General Motors Unseated As America’s Top Selling Automaker.

KJH

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I am also suprised that GM was not already surpassed in domestic vehicle sales. Besides trucks and V8 cars, I cant think of a single other segment were they offer anything markedly more appealing than the competitors, domestic or import. Silverado/GMC truck sold slightly more than Ford, but the only other in the top 25 is the equinox, which I am honestly shocked outsold the Escape. Maybe I underestimate how much US consumers prioritize general size in any segment.

My area of interest in cars does not really include domestics, although I do not dislike them, but I personally really like and respect all of Chevys V8 stuff and the LS/LT motors are great. Besides that, I think they have mismanaged and dropped the ball everywhere else. Fords "global vehicles" approach seems far superior than Chevys method of outsourcing not only manufacturing but design and engineering to cheap foreign subsidiaries and partnerships. The fundamental concept behind the Volt (ICE generator with EV) was IMO a good idea but executed in the worst way possible (why put it in a weird big but small car and with a relatively big gas motor?). Their compact cars/CUV's are chinese/korean crap from the ground up. Their styling looks cheap and bland.

Every auto maker has dropped in long term reliability in the Eco era, in fact im almost certain that EVERY oem has had at least one heavy oil burner 4cyl engine in the past 15 years. Toyota is included in this, but gun to my head if I had to choose one brand that has the most consistent reliability across all segments, its them. While they had problems with oil consumption like everyone else (along with some piston slap), their 4cyl motors generally keep going and going. Their V6's are also solid, and V8's break 500k miles without a sweat.

With non truck vehicles Chevys lineup doesnt offer much. For the features and relative lack of general powertrain engineering/durability you get with non V8 gm, consumers who trade in cars for new every 2-4 years are better off going with Hyundai Kia, who have similar drawbacks mechanically but offer much better styling and value. Domestically, head to head I cant think of a single GM product thats more appealing than what Ford offers.
 
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CKN

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They will be going the way of Nissan then. Target production of cheap 30k mile lifespan vehicles to get through the rental period.

No where to go but down.
That's a bit overly dramatic............................
 

SammyChevelleTypeS3

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They will be going the way of Nissan then. Target production of cheap 30k mile lifespan vehicles to get through the rental period.

No where to go but down.
I have never seen it but my son was in a major shock when he flew over and visited Detroit, Michigan some years ago. He said you could not look in any direction and not see urban blight and decay / abandonned neighborhoods and streets , houses and stores all across the city. He assumed most of it all associated with the industrial failures of companies who built that city. No fault of the citizens.
 

KJH

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I have never seen it but my son was in a major shock when he flew over and visited Detroit, Michigan some years ago. He said you could not look in any direction and not see urban blight and decay / abandonned neighborhoods and streets , houses and stores all across the city. He assumed most of it all associated with the industrial failures of companies who built that city. No fault of the citizens.

Even driving into downtown on the highway is a trip. Up until about 2012 it legitimately looked like something out of a post apocalyptic movie. Nowadays its not as bad but most of the houses still look derelict and theres a half burnt down one every 500 yards or so, and thats just whats visible from the highway.
 
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I have never seen it but my son was in a major shock when he flew over and visited Detroit, Michigan some years ago. He said you could not look in any direction and not see urban blight and decay / abandonned neighborhoods and streets , houses and stores all across the city. He assumed most of it all associated with the industrial failures of companies who built that city. No fault of the citizens.
Same problems exist in Detroit as every other large urban area. Blaming the societal problems on the auto industry is just low hanging fruit. Michael Moore made himself a millionaire blaming GM.
Theres always been work for those that are inclined to work.
 

