22+ Frontier. I like the Tacoma because of how simple and reliable it is, but sadly the only thing out there is now used. The new Frontier is a great little truck, but feels very cheap compared to a Tacoma. Being only a 2 year old platform, reliability is unknown. I can currently buy a highly optioned "base" Frontier for about the same price as a ~2-5 year highly optioned Tacoma, ($35k for both) but a huge turn off is no fender flares or wheel well liners. The truck will be used like a truck and see many muddy job sites and non ideal road conditions. My preferred Tacoma TRD Off Road package has both. I am currently driving 500 miles a week and my old Blazer is getting tired.

Any input is appreciated. Any other truck models worth looking into? Any input on a new Frontier vs used Tacoma? We just came back from a 5 hour round trip journey of looking at a Tacoma TRD Off Road that was a complete disappointment.

Hyundai Santa Cruz

 

[dlundblad]

Hyundai Santa Cruz

That’s another hideous beast much like the Ridgeline.

 

[ctechbob]

And we haven't even begun to compare luxury or tech. No contest, a fully pimped out Ram/F150/GMC absolutely destroys the ridgeline in all these areas. Air suspension, massaging seats, giant pano roofs, massive infotainment screens, HID, cushy leather, "self driving" etc etc. The list is endless.

Not being argumentative mind, but I'll interject here.
Those fully loaded 1/2's tons often come with an absolutely abysmal payload rating meaning they can't officially tow anything more than a small utility trailer (once you put some actual humans in them that is). Fully loaded half tons are ruining the market for people that actually want to buy a 1/2 ton to do work with, but the market has spoken and the manufacturers are listening.....the masses have killed off the working truck...Yes I'm overexaggerating a bit here, but its not too far off base. Sorry, didn't mean to drag the midsize discussion off.


Fully loaded F150 'Platinum' 1200# payload, shameful.

 

[MParr]

Buying a new truck or barely used truck can be a challenge. Manufacturers have flooded the market with 4 door trucks. Personally, I don't like crew cabs. Most crew cabs come with shortened beds. The shortened bed reduces cargo space. I bought my F-150 new in 2020. I intentionally searched out a super cab truck. I didn't want or need four full size doors and a shortened bed. Super Cabs are becoming really hard to find.
If, I had to pick a new mid size truck, it would be a Ford Ranger XL with the STX appearance package.

 

[hemioiler]

Ok you didn't cull the group -I'll still maintain the Ridgeline is a better all rounder than lots of half tons on the road as long as you are in the towing and hauling window - it rides better and has a better AWD system than just about anything else around.

The GC has a true 4x4 system, with an actual transfer case into 4 low, and optional locking diff. It's leagues ahead of the honda. And with available air suspension, it rides and handles better too.

My truck as well has 2wd, 4 auto ("awd"), 4 high, 4 low. Limited slip or locking diffs are available here too.

8 hours pulling a boat in the right lane and you will be begging to get out of a body on frame truck.

Not true in the slightest lol. The truck actually rides better with some weight in the bed. It's a far better truck to ride in, especially 8 hours. The ridgeline is a tiny little box with no room inside.

A grand cherokee isn't not a truck because its a unibody - its not a truck because it has no bed.

When it comes to towing + ride/handing it's far more capable then your ridgeline. Think about that.

I'm not saying the ridgeline isn't a truck; maybe that's where your comments are coming from, a little defensive, I'm saying its less capable then a mid size and I'd pick a midsize or half ton way before a ridgeline/maverick/hyundai thingy, not even a choice really once you start towing.

Half tons especially, that's where the towing trucks really start. Tow mirrors, better cooling, all the camera tech, backup assistance etc.

Lots of unibody SUV's are rated to tow more than a ridgeline.
How many unibody trucks now? Ridge, Maverick, Santa Fe are the ones that come to the top maybe more.

