Ferrari 812 Superfast Oil Consumption
- Thread starter AEHaas
- Start date
I ran a 20 grade oil in my Enzo that is spec'ed for a 60 grade oil. I recently sold it after 15 years of ownership. The dealership did an exhaustive PPI. The engine was tested to be in perfect shape. At the time of the sale I was using a 0W30 grade oil. They knew of my oil use and testing. All was well documented. The owner of the dealership (actually multiple Ferrari dealerships) bought my car.
Ali
Ali
Go around corners gently. Like granny.
Here is my stick, 16" overall. The original MAX mark was at 10". I ground off the marking. Now the original MIN mark at 12" is my new maximum level.
When you change the oil you need to disconnect the oil line from the oil cooler to drain the pipes and the radiator. The lines must be an inch or more ID. Lots of oil there. The instructions for refilling are to add 8 qts first then run the engine and warm things up. You then check and add a quart at a time until you are half way between the factory marks. But mine is 2" less than that. I think I put in 12 quarts overall.
ali
When you change the oil you need to disconnect the oil line from the oil cooler to drain the pipes and the radiator. The lines must be an inch or more ID. Lots of oil there. The instructions for refilling are to add 8 qts first then run the engine and warm things up. You then check and add a quart at a time until you are half way between the factory marks. But mine is 2" less than that. I think I put in 12 quarts overall.
ali
You have brass balls... That stick now has permenant proof that you screwed with the OE oil level designation. From what I gather you have plenty of $$$ and really could care less about a warranty claim on your car. I can see it now, "Sir, your warranty has been voided, your engine damage was caused by improper oil level".
Or maybe they would just push it through? IDK, but if it was me I would have just left well enough alone.
BTW, why in gods name are you changing your own oil? I just can't see the reasoning behind any of this at all. Its like you have a need to screw with something you shouldn't even be concerned with.. Just drive the **** thing and take it in for an oil change when its due. While your at the dealership waiting, you can pick out your next car.
Man, if I only had a disposable income like you... The things I would do..
Or maybe they would just push it through? IDK, but if it was me I would have just left well enough alone.
BTW, why in gods name are you changing your own oil? I just can't see the reasoning behind any of this at all. Its like you have a need to screw with something you shouldn't even be concerned with.. Just drive the **** thing and take it in for an oil change when its due. While your at the dealership waiting, you can pick out your next car.
Man, if I only had a disposable income like you... The things I would do..
You have a nice car collection mate
High revving engines use small piston/oil rings with low outwards tension to reduce friction, increase horsepower, reduce fuel economy.
These days this technique is also used in a lot of cars just because of the marginal fuel saving for emissions (while burning more oil so i dont think its cleaner but at least in the books it is)
Old f1 used to burn several quarts in 200 300km race.
The oil consumption is just part of how the engine was designed, its the same with a lot of bmw 6 cyl engines, they always consume some oil. I've read many threads of people rebuilding the engine to try and solve this but i never read a story of anybody actually achieving zero oil consumption so its a waste of time because its just designed that way.
High revving engines use small piston/oil rings with low outwards tension to reduce friction, increase horsepower, reduce fuel economy.
These days this technique is also used in a lot of cars just because of the marginal fuel saving for emissions (while burning more oil so i dont think its cleaner but at least in the books it is)
Old f1 used to burn several quarts in 200 300km race.
The oil consumption is just part of how the engine was designed, its the same with a lot of bmw 6 cyl engines, they always consume some oil. I've read many threads of people rebuilding the engine to try and solve this but i never read a story of anybody actually achieving zero oil consumption so its a waste of time because its just designed that way.
It's a dry sump car. As long as there is oil in the tank he is fine.
There is some precident to factory oil levels being too high in performance cars. After years of smoking 996 Carreras, Porsche revised the oil service quantity and a new dipstick was installed. With 1L less oil than originally specified the problem is much less, with 1.5L less than original max the problem basically disappears. 1.5L low from factory is dead middle on the new dipstick.
With any engine that consumes, I typically let it consume to see if it stops at a certain level - often it does, for one reason or another.
And if the consumption slows or stops and you're only 10-15% below max capacity, why would you top up at all?
He probably enjoys changing the oil himself. Why is that a problem?
Lots of angry envy in you.
without a doubt. It really wasn't meant to be angry, it was more humor a simplification of the situation, say an easy way out this conundrum he's having. My previous post was deleted, where some guy was threatening him and going nuts. I asked dude what got in his twat that made him so fing angry at this guy. Said he was ruining his engine, had his license plate number, and was just being a complete ****. Thats being angry.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
In the context of the fact that you never track your cars, both this modification and oil selection are likely extremely low risk.
Sounds like he has a beta testing program going on with his dealership that knows all about it, so if something blew-up they would probably find a way to cover it.
If the oil consumption was due to it going through the breather tubes, then those tubes and where they eventually go should be completely saturated with oil. Did anyone inspect and verify that?
Where does hose #17 and #26 go to (especially #26)? Either one connected to the intake manifold - ie, does it have a vacuum source on it? ... or not? If so, your intake manifold should be flooded with oil.
