Harley-Davidson Moving More Production Overseas!

[Panda87]

So having been involved in Land Speed Racing (primarily with bikes) since the late 90's, I'm curious what has been done to the ZZR1200? In stock trim they were good for a top speed right around 180 mph actual speed. A couple more MPH than the ZX-11D they were based on.

I had read it somewhere but can’t find the source. You’re correct though, Wikipedia entry shows 186 as top speed. I’ve had my R6 to 172 (completely and totally maxed out after regearing) and I’m sure I hit somewhere around there on the ZZR. I know I was above 170 but I rolled off because my vision started getting tunneled and I was stupidly running on an interstate at dusk. When I bought it, it came with a Muzzy exhaust. I rejetted the carbs and put a K&N filter on it. Intake valve on Cyl 2 needed a new shim, but at 18,000 miles all the rest were well within spec. Runs like a beast for its age!

Found some pics from the day I picked it up!!

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawasaki_ZZ-R1200

 

[DuckRyder]

Holy shred drift batman.

I always preferred the earlier ZZR headlights and body work.

I'm take blackbird for 11000 alex.

Hoping the new MoCo CEO is a enthusiast.

 

[Hohn]

I am deeply disheartened by Harley-Davidson's recent decision to shift the production of their Pan America, Sportster, and Nightster models from the United States to their facility in Thailand. This move feels like a betrayal to the loyal American riders who have long supported this iconic brand, priding themselves on its rich heritage of American craftsmanship.

Harley-Davidson has always been a symbol of American freedom and ingenuity. The roar of its engines has echoed the spirit of the open road, embodying the essence of the American dream. To see this legacy compromised by outsourcing production overseas is both shocking and disheartening.

The company justifies this decision by citing cost savings and the need to optimize production capacity. However, this comes at the expense of American jobs and the quality assurance that comes with domestic manufacturing. It's particularly concerning that models sold in the U.S., which were once proudly labeled "Made in America," will now be produced abroad.

This isn't the first time Harley-Davidson has made such a move. In recent years, they've increasingly shifted production overseas, influenced by factors like international tariffs and corporate tax incentives. While globalization is a reality, it's disheartening to see a brand that built its reputation on American soil prioritize foreign operations over its domestic workforce.

As a community of enthusiasts who have long celebrated Harley-Davidson's American roots, we must voice our concerns. The essence of this brand lies in its connection to American culture and manufacturing. Diluting this identity not only alienates loyal customers but also undermines the very foundation upon which Harley-Davidson was built.

I urge fellow riders and supporters to express their dismay and call upon Harley-Davidson to reconsider this decision. Let's remind them of the importance of preserving the legacy and trust they've cultivated over the decades. Our roads deserve the genuine article, not a shadow of what once was.

I’d be ok with it if they dropped the pretense of American icon and cut the price in half.

 

[Panda87]

Holy shred drift batman.

I always preferred the earlier ZZR headlights and body work.

I'm take blackbird for 11000 alex.

Hoping the new MoCo CEO is an enthusiast.

Not gonna lie, after I posted the post with the pics, I thought the same thing. I was like “ugh, I’ve committed a forum faux pas “

I’d take any bike I could get my grubby paws on honestly. I love em all.

 

[KrisZ]

Yeah, say what you will about Harley, but they do make some of the best cruisers and long distance tourers there are. They have that stuff dialed in and figured out.

Pricing wise though, they have shot themselves in the foot, as they can’t attract younger buyers.
Can’t really lower the price much and can’t rely on the 50+ crowd as customer base. No wonder they’re struggling.

 

[02SE]

Yeah, say what you will about Harley, but they do make some of the best cruisers and long distance tourers there are. They have that stuff dialed in and figured out.

Pricing wise though, they have shot themselves in the foot, as they can’t attract younger buyers.
Can’t really lower the price much and can’t rely on the 50+ crowd as customer base. No wonder they’re struggling.

To be fair it's the entire Motorcycle industry that is struggling. The dealer where I bought my newest sportbike, is mostly keeping their doors open due to the Side x Side business.

