Manual transmission "snobs"?

JohnBrowning · May 24, 2007

I am proud to say that I am a well trained three pedal man! I can #@$%!-toe even with modern pedal placement. I can powershift. I can also double clutch. I use my mirrors and check them every 3-5 seconds. I always know what my instruments are telling me. I always am aware of noise and vibration and what my vechile is trying to tell me. Thankfully I was taught to drive in Germany where driver's education is not yet watered down! I am also a holder of a CDL liscense. I love a good auto-x!

I think it is very very sad that any man should not be able to hope in just about anything from a tractor to a sports car and get from A-B! I think it would be a real shame to be stranded some place becasue I could not drive a manual transmission. I am also supremely confident that if analyzed we would find that more car accidents both in total and by percentage would be by drivers in automatics! The pedal layout in most automatics is an accident waiting to happen with the insanely wide treadal pedal/brake pedal and long slender accelerator pedal.

sprintman · May 24, 2007

With a 5yr warranty from Ford worrying about rebuilding a ZF 6-speed isn't an issue. No manual will keep up with this trans. Awewsome doesn't come close to how good it is. I really want one

ShiningArcanine · May 24, 2007

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For me its all about reliability. Every auto-maker's automatic is less reliable than thier manual (a general statement, but mostly true). You run a manual 120k and put a $1000 clutch in it, in a bad scenario. You run an automatic 150k and put a $3000 REBUILT tranny in it, in a good scenario. My old manual Explorer is a great example. 150k miles and NO tranny issues. How many Explorer's with automatics can you say that about?

Even in Seattle's horrific traffic, you just hang back and putt along in second gear- it isn't that bad to have a manual. Only on occasion do you get an idiot mad at you because you're not 1 foot behind the car in front of you!

Well, I am not quite at 150,000 miles, but I am at approximately 99,420 miles with my 1995 Toyota Avalon and it has had zero transmission problems.

Quote:

4 speed auto's are awful. 5 & 6 speed auto's make the driving experience more pleasant.

I prefer a stick shift where applicable.

Would you care to elaborate? My car has a four-speed automatic transmission and I have no complaints.

Axe Man · May 24, 2007

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"How many of you have driven the ZF 6-speed Adaptive Learning A/T??"

The one below ? Do you get a sharp stick to poke yourself with too ?

http://www.thelurch.com/tsbs.htm

Wow! I just read some of that. So with the 6 speed you get "Lurch" to ride along with you?

You rang? No thanks!

surfstar · May 24, 2007

Another reason I like MTXs

sprintman · May 24, 2007

No lurch in the two I've been in recently. Smmoth as butter. those TSB's are 2004, 2007 transmissions are better. I still really want one

LouDawg · May 24, 2007

I asked my Honda dealer yesterday about the 5AT if/when it comes up for rebuild or replacement. They said they get theirs directly from Honda rebuild shops in OK and OH. Get this: he said it costs $1200 for the tranny and about 8 hours labor. So around $2k for a Honda rebuilt tranny.

Now, I hope I don't have to do that. But it's much, much less than the $5-6K horror stories I'd heard from others. I'm still paranoid and anal, but maybe not nearly to the degree I was earlier.

brianl703 · May 24, 2007

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lease the brake and allow vehicle to coast with clutch down. As soon as you get to about 5 - 10 MPH the VSS signals the ECU. You'll suddenly see the idle jump up to about 1000 - 1200 RPM.

I've seen this behavior before and I believe it's a different function. I think it may prevent the engine from stalling while coasting. The reason I believe so is that without the VSS input, Ford Mustang 5.0s that have been upgraded with the newer (1989-on) mass-air computer apparently stall when coasting to a stop. The old speed-density Mustang computers (1988-previous) did not even have a VSS connection, so it must be added when upgrading to the new computer.

(EDIT: I just remembered that my own Mustang 5.0, which is a manual, has an automatic computer in it (I did the mass-air upgrade so I needed the newer computer, the automatic ones are much cheaper at wrecking yards) and it does the same thing, holds the idle up while the car is moving. So apparently this function is also programmed into the automatic computers too).