SammyChevelleTypeS3

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Same problems exist in Detroit as every other large urban area. Blaming the societal problems on the auto industry is just low hanging fruit. Michael Moore made himself a millionaire blaming GM.
Theres always been work for those that are inclined to work.
That is true. Here , EVERY business building , every single one has HELP WANTED signs that been there so long they are becoming weather beaten but still valid. I know several younger people without jobs who are laying around. Rather be unemployed than take one of those jobs. Some folks have been taught growing up, no need to work... Yet these same folks are walking around with $1200 Iphones and ear buds and playing video games and driving around town. How do they pay I ask? Car note? Car insurance? Monthly Iphone bill? Expensive video games? These are young people I watch whose parent showered them with everything growing up. Some of them even have made the rounds thru college yet still are unemployed.
 
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That is true. Here , EVERY business building , every single one has HELP WANTED signs that been there so long they are becoming weather beaten but still valid. I know several younger people without jobs who are laying around. Rather be unemployed than take one of those jobs. Some folks have been taught growing up, no need to work... Yet these same folks are walking around with $1200 Iphones and ear buds and playing video games and driving around town. How do they pay I ask? Car note? Car insurance? Monthly Iphone bill? Expensive video games? These are young people I watch whose parent showered them with everything growing up. Some of them even have made the rounds thru college yet still are unemployed.
The new softer lazier America something we all must get use to😞😞
 

SammyChevelleTypeS3

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Same problems exist in Detroit as every other large urban area. Blaming the societal problems on the auto industry is just low hanging fruit. Michael Moore made himself a millionaire blaming GM.
What is truly very scary. Think of this. How could Michael Moore even make himself $3 let alone become a millionaire UNLESS there are millions of other Michael Moores running across the land thinking and feeling and believing most of the drivel that block head writes or says! YIKES :unsure:
 
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Like someone said, decades of really bad quality is hurting today. The problem is once GM started to address issues, they addressed it in typical corporate fashion. Except new Corvette, they did not offer anything that would make people stop to take a look. Quality is average at best, so why would anyone buy it? It is not like Toyota offers anything special not it is uber quality. But they figured put strenghts, figured exactly what certain demographics want, and they play that tune for decades. Most importantly, they don’t chip away from employees, they are not trying to save where they shouldn’t.
 
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That is true. Here , EVERY business building , every single one has HELP WANTED signs that been there so long they are becoming weather beaten but still valid. I know several younger people without jobs who are laying around. Rather be unemployed than take one of those jobs. Some folks have been taught growing up, no need to work... Yet these same folks are walking around with $1200 Iphones and ear buds and playing video games and driving around town. How do they pay I ask? Car note? Car insurance? Monthly Iphone bill? Expensive video games? These are young people I watch whose parent showered them with everything growing up. Some of them even have made the rounds thru college yet still are unemployed.
You are making a lot of assumptions.
Vail Resorts are going through that now. Which happens when you treat employees like cattle (literally), when you tell people that they can use app instead of actual HR department, and you get involved in real estate boom and push out your own employees from rental market.
Result? Numerous “help wanted” signs, closed ski slopes and chairs, and huge lines at those open.
Few miles from their resorts are ski areas where employers didn’t treat their employees as cattle, pay bit more (but key is not in hourly wage), they provide benefits, they treat employees as human beings, and customers enjoy experience.
So behind rotten “help wanted” sign might be rotten organization that is an issue.
 
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Really? The 3.6L LFX in my 2016 Buick LaCrosse has only been amazing, at least thus far. 5 years, 62k miles, no issues at all.

The sour reputation of the 3.6L is well earned, It's extremely hard on oil & the average owner doesn't change the oil on time in the first place.....This leads to Timing Chain Stretch & Sprocket Wear.

If I had a GM 3.6L.....I'd change the oil every 3,000 miles using a quality full synthetic 5w30 Dexos approved oil. This goes for just about ALL Direct Injected GM powerplants save for the LTx V8 with it's 8 quart oil capacity & oversized cooling system.
 