The majority of kids today don't care about motorcycles, they just want the latest smartphone.

 

[Panda87]

To be fair it's the entire Motorcycle industry that is struggling. The dealer where I bought my newest sportbike, is mostly keeping their doors open due to the Side x Side business.

The majority of kids today don't care about motorcycles, they just want the latest smartphone.

I teach MSF classes and I can tell you that a large majority of my students are late teen/early 20s folks. I can also tell you that from all the ones I keep in contact with, not one owns or is interested in owning a Harley. They are all riding any other non-luxe brand.

 

[fantastic]

Time to buy an Indian..

 

[02SE]

I teach MSF classes and I can tell you that a large majority of my students are late teen/early 20s folks. I can also tell you that from all the ones I keep in contact with, not one owns or is interested in owning a Harley. They are all riding any other non-luxe brand.

I'm a former MSF instructor, and used to help teach advanced riding and roadracing classes, and trackdays. I also have family in the motorcycle business, and lots of friends.

I'm just saying that in comparison to the boom years of new models, updates, and Motorcycling in general, there has been a drastic drop in interest in the last 15 years or so.

 

[scoot]

Time to buy an Indian..

The fenders are 3 times thicker than Harleys

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Offshoring is simply a stop gap and a sign of the company failing to sell their product. Harley's pricing is on the very high end spectrum in the motorcycle segment and if they cannot make enough profit while charging premium, something is very wrong with their business model.

They're getting beat up in Europe due to emissions/sound regulations.

 

[alarmguy]

Time to buy an Indian..

Sadly, Polaris is bombing again. First, the Victory line was going to take on Harley after failure, they shut that down and now to my surprise their Indian brand isn’t doing too well either.
I have nothing against them at all, I think it’s the sign of the times. I actually came close to buying a victory crossroads around 2012. The young have no interest in big heavy interstate cruising which is very unique to the United States, but not enough for multiple companies to compete

https://www.motorcyclesdata.com/2024/09/08/indian-motorcycles/

 

[fantastic]

Sadly, Polaris is bombing again. First, the Victory line was going to take on Harley after failure, they shut that down and now to my surprise their Indian brand isn’t doing too well either.
I have nothing against them at all, I think it’s the sign of the times. I actually came close to buying a victory crossroads around 2012. The young have no interest in big heavy interstate cruising which is very unique to the United States, but not enough for multiple companies to compete

https://www.motorcyclesdata.com/2024/09/08/indian-motorcycles/

Agree, The last few years have been slow for a lot of our market. Wow, I had no idea Victory went belly up.
I have to give it to Polaris Victory for being at it for that long to try & take on HD (apparently 30 years!). With the Indian line there's really no need anymore for Victory from what I can see. Indian being a more serious competing option (brand). I don't keep up with the "Young" so I don't know what they're into & it's not any of my concern.
Thanks for the link.

 

[Panda87]

I'm a former MSF instructor, and used to help teach advanced riding and roadracing classes, and trackdays. I also have family in the motorcycle business, and lots of friends.

I'm just saying that in comparison to the boom years of new models, updates, and Motorcycling in general, there has been a drastic drop in interest in the last 15 years or so.

I don’t have the historical knowledge you do for sure. From what I’ve seen, at least in the state of Alabama, our classes have been maxed out at 12 students more often than they aren’t; and in our state, all you have to do to get your endorsement is take a written test, so these students are here of their own volition.

I’d love to get certified to teach the ARC. We are supposed to be having a program wide training event this year for it. I love coaching and it’s been a highly rewarding experience. How long did you coach for?

