Answered above, but the bike you built is a 24, there isn't really a 25 equivalent though a Road glide with Limited Package kinda gets it there.
Harley-Davidson Moving More Production Overseas!
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Answered above, but the bike you built is a 24, there isn't really a 25 equivalent though a Road glide with Limited Package kinda gets it there.
Ok whatever. You were wrong with your assumption that I was off base with my 40K number, which I proved, but somehow, you are right, I get it.
Go Harley!
You were right if you add a bunch of stuff...
I think all luxury bike makers suffer. The one that was going to put Harley out of business was shut down by Polaris in 2012 (victory)
Then, Polaris other brand Indian which they created in 2011 didnt become profitable until 13 years later in 2024 and last I read their sales slump is worse than Harley at 24% going into 2024 and I see things didnt improve much by Sept 2024 and Indian sells cheaper bikes than Harley.
https://www.motorcyclesdata.com/2024/09/08/indian-motorcycles/
https://www.motorcyclesdata.com/2025/02/04/united-states-motorcycles-market/
For the naysayers. I take no position except to inaccurate and incomplete information. The fact is, motorcycles are being replaced by the young for smart phones, air-conditioning and other activities that they spend their money on.
Cheap throwaway motorcycles will always be around for that 3 year thrill some younger person gets driving around town and no place else. They have other priorities.
Fact is 50% of all motorcycle registrations in the USA are 14 years old or older and cruisers are the largest segment.
https://www.iihs.org/api/datastoredocument/bibliography/2288
Then, Polaris other brand Indian which they created in 2011 didnt become profitable until 13 years later in 2024 and last I read their sales slump is worse than Harley at 24% going into 2024 and I see things didnt improve much by Sept 2024 and Indian sells cheaper bikes than Harley.
https://www.motorcyclesdata.com/2024/09/08/indian-motorcycles/
https://www.motorcyclesdata.com/2025/02/04/united-states-motorcycles-market/
For the naysayers. I take no position except to inaccurate and incomplete information. The fact is, motorcycles are being replaced by the young for smart phones, air-conditioning and other activities that they spend their money on.
Cheap throwaway motorcycles will always be around for that 3 year thrill some younger person gets driving around town and no place else. They have other priorities.
Fact is 50% of all motorcycle registrations in the USA are 14 years old or older and cruisers are the largest segment.
https://www.iihs.org/api/datastoredocument/bibliography/2288
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I won't ride a bike - too crazy, but if I were it would be a BMW or Triumph or something that didn't look like a couch with 2 wheels. I don't say this to disrespect anyone, the brand is iconic. But if the goal is to attract a younger crowd they need to diversify there product line not just on price but on style, and start advertising in other places.
I remember as a kid wanting a 883 Sportster. I looked at their website. There isn't anything even near to that bike anymore.
Which every poser lawyer and doctor would,and does, (which was my point) and just like the auto market, you cant just go buy a rock bottom line Tacoma without the backseat package, "because we cant order them that way" BS.
Try and find a bottom line Harley at a stealership for 10k brand new. I argue you will have a hard time.
This will start something, but I say that Japanese bikes are lightyears ahead of Harley, and if Harley decides to be made in OCONUS, Harley will die very soon after, in the USA. Sure, the asians will love them.
Yes, but you have to accept that the bikes you speak of as far as being a couch are interstate cruisers
You’re not gonna do that with your girlfriend or spouse on the back traveling down the interstate through multiple states on a sport bike. And let’s not forget while you’re carrying that passenger on the back and all the luggage that the high ground clearance of some sport bikes will be very challenging balancing that kind of a load.
That’s why I mentioned the smaller Japanese sport bikes are popular. They ride them around town for the three years or so and then virtually almost throw them away.
BMWs and triumphs are great bikes, I love them both.
And you could get a comfortable cruiser that looks sporty if you’re comfortable paying the price.
Here is an example if you think BMW is going to be cheap to service Well, that will make Harley Davison look like a Honda Civic as far as cost
Many people don’t realize the metric bike such as BMW need new rear tires every 7000 miles or so which is half the life of a Harley Davison and rear tires are not cheap.
Next up on many of the metric bikes are valve adjustments. Some of these bikes that could be a half day or full day job.
In that same league or also reasonably priced Yamaha and Kawasaki in sport touring bikes.
All I’m trying to say is if you try riding them all, try jumping on interstate 26, travel at 85 miles and make sure to pass a couple dozen tractor trailers and then decide which bike is the most stable of them all.
Most of the people who knock or make fun of Harley Davidson have never come close to doing any of the above. In reality, the Goldwing is the only other by capable of long-term interstate, cruising machine and there in lies the problem. People on the sidelines who don’t ride bikes do not know the different types of bike riding.
You can like in the same thing to boats
You have jet skis, you have sport boats, you have speedboats, you have sent a console fishing boats, and you have cabin cruisers
Let’s put it this way, my wifes boss takes his cruiser from his house in Florida to the Bahamas on any given weekend, you’re not doing that with the other boats.