From your description, it sounds like the oil level in the tank was about where the red line is.
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That would be amazing if they were doing that, first I've ever heard of that. I'm used to hearing horror stories from dealerships, etc...
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
I have a phenomenal relationship with my dealership, on my old SRT, that was in an accident, they covered stuff out of pocket that Chrysler wouldn't pay for. I suspect the same is the case when you've spent likely what amounts to millions of dollars at one.
My Ferrari always used oil super fast. For this reason, I drove my Cavalier to work for over a decade.
Are we to conclude that the people who designed and manufactured the $400,000 car didn't correctly mark the dipstick and/or dealer(s) (one local or all?) are going to take a huge risk and "adjust" the engine oil level without consulting the manufacturer?
Even IF you are correct and have discovered a problem or an issue, I assume that the directions (TSBs?) would come from the top.
With all due respect, this is a blatantly implausible claim!
btw, I would fire that dealer even if you were correct.
I don't find a minor adjustmement in the level of an oil reservoir on a dry sump system that holds 14 quarts all that risky.
PS You do realize that Dr Haas has a fair amount of credibility?
I do have a very good relationship with both my local Ferrari dealership and with FNA (Ferrari North America). Many years ago FNA gave me the whole Enzo service manual. I gave them some service tips that I discovered, ways to do service in a more simple manor and with only one person as apposed to serveral technicians that the manual said were needed.
I bought a 575M and found that second gear was nearly impossible to engage when the engine was cold (75F). At 200 miles into the ownership of this brand new car I decided to change the gear oil to Redline. This issue was vastly improved. But FNA then happened to call me and offered to put in a new transmission. I told them of the improvement over the Shell recommended gear oil when I used the Redline. They still recommended a transmission change. I refused and said I was going to continue to use the Redline, that we needed some break-in of the transmission. It ended up being just fine and FNA became my good Friend.
Fast forwards to the known issue of oil “consumption” in the 812 Superfast. When I bought the car they actually asked me to look into it. Of those two upper hoses I think one goes into the air intake side of the circuit. The service manager told me that some cars have pooled oil at the top end that gets baked. I would not be surprised if a TSB comes out about this some time soon.
ali
I bought a 575M and found that second gear was nearly impossible to engage when the engine was cold (75F). At 200 miles into the ownership of this brand new car I decided to change the gear oil to Redline. This issue was vastly improved. But FNA then happened to call me and offered to put in a new transmission. I told them of the improvement over the Shell recommended gear oil when I used the Redline. They still recommended a transmission change. I refused and said I was going to continue to use the Redline, that we needed some break-in of the transmission. It ended up being just fine and FNA became my good Friend.
Fast forwards to the known issue of oil “consumption” in the 812 Superfast. When I bought the car they actually asked me to look into it. Of those two upper hoses I think one goes into the air intake side of the circuit. The service manager told me that some cars have pooled oil at the top end that gets baked. I would not be surprised if a TSB comes out about this some time soon.
ali
Exactly, a good regular customer who spends millions is looked after.
I manage a research lab at a big university, about $30M in equipment and 100's of research clients. On average, every year, year after year, I would spend $1M on big equipment. I am a regular customer to certain companies, that have few real customers.
Many times, something has broken too soon, but outside of warranty. If it's my fault or normal, then I take the hit, but if I'm disappointed, I let them know. Very often it's fixed at their expense. Very often it's fixed at their expense even before I have a chance to become disappointed. I like to be happy with the functionality of the lab, and they like me to be happy. A full page advertisement costs a lot more, and has less direct effect on sales.
BTW I still drive an old beater car, my role at work is very separate, everything needs to be very fair and above board.
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I do not always do things the way that the company may recommend. I often find different ways to do things. This is the case with my scuba diving equipment, motor oil, model airplane construction, gardening, HAM radio and high end audio equipment to mention a few. Often I work with the engineers within the companies, it’s not done blindly as some have suggested. Some of the hurricane protection measures on my house were reengineered by the responsible engineer when I pointed out involved characteristics. My A/C system is different than what others are using...
Of those who know me these are known as the Haas Product Improvements.
Here is something I did almost immediately upon taking possession of my new Ferrari. I cut the huge under cover panel that was almost the length of the car. It was very hard to remove by a single person. They lose some of the dozen different types of fasteners every time they just change the oil. Now you can just remove the middle third of the panel to change the oil. The dealership did not tell me I voided the warrantee, they did not complain, they praised the effort and said they would tell Ferrari of the convenience of smaller panel segments. Likely the photos I sent to my dealer were relayed to Maranello.
ali
Of those who know me these are known as the Haas Product Improvements.
Here is something I did almost immediately upon taking possession of my new Ferrari. I cut the huge under cover panel that was almost the length of the car. It was very hard to remove by a single person. They lose some of the dozen different types of fasteners every time they just change the oil. Now you can just remove the middle third of the panel to change the oil. The dealership did not tell me I voided the warrantee, they did not complain, they praised the effort and said they would tell Ferrari of the convenience of smaller panel segments. Likely the photos I sent to my dealer were relayed to Maranello.
ali
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