Ferrari 812 Superfast Oil Consumption

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1,401
Location
Sarasota, Florida
These cars have been out for 3 years and it seems many are reporting up to 3 quarts of oil usage per 1,000 miles. This is “normal” according to the owners manual. The engine is an 800 HP V12 running up to 9,000 RPM. No turbo, naturally aspirated. It uses a 5W-40 and the manual states that one should not run high RPM until the engine oil gets above 160F.

I had one of the original Ford Expedition SUVs from new to 45,000 miles until I traded it in. It was the only vehicle I ever owned that consumed oil. From day one until the day I parted with that truck it used the same amount of oil. It was around a quart per 1,000 miles. I thought at first the consumption would go down after the engine was fully broken in but it never changed.

I have used grades of 20 to 60 in single engines that never consumed any oil. So I do not think it is an issue of grades.

The current 812SF has 1,300 miles and used 2 quarts in the last 500 miles. The oil in the oil tank (dry sump) is clean, odorless, and there is no smell of the exhaust and no smoke. No leaks underneath. The oil capacity is 14qts. Where is the oil going?? Thoughts??

AEHaas
 
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34,153
Location
Southern NJ
How did you break in the engine? How does the Ferrari state you should break-in the engine?

A lot of folks believe the first 50 miles are crucial for allowing the rings to seat, which often requires a good amount of engine load.
 
Messages
12,152
Location
Colorado Springs
Design of an engine. It is high performance engine, as it gets in civilian vehicle.
You could try different oil as Ferrari uses Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5W40. Try Motul X-Clean, Valvoline 5W40 European Vehicle, Mobil1 5W40 etc.
Does it have FIAT approval number?
 
Messages
402
Location
WA
thin 5w oil spread out over a vast v-12 valvetrain, it's probably a miracle it only gobbles one quart per 1k.
I assume it's got four valves per cylinder, that's a lot of valve guides too. 24 intake valve guides with a ton of suction.
 
Messages
2,812
Location
Illinois, U.S.A
You and Caterham should work on another special blend.

It’s a high revving V12, I’m sure the oil is getting stretched every direction imaginable.

What spec is it calling for?
 
Messages
80
You may laugh but what you need is a tight 20W50. A tight 20W40, which I once could have thrown together in the lab, would be better but sadly you can't buy these commercially. Ideally, what you really need is a PAO/Ester based 20W50 (or 20W40) but no one has had the good sense to make one available, even to rich folks that can afford a Ferrari. Your supercar won't generate as much power or go as fast but it might just stop you buggering up your engine.
 
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772
Location
98245
Sounds like a car engine designed for aircraft type loads: running at a significant % of its rated power. And like aircraft engines, individually hand built, run-in and dyno tested before delivery. (note: run-in is not the same as break-in). Unlike most car engines, whose duty cycle is 25% or less of rated power. Such a high performance engine probably requires aircraft-like break-in procedures: run it at high pressures to promote ring/cylinder seating, but don't let it get too hot when doing so. So, short runs at 75% or more throttle, then upshift and drive easy for a bit to let it cool, then repeat.

Pure speculation on my part, but I am curious what Ferrari recommends for break-in. Because with that kind of money on the line, do whatever the factory recommends. Then if it isn't right, it's their problem not yours.
 
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5,379
Location
down in the park
You may laugh but what you need is a tight 20W50. A tight 20W40, which I once could have thrown together in the lab, would be better but sadly you can't buy these commercially. Ideally, what you really need is a PAO/Ester based 20W50 (or 20W40) but no one has had the good sense to make one available, even to rich folks that can afford a Ferrari. Your supercar won't generate as much power or go as fast but it might just stop you buggering up your engine.
 

AEHaas

Thread starter
Messages
1,401
Location
Sarasota, Florida
“How did you break in the engine? How does the Ferrari state you should break-in the engine?
A lot of folks believe the first 50 miles are crucial for allowing the rings to seat, which often requires a good amount of engine load.”

I just picked up the car with 800mi on it already. When I was ready to custom order the car, they quit production of the hard top for the convertable. I had to settle for a “pre-owned” car. The break in period is sort of described like any other car but I do know that the factory runs these engines hard on the bench before they are installed on the car.

I am not sure what oil is in the engine. The owners manual states to use Shell Helix Ultra 5W40 but the USA shop service manual says to use Pennzoil Platinum 5W40.

The Enzo used no oil. It was run with 20 - 30 - 60 grades of oil. Of course it only had 650 ponies.

I really am stumped.

AEHaas
 
Messages
4,379
Location
MS
How did you break in the engine? How does the Ferrari state you should break-in the engine?

A lot of folks believe the first 50 miles are crucial for allowing the rings to seat, which often requires a good amount of engine load.
That really depends on ring material and final cylinder hone finish. With a harder ring material and smoother cylinder wall initial break-in will be more critical and you’ll need to apply cylinder pressure before the surface glazes.
Most really hard rings will get some sort of PVD face coating to assist in break-in.
There really numerous variables to consider, that’s why its usually a good idea to just follow to OEM break in procedure or listen your your builder.
 
Messages
4,379
Location
MS
These cars have been out for 3 years and it seems many are reporting up to 3 quarts of oil usage per 1,000 miles. This is “normal” according to the owners manual. The engine is an 800 HP V12 running up to 9,000 RPM. No turbo, naturally aspirated. It uses a 5W-40 and the manual states that one should not run high RPM until the engine oil gets above 160F.

I had one of the original Ford Expedition SUVs from new to 45,000 miles until I traded it in. It was the only vehicle I ever owned that consumed oil. From day one until the day I parted with that truck it used the same amount of oil. It was around a quart per 1,000 miles. I thought at first the consumption would go down after the engine was fully broken in but it never changed.

I have used grades of 20 to 60 in single engines that never consumed any oil. So I do not think it is an issue of grades.

The current 812SF has 1,300 miles and used 2 quarts in the last 500 miles. The oil in the oil tank (dry sump) is clean, odorless, and there is no smell of the exhaust and no smoke. No leaks underneath. The oil capacity is 14qts. Where is the oil going?? Thoughts??

AEHaas

Is it seeing 9000 rpm often? Is there any correlation with high rpm usage and oil consumption?

Does it still use oil if engine RPMs are kept below 3000 rpm for instance?
Depending on whether the oil is getting past the rings or the valve stems a thicker oil could actually increase oil consumption.
 
Messages
829
Location
United States
what’s the warranty experience?

have other owners lost engines and how did the dealers carry out inspections, uoa or any attempts at blocking warranty repair?

the price of oil top up is insignificant compared to an out of warranty repair
 
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