The throttle hang is most commonly observed by pushing the clutch in to make a shift and observing that the engine speed does not fall as quickly as you might expect.

In my old car, 1996 Ford Contour, the throttle hang was much more noticeable until the engine had warmed up, at which point it wasn't very noticeable at all.

brianl703 · May 24, 2007

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You know why? Look at the available shift pattern of the column shifter...

P - R - OD - D - 3 - 1.

Where is 2nd gear? NOT THERE!

My mom's 2004 Chevy Malibu Classic has:

P-R-OD-D-3-2-1

I've only shifted it manually a few times. It's far too easy to go all the way to 1 when you only wanted 2 unless you look while doing it.

ThirdeYe · May 24, 2007

That looks a lot like mine. Mine goes like this:
P-R-D4-D3-2-1

So you can shift manually if you want to, but i'm worried that doing that would cause more wear. I usually enter the freeway with D3 then when I level out my speed I switch it to D4, to get enough oomph to merge properly. When I was stuck in construction for a good hour or two, I just put it in 2 because the range was between 5-15 mph. Nice to have things like that on autos, because it's usually shifting too often, and I find myself in too high of a gear.

brianl703 · May 24, 2007

Actually, I think the Malibu Classic has:

P-R-N-D-3-2-1

D is overdrive, 3 is regular drive(overdrive cancelled). I believe you can force a 2nd-gear start from a stop in 2, it of course won't upshift to 3, and 1 won't upshift to 2.

And, of course, if you select 1 while you're going 55MPH it won't actually downshift to 1 until you're going slow enough to allow it. Ditto for 2.

1sttruck · May 25, 2007

"So around $2k for a Honda rebuilt tranny"

I think that we paid something like $350 for a clutch at around 100k miles in the Honda Civic. At 200k miles $350 is usually worth it if the engine is still running ok, but $2k for a tranny often makes it a throw away car.

ThirdeYe · May 25, 2007

Oops I forgot my neutral

It's between R and D4.

Black Bart · May 25, 2007

The thing I don't like about autos is I put it in D for drag then shift to R for race and I get beat every time.
I'm going back to a manual

sprintman · May 25, 2007

Years since i heard that

Crashbox · May 25, 2007

The only thing I don't care an awful lot for about manual transmission vehicles is having to adjust the shift linkage when they start jumping out of neutral.

LouDawg · May 25, 2007

Quote:

"So around $2k for a Honda rebuilt tranny"

I think that we paid something like $350 for a clutch at around 100k miles in the Honda Civic. At 200k miles $350 is usually worth it if the engine is still running ok, but $2k for a tranny often makes it a throw away car.

True for some. Depends on how well the car has otherwise been taken care of. $2000 is only about 4-5 car payments for most people, so you can drive a long time for that. Beats 60-84 payments...of course you don't have a new car either.

Dominic · May 25, 2007

Cheaper, more enjoyable drive, less computer involvement, better at the racetrack and in sporty corners, and overall just more vehicle control in all conditions (weather, traffic, etc). On the highway it doesn't overdownshift when I just want to pass, and it allows me to keep RPMs up or down and drive purely as I see fit.

Automatics dont think like I do, and never will. They suit the masses that need 2 hands to drive purely because one must always be holding a 1/2 skim starbucks latte.

Tornado Red · May 25, 2007

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Automatics dont think like I do, and never will. They suit the masses that need 2 hands to drive purely because one must always be holding a 1/2 skim starbucks latte.

Picking the right gear is like picking the right caffeine beverage. I don't want a computer to tell me what I should drink, or a TCM to pick a different gear than the one I want.

Stanley Rockafeller · May 26, 2007

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True story, when most people get in my car for the first time they eventually say with a puzzled look, "Why do you want to drive this old car? The engine noise is too loud and there's not even any cup holders in this car!".

Obviously none of these people have had the opportunity to enjoy a higher-performance euro car, that is/was very influential in the development of handling and automotive designs.

What makes the e30 special is how influential it is. You know this since everything before it is considered obsolete, and everything after it is often compared to it.

wonderful machine that I'll never part with...

Oh yeah, and MT's rule! I'll never own a car with an auto tranny!

Manual transmission "snobs"?

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