I know this is broken up. Just got back from the gym. Gotta jump in the shower and then go get radiated
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Let me ask you how many interstate multi day trips have you taken on your motorcycle and what brand was it?
Also, did you have a passenger with you?
You should post that in here so it may help others
I can tell you any of the big Harley Davidson cruisers or Honda Goldwing can do that with ease
You missed my point. Car companies, give big rebates to college grads, for the specific purpose of creating brand loyalty early.Yes, but you have to accept that the bikes you speak of as far as being a couch are interstate cruisers
You’re not gonna do that with your girlfriend or spouse on the back traveling down the interstate through multiple states on a sport bike. And let’s not forget while you’re carrying that passenger on the back and all the luggage that the high ground clearance of some sport bikes will be very challenging balancing that kind of a load.
That’s why I mentioned the smaller Japanese sport bikes are popular. They ride them around town for the three years or so and then virtually almost throw them away.
BMWs and triumphs are great bikes, I love them both.
And you could get a comfortable cruiser that looks sporty if you’re comfortable paying the price.
Here is an example if you think BMW is going to be cheap to service Well, that will make Harley Davison look like a Honda Civic as far as cost
Many people don’t realize the metric bike such as BMW need new rear tires every 7000 miles or so which is half the life of a Harley Davison and rear tires are not cheap.
Next up on many of the metric bikes are valve adjustments. Some of these bikes that could be a half day or full day job.
In that same league or also reasonably priced Yamaha and Kawasaki in sport touring bikes.
All I’m trying to say is if you try riding them all, try jumping on interstate 26, travel at 85 miles and make sure to pass a couple dozen tractor trailers and then decide which bike is the most stable of them all.
Most of the people who knock or make fun of Harley Davidson have never come close to doing any of the above. In reality, the Goldwing is the only other by capable of long-term interstate, cruising machine and there in lies the problem. People on the sidelines who don’t ride bikes do not know the different types of bike riding.
You can like in the same thing to boats
You have jet skis, you have sport boats, you have speedboats, you have sent a console fishing boats, and you have cabin cruisers
Let’s put it this way, my wifes boss takes his cruiser from his house in Florida to the Bahamas on any given weekend, you’re not doing that with the other boats.
I know this is broken up. Just got back from the gym. Gotta jump in the shower and then go get radiated
Harley’s branding strategy seems to be you ride a Honda dirtbike, a Honda scooter, then a Honda sport bike, and then maybe when you’re 50, you buy a Harley Davidson.
So maybe Harley Davidson needs to hire at least one brand marketing person?
Since you asked, countless day trips, and I daily rode a bike for several years, rain and shine, 100 miles a day, a Honda.
Let me ask you: what does this matter in this conversation?
Nope, I am not a fool. Again irrelevant to the conversation or my post. If one wants to ride with a passenger that is their business, and you definitely dont need a Harley to do it, as you put it.
Help with what? Do you think I have no experience with bikes or powersports machines, and therefore I have no standing on my point of view? I grew up in the desert, riding and racing bikes & 3 wheelers. I rode Honda "Foreman" ATVs in the mountains of AFG, and CR250s if I remember right.
Do what, ride with a passenger? Sure. Way of topic, but again, it does not have to be a Harley to have a passenger. Since you brought the Gold Wing up, have you ever rode one? They are a dream, ultra powerful, ultra quiet, as I said, light years ahead of a Harley. They do not look as cool though. No question, and multi state multi day trip. I would want a Gold Wing all day, and I am sure all those who you know who have one will agree.
So what is your point?
Yes, but you have to accept that the bikes you speak of as far as being a couch are interstate cruisers
You’re not gonna do that with your girlfriend or spouse on the back traveling down the interstate through multiple states on a sport bike. And let’s not forget while you’re carrying that passenger on the back and all the luggage that the high ground clearance of some sport bikes will be very challenging balancing that kind of a load.
That’s why I mentioned the smaller Japanese sport bikes are popular. They ride them around town for the three years or so and then virtually almost throw them away.
BMWs and triumphs are great bikes, I love them both.
And you could get a comfortable cruiser that looks sporty if you’re comfortable paying the price.
Here is an example if you think BMW is going to be cheap to service Well, that will make Harley Davison look like a Honda Civic as far as cost
Many people don’t realize the metric bike such as BMW need new rear tires every 7000 miles or so which is half the life of a Harley Davison and rear tires are not cheap.
Next up on many of the metric bikes are valve adjustments. Some of these bikes that could be a half day or full day job.
In that same league or also reasonably priced Yamaha and Kawasaki in sport touring bikes.
All I’m trying to say is if you try riding them all, try jumping on interstate 26, travel at 85 miles and make sure to pass a couple dozen tractor trailers and then decide which bike is the most stable of them all.