I always worry about all my stuff in parking lots driving trucks all the time Im always pushing out to the edges and ends of lots trying to keep body panels ding free and I got purposefully dinged on my last trip to LA and Im still steaming.

We can agree to disagree all without being disagreeable.

No one is disagreeable here.

 

[factorytuned2012]

OP doesn’t even mention about pulling a trailer or needed a specific length bed. Sounds like they’re just in need of a 4wd or awd drivetrain

 

[hemioiler]

Not being argumentative mind, but I'll interject here.
Those fully loaded 1/2's tons often come with an absolutely abysmal payload rating meaning they can't officially tow anything more than a small utility trailer (once you put some actual humans in them that is). Fully loaded half tons are ruining the market for people that actually want to buy a 1/2 ton to do work with, but the market has spoken and the manufacturers are listening.....the masses have killed off the working truck...Yes I'm overexaggerating a bit here, but its not too far off base. Sorry, didn't mean to drag the midsize discussion off.


Fully loaded F150 'Platinum' 1200# payload, shameful.

Of course you can load up a half ton with features, most of which aren't even available as options on a ridgeline. Massive sunroofs, ram boxes, hybrid battery systems, large infotainment screens, the list is endless.

Then you look at the interior size of the low payload trucks; they're all the "crew cab" variants, which means for your rear seat you have more available space than any other car/truck around, they are absolutely huge inside. So if you're carrying passengers, again, the half ton comes out on top even if the payload is the same vs a ridgeline.

My crew cab 4x4 truck has 1750 pounds of payload, and its nicely equipped. Most half tons are at least 1300+, with probably more than half above 1500. You just have to look for less expensive trims, which is the more fair comparison vs a ridgeline anyway since the upper trims in a half ton are basically luxury trucks which the ridgeline cannot even begin to compare against. And once you start spec'ing up a ridgeline, you're not getting tons of payload either.

Payload is also less useful than RAWR which is the more important number to worry about.

 

[Silverado12]

Here's from my local Chevy dealer right down the road. I would definitely drive this but I'm keeping my 2012 Chevy truck until it dies.Colorado Pickup Truck. Keep in mind a fullsize gets about the same fuel mileage.

 

[LDB]

My Ridgeline is very roomy inside, both front and back. And a very very good and quiet ride. And it is a good looking truck, being a personal opinion to each user. But just like certain politicians, some have to hate it whether deserved or not. Kind of like the I don't really care for it Santa Cruz.

Bring back the Subaru Brat. Now there was a real truck.

 

[UncleDave]

The GC has a true 4x4 system, with an actual transfer case into 4 low, and optional locking diff. It's leagues ahead of the honda. And with available air suspension, it rides and handles better too.

My truck as well has 2wd, 4 auto ("awd"), 4 high, 4 low. Limited slip or locking diffs are available here too.


Not true in the slightest lol. The truck actually rides better with some weight in the bed. It's a far better truck to ride in, especially 8 hours. The ridgeline is a tiny little box with no room inside.


When it comes to towing + ride/handing it's far more capable then your ridgeline. Think about that.

I'm not saying the ridgeline isn't a truck; maybe that's where your comments are coming from, a little defensive, I'm saying its less capable then a mid size and I'd pick a midsize or half ton way before a ridgeline/maverick/hyundai thingy, not even a choice really once you start towing.

Half tons especially, that's where the towing trucks really start. Tow mirrors, better cooling, all the camera tech, backup assistance etc.



No one is disagreeable here.

GC is an SUV doesn't matter what may or may not have.

4 Auto is not AWD and often gets confused in vehicle that have it,
I agree you can get a dizzying array of possible options - but a solid axle truck rides like one.

IFS and IRS ride better over bumps than a solid axle vehicle - is this even debated?

Ive got bilstein 5100's in my half and (the next version up) in my 3/4 ton and they arent close to the ridgelines ride.

Neither of us are going to change our positions, mine comes from owning and having a choice of vehicles to drive every day, and OP doenst want a Ridgeline so no use talking about it.