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You are making a lot of assumptions.
Vail Resorts are going through that now. Which happens when you treat employees like cattle (literally), when you tell people that they can use app instead of actual HR department, and you get involved in real estate boom and push out your own employees from rental market.
Result? Numerous “help wanted” signs, closed ski slopes and chairs, and huge lines at those open.
Few miles from their resorts are ski areas where employers didn’t treat their employees as cattle, pay bit more (but key is not in hourly wage), they provide benefits, they treat employees as human beings, and customers enjoy experience.
So behind rotten “help wanted” sign might be rotten organization that is an issue.

I know quite a few people that work at GM's Arlington Assembly Plant where they assemble the Tahoe, Suburban, & Escalade...Seems to be one of the better "Blue Collar" plant jobs in the area, Especially when compared to Trinity Industries (Road Products) & Lasko (fans).
 
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SammyChevelleTypeS3

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You are making a lot of assumptions.
Vail Resorts are going through that now. Which happens when you treat employees like cattle (literally), when you tell people that they can use app instead of actual HR department, and you get involved in real estate boom and push out your own employees from rental market.
Result? Numerous “help wanted” signs, closed ski slopes and chairs, and huge lines at those open.
Few miles from their resorts are ski areas where employers didn’t treat their employees as cattle, pay bit more (but key is not in hourly wage), they provide benefits, they treat employees as human beings, and customers enjoy experience.
So behind rotten “help wanted” sign might be rotten organization that is an issue.
:cry:
 
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The sour reputation of the 3.6L is well earned, It's extremely hard on oil & the average owner doesn't change the oil on time in the first place.....This leads to Timing Chain Stretch & Sprocket Wear.

If I had a GM 3.6L.....I'd change the oil every 3,000 miles using a quality full synthetic 5w30 Dexos approved oil. This goes for just about ALL Direct Injected GM powerplants save for the LTx V8 with it's 8 quart oil capacity & oversized cooling system.
Couldn't agree more, and if the timing issue isn't addressed on time, there's a risk of wiping out the bearings and requiring a rebuild because of ferrous metals in the oil. This is one application where I certainly would not follow the OLM.

From what I've seen, there's also an issue with high levels of oil consumption, and the water pumps are an issue as well.
 
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I own a first year GM car 😲, my second one😲😲. My current one (a 1999 model) is a LOT a lot better then the first one (a 1975 model). I'd have to think that they have gotten better since my 1999 was built. At least GM is using top post batteries now. I'm not thrilled about their lack of spare tires as standard in some (maybe all??) of their vehicles and their (mostly) departure from the car segment of the market.
 
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The sour reputation of the 3.6L is well earned, It's extremely hard on oil & the average owner doesn't change the oil on time in the first place.....This leads to Timing Chain Stretch & Sprocket Wear.

If I had a GM 3.6L.....I'd change the oil every 3,000 miles using a quality full synthetic 5w30 Dexos approved oil. This goes for just about ALL Direct Injected GM powerplants save for the LTx V8 with it's 8 quart oil capacity & oversized cooling system.
Agreed, the GM 3.6 isn’t the best power plant and its has it issues. However owners not keeping up regular OC while letting capacity get low is hard on any engine. Your recommend for 3K OCI isn’t necessary to maintain reliable.

Took a ‘12 GM 3.6 over 200K w/syblend 6-7K OCI with no issues. Got rid of the vehicle for reasons other than the engine. In laws have ‘14 GM 3.6 w/120K. Keeping it topped off is the majority of it.
 

4WD

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I have never seen it but my son was in a major shock when he flew over and visited Detroit, Michigan some years ago. He said you could not look in any direction and not see urban blight and decay / abandonned neighborhoods and streets , houses and stores all across the city. He assumed most of it all associated with the industrial failures of companies who built that city. No fault of the citizens.
No fault of the citizens ? I carry a manager right now - could choose to watch him make mistakes but the guys on the front line don’t let me make mistakes - IMO every employee/citizen has the opportunity to lead by example …
I used to be in a very large union - many were just fine watching others fail …
Last but not least - we all can vote … Many cities are in decline …
 
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