 

[Panda87]

Sadly, Polaris is bombing again. First, the Victory line was going to take on Harley after failure, they shut that down and now to my surprise their Indian brand isn’t doing too well either.
I have nothing against them at all, I think it’s the sign of the times. I actually came close to buying a victory crossroads around 2012. The young have no interest in big heavy interstate cruising which is very unique to the United States, but not enough for multiple companies to compete

https://www.motorcyclesdata.com/2024/09/08/indian-motorcycles/

A guy in my chapter bought a new Indian Pursuit and it was riddled with issues. At less than 5000 miles it burned up the clutch and Indian wouldn’t honor it under warranty because he had ridden it in a parade. His start/stop switch threw a code to the ECU and as a result the ECU locked out the bike from starting without a dealer reset…on a Saturday afternoon, 400+ miles from home. Nearby dealer said “have someone bring it in on a flatbed and we will look at it Monday” our local dealer he bought it from said the same thing. He ended up selling it and getting back on an HD. This guy logged more miles than anyone else in our chapter and logged 25,000+ miles every year on his Road Glide and never did more than factory recommended maintenance on it. That Indian was beautiful, powerful, cool, and comfortable…but with those issues it wasn’t reliable enough for the amount of riding he does.

 

[GON]

A guy in my chapter bought a new Indian Pursuit and it was riddled with issues. At less than 5000 miles it burned up the clutch and Indian wouldn’t honor it under warranty because he had ridden it in a parade. His start/stop switch threw a code to the ECU and as a result the ECU locked out the bike from starting without a dealer reset…on a Saturday afternoon, 400+ miles from home. Nearby dealer said “have someone bring it in on a flatbed and we will look at it Monday” our local dealer he bought it from said the same thing. He ended up selling it and getting back on an HD. This guy logged more miles than anyone else in our chapter and logged 25,000+ miles every year on his Road Glide and never did more than factory recommended maintenance on it. That Indian was beautiful, powerful, cool, and comfortable…but with those issues it wasn’t reliable enough for the amount of riding he does.

Your posts brings up a lot of implied benefits of buying a Harley. Not a motorcycle expert, but it surely appears more people can service a Harley than any other manufacturer of large bikes, when away from home. And that is a huge benefit.

 

[02SE]

I don’t have the historical knowledge you do for sure. From what I’ve seen, at least in the state of Alabama, our classes have been maxed out at 12 students more often than they aren’t; and in our state, all you have to do to get your endorsement is take a written test, so these students are here of their own volition.

I’d love to get certified to teach the ARC. We are supposed to be having a program wide training event this year for it. I love coaching and it’s been a highly rewarding experience. How long did you coach for?

I was doing the MSF thing in the late 90's into the early 2000's.

From 2005 on, I was helping a friend teach his advanced riding and roadracing classes (Not MSF related) at a roadracing track for about 15 years, while also racing in a regional (west coast) roadracing series, and some AMA events.

 

[Panda87]

I was doing the MSF thing in the late 90's into the early 2000's.

From 2005 on, I was helping a friend teach his advanced riding and roadracing classes (Not MSF related) at a roadracing track for about 15 years, while also racing in a regional (west coast) roadracing series, and some AMA events.

That’s the life man! I bet you’ve got some awesome stories to tell.

 

[4WD]

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[alarmguy]

Agree, The last few years have been slow for a lot of our market. Wow, I had no idea Victory went belly up.
I have to give it to Polaris Victory for being at it for that long to try & take on HD (apparently 30 years!). With the Indian line there's really no need anymore for Victory from what I can see. Indian being a more serious competing option (brand). I don't keep up with the "Young" so I don't know what they're into & it's not any of my concern.
Thanks for the link.

Yes, Polaris also owned the Victory line. Then they bought the Indian name and started that up. Some years later they closed down the Victory line and used the money to buy a HUGE established auto parts business.
Yes, I consider the Indian "hardware" more "serious" but I dont know they are trying to please a wide audience and I am not so sure that audience is there anymore.
I might feel this way because I really liked their Victory line-up. Price-performance was equal to the metric cruisers and better but with the same great pricing and USA made. Maybe also because I like a more clean simple heavy weight cruiser which the larger Victory's were. After all I have a Road King for simplicity. I love the ride and the rode void of all the distractions of a bunch of gadgets. I know I am in the minority I guess.