Most of the people who knock or make fun of Harley Davidson have never come close to doing any of the above. In reality, the Goldwing is the only other by capable of long-term interstate, cruising machine and there in lies the problem. People on the sidelines who don’t ride bikes do not know the different types of bike riding.
You can like in the same thing to boats
You have jet skis, you have sport boats, you have speedboats, you have sent a console fishing boats, and you have cabin cruisers
Let’s put it this way, my wifes boss takes his cruiser from his house in Florida to the Bahamas on any given weekend, you’re not doing that with the other boats.
I know this is broken up. Just got back from the gym. Gotta jump in the shower and then go get radiated
Maybe the wife and I are an exception, but we've ridden all over the country on Sportbikes. Usually each of us on an individual bike, just because we find it much more fun. But occasionally two-up. You have some ill-informed notions of what riding a Sportbike is like. We pass Semi's on Interstates all the time. While our bikes were restricted from the factory to 186 mph (easily de-restricted), passing a Semi at 85+ mph, is no problem at all. Although we usually try to find more interesting roads than just droning down Interstates.
Yes, we have had a Harley. An FLHTCUI. That thing was sooooo gutless, it had a hard time maintaining the speed limit on one gradual uphill stretch of I-15. Yes, that was 20 years ago, and they have a bit more power now, but still are about the same riding experience, and don't appeal to us.
It's nice to still have choices.
That's a BINGO, good buddies.
Everyone should be for choices -in everything- as their existence creates downward pressure on prices.
If I may shoot from the hip...Harleys seem just too serious for their own good.
They (sorta) painted themselves into a corner.
Like you say you ride sport bikes, and most times not two up
Comparing a 20 year-old bike with today’s bike is the same as comparing a 20 year old car, really now that is not a comparison.
What sport bikes are you riding?
I can testify my 2014 Road King pulls like an ape to loaded with luggage to up in the mountains of Western North Carolina and eastern Tennessee.
Anyone with a 2014 or later model can say the same.
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I've ridden the latest Harley's. Even with the most powerful engines available from the factory. Sorry, they're not much different in the riding experience, from the one I owned. How do I know? Because I can still ride the FLHTCUI I owned, as I sold it to a friend.
A bit more power, and some modern electronic tech. But the basic bikes feel pretty much the same. Not surprising, as that's their marketing is to keep building a bike that looks and rides close as possible to Harley's of 70+ years ago.
I can’t help you with the bikes you rode my experience on a Road King is the opposite of yours, let me emphasize that to an extreme.
What bike do you have now?
No disrespect, but in these forums, I always hear from people that don’t own the bike.
Precisely my point, the Nightster is supposed to fill that niche but does a bad job of it.
Those packages are pulled straight from the P&A catalog. it's nothing more than a "curated" grouping of accessories. Ducati and Triumph do similar. At least around here if they did something to one on the floor there is likely another one in the crate in back you can have.
Yup it is a problem the Nightster is the only thing close maybe if you wanted grey and the had a couple you could get one for 10K.
I'm sure i wont change anyones mind, it was hard to change mine. I've owned Hondas, Yamahas (edit, i forgot the Kawaskis), Ducati is the only one that came close to the quality of materials and build was the Ducatis.
I think their strategy is actually to try to get people to buy "certified used" which is a crummy strategy.
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What? I OWNED the FLHTCUI I said I did. A friend still owns it. I last rode it last Fall, the same day a Local Harley dealer had their demo day, and I rode most of the range of bikes. I skipped riding the Trike.
Yes, I rode a Road King. I've ridden the Road King at every Dealer Demo day I've been to for years. They all look and feel about the same. A bit more power as engine displacement has increased. But basically the same experience, as that is Harley's intent.
Look, you like your Road King, more power to you. I'm not knocking it or you. Ride what you like.
I think you've asked me what bikes I own before, but here's the current stable:
Heavily modified Suzuki Hayabusa
Modified for roadracing BMW S1000RR
Stock Ducati Panigale V4 Speciale equipped with the Ti Akrapovic exhaust and kit ECU it came with.
Lightly modified BMW S1000RR M
Stock Suzuki Hayabusa
Dirtbikes
Modified KTM 550 MXC
Modified CR250
I’m not knocking your choices at all. You disputed or countered my statement and extensive experience in all travel conditions that I am sure no one or very few ever have on a motorcycle riding my 2014 Road King that I bought new and still own.
You used your own previously 20 year old motorcycle and test rides of new ones.
You stated how much trouble it has going up hill and the new ones are not that much different besides maybe “ a little more power”
I don’t care what you ride, I’m just answering your incorrect assumptions on a Road King
Ride what you like, bikes serve all different uses.
ln leu of income tax
I've always found it amusing that so many bikes still need valve adjustments, yet these same people claim Harley's are low tech? I mean when were hydraulic lifters invented? The 1930's?
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