I could drive my half ton every day if I wanted, but it's not the better choice until the payload is over 1500 and the weight on the hitch over 5K

 

[UncleDave]

My Ridgeline is very roomy inside, both front and back. And a very very good and quiet ride. And it is a good looking truck, being a personal opinion to each user. But just like certain politicians, some have to hate it whether deserved or not. Kind of like the I don't really care for it Santa Cruz.

Bring back the Subaru Brat. Now there was a real truck.

By making it look more truck like to appease the looks guys - they made it worse on the highway.

The new Silverado looks like a scaled up Ridgeline. Interesting its neither Unibody nor body on frame.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Buying a new truck or barely used truck can be a challenge. Manufacturers have flooded the market with 4 door trucks. Personally, I don't like crew cabs. Most crew cabs come with shortened beds. The shortened bed reduces cargo space. I bought my F-150 new in 2020. I intentionally searched out a super cab truck. I didn't want or need four full size doors and a shortened bed. Super Cabs are becoming really hard to find.
If, I had to pick a new mid size truck, it would be a Ford Ranger XL with the STX appearance package.

I used to prefer single cab trucks, but that's partially because I'm old skool. You used to be able to leave tools, whatever, in the bed; those days are long gone.

 

[supton]

I used to prefer single cab trucks, but that's partially because I'm old skool. You used to be able to leave tools, whatever, in the bed; those days are long gone.

Regular cabs are iconic, no doubt. But the extra set of doors gives me a better place to store my murse when I go out and about.

Jokes aside, an extended cab surely helps with letting the front seat slide about more, recline more (for those so inclined, no pun intended), and does give a place to toss the day's lunch, laptop bag, suitcase, etc out of the elements.

No vehicle is perfect, most if not all are compromises on some level. Only race cars are good at one thing, and that's not being a good daily driver. Everything else is trying to achieve some balance.

 

[MParr]

What I like about the Ranger is that the infotainment center is built into the dash. There is nothing protruding protruding above the dash.

 

[hemioiler]

GC is an SUV doesn't matter what may or may not have.

My point is that there are more capable unibody suv's out there than the ridgline, and even that suv can't begin to compare to towing with my truck.

4 Auto is not AWD and often gets confused in vehicle that have it,

Yes it is AWD. When engaged, it has a RWD bias with clutches that dynamically (within ms) apply varying levels of torque to the front axles. It is different from 4hi in that there is no binding on pavement through corners.

I agree you can get a dizzying array of possible options - but a solid axle truck rides like one.

Solid axle trucks are extremely comfortable these days, especially coil suspensions like the Ram. "rides like a truck" just tells me you haven't spent significant amount of time in modern trucks. The Ram even has air suspension, the GM trucks have something advanced too, "magnaride" or whatever they call it.

IFS and IRS ride better over bumps than a solid axle vehicle - is this even debated?

My truck has IFS, not a solid front axle. And yes, you need to look at the complete setup, as I said even the coils are significant improvement over leafpads and the Ram has had 4 corner air for years now. Combine that with larger sidewall tires than the ridgeline... I guarantee you these have better ride over bumps/crummy pavement then your ridgeline, not even close.

Ive got bilstein 5100's in my half and (the next version up) in my 3/4 ton and they arent close to the ridgelines ride.

Ok that's nice, I have goodyear's on my truck and they are probably available on your ridgeline though probably a smaller size. You don't need 10 ply tires.

Neither of us are going to change our positions, mine comes from owning and having a choice of vehicles to drive every day, and OP doenst want a Ridgeline so no use talking about it.

I could drive my half ton every day if I wanted, but it's not the better choice until the payload is over 1500 and the weight on the hitch over 5K

You're welcome to your truck, I'm just arguing the facts not the preference. If you really like the small size then that's simply what you prefer and nothing more to be said. Saying its a better towing truck up to 5000 pounds is just